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  1. #21
    Member s0532's Avatar
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    I wonder if type consciousness is more important to INTPs in particular- are the recurrent stories of increased self-acceptance peculiar to them?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by s0532 View Post
    I wonder if type consciousness is more important to INTPs in particular- are the recurrent stories of increased self-acceptance peculiar to them?
    My theory: INTPs (and similar types) are at odds with the general character of most society. Maybe only the T is generally accepted. Hell, look at job listings: they want people-persons that are detail-oriented and organized. Screw that!

    INFPs probably have it worse.

  3. #23
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I think I felt more accepting of myself. It made sense why I didn't really fit.

    Now that I recognize that, for all practical purposes, I am the freak, I try to humor the non-freaks when it doesn't take inordinate amounts of energy to do so. I mean, I'm pretty normal for my type, but my type is relatively rare and people don't really know what to do with us, so sometimes I'm just going to get looks like I just sprouted four additional heads. *shrug*

    I've come to the decision that I like myself and that I would be my friend if I were me. Most of the people that actually get to know me like me, too. People that don't I pretty much just write off.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  4. #24
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s0532 View Post
    I wonder if type consciousness is more important to INTPs in particular- are the recurrent stories of increased self-acceptance peculiar to them?
    There is also the history for this context. This forum's pre-history focused primarily on INTP = belonging, whereas other types not so much. E's have been criticized regularly, S's most of all, F's to some degree, and J's every now and again. It's the stereotyping when people presume to know what (and if) a person's values are, what their mind is capable of, and the degree of emotion they must be feeling, that MBTI starts to seem like one step forward, two steps back in understanding people.

    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    My theory: INTPs (and similar types) are at odds with the general character of most society. Maybe only the T is generally accepted. Hell, look at job listings: they want people-persons that are detail-oriented and organized. Screw that!

    INFPs probably have it worse.
    INTPs have some ability with detail, and are generally easy-going, but do prefer to avoid people. Martoon is one of the easiest people on the face of the earth to work with. Being detached and easy-going has significant benefits in the work-place. There is some benefit towards extroversion and judging in the work force, however, those taken to an extreme also cause terrible problems. I'd venture to say there are a number of types who have a much greater difficulty adjusting to the work place than INTPs. (It also depends on the type of work) This is especially true with the work force becoming more technical. Just my $.02.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  5. #25
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s0532 View Post
    I wonder if type consciousness is more important to INTPs in particular- are the recurrent stories of increased self-acceptance peculiar to them?
    I wonder also, because very few of the other type groups are very active. Out of intuitives, I notice that ENJs are especially low activity.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Alienclock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    I act more INTP now, because I feel more secure in embracing it. Before I'd suppress it to do the "right" or "practical" thing. When often such things were neither right or practical... at least for me.

    The problem is if you embrace type as an excuse....."
    I generally agree with this. Oddly I feel better knowing that I am not just odd, I am a type... and that there is an explanation... sorta, and there are others like me, sorta.

    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    My theory: INTPs (and similar types) are at odds with the general character of most society. Maybe only the T is generally accepted. Hell, look at job listings: they want people-persons that are detail-oriented and organized. Screw that!

    INFPs probably have it worse.
    Well, sorta. Probably male infps have it worse, then again, perhaps being accepted by society is vastly overrated.

    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    To the great dismay of those who especially desire to be a robot, there is no getting around the fact they their brains contain[....] "the two structures in the brain mainly responsible for long-term remembering are located in the 'emotional system'." ... "The frontal lobe is the executive control center of the brain, monitoring higher-order thinking, directing problem solving, and regulating the excesses of the emotional system." David Sousa.

    If a person actually has no emotions it is because the organ that is their brain is not fully functioning. If a person has no control of their emotions, the same is true.
    Darn, there go my hopes! How are the odds of becoming a cyborg? I mean cybernetic augmentation... Its like you are saying an unemotional robot person can't be smart. Its also like saying that thought and emotion are intertwined....
    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    .....This forum's pre-history focused primarily on INTP = belonging, whereas other types not so much. E's have been criticized regularly, S's most of all, F's to some degree, and J's every now and again. It's the stereotyping when people presume to know what (and if) a person's values are, what their mind is capable of, and the degree of emotion they must be feeling, that MBTI starts to seem like one step forward, two steps back in understanding people.
    ... I won't say type consciousness is more important to intps, however, prejudices are part of the human condition and apparently no one is exempt. Its part of wanting to be part of the main, dominant group... Or something. Its just that intps probably are really good at rationalizing things, without realizing it, cause they are very thinking, and not necessarily impressed with the need and use of emotion, so they don't really give much weight to the emotional issues that would keep an infp from doing the same thing. I have probably generalized too much.

    Enjs may be less active on a forum because they are E, (they reach out and touch more without the net) and are out there meeting deadlines with their J. I don't know.

    ps. I am INFP.

  7. #27
    Member s0532's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    My theory: INTPs (and similar types) are at odds with the general character of most society. Maybe only the T is generally accepted. Hell, look at job listings: they want people-persons that are detail-oriented and organized. Screw that!

    INFPs probably have it worse.
    Right, and aside from the misfit experience, many of us also seem to share the fuckup and existential angst conundrums.

    And yes, I was hoping to hear from INFPs and others on this. I'm curious to hear about how type awareness affects others, how similar or varied the interests in mbti.

    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    There is also the history for this context.
    Right, and I suspect there are reasons why INTPs were the type to come together with enough momentum to make an mbti type-oriented forum take off.

    And yes, I'd agree mbti theory is often misinterpreted/ misapplied toward unproductive stereotyping.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Tayshaun's Avatar
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    One of the consequences of type consciousness is a repeated pattern in my thought streams.

    The broken record sample is the following:

    [Trivial event takes place]

    "That was typical INTP behavior!" ejaculates voice#1.
    "Are you sure? Questions skeptical voice#2
    "Bear in mind voice#2, that you can never be sure of anything." Voice#1 feels good repeating the saying he has brooded over thousands of times since his obsession for clarity took shape before his teenage years. This was often the conclusion of other dialogs and this remembered generic wisdom soothes him.

    "This itself was an INTP comment and the thinking process which lead to it as well!" accuses mischievous voice#2. At this point voice#1, trapped in the loop, but secretly proud of voice#2's ingenuity, can only concede. To get out of the loop he directs the conversation to more fertile grounds:

    "We are taking MBTI too seriously. Trying to figure out whether our behavior is in accord with what could be predicted from the function dynamics of the INTP role the same way one solves a puzzle is one thing; but there is an underlying perverted element of search for a Code of Living from the model that gives it a too strong and illegitimate authority."

    Voice#2 intervenes, but instead of sabotage by spiraling it all back to the loop, he decides to play Mr. Safe, and full of condescension recites:

    "Everybody is prejudiced in one way or the other. Fitting items in abstract boxes is cognitive, the brain works that way. It cannot be helped, it is instinctive. MBTI provides a very attractive model and you should not be ashamed of your desire to classify the unclassifiable. Rather, you should always remember that temperament, functions, roles are concepts that can maybe help you deal with your environment and cope with your existential angst, but they are too vague and unreliable to provide satisfactory answers. They remain abstract tools which will never take into account the infinity of parameters required to give a good approximation in the real world. Play around with the models, dwell in the depths of theory and speculation but never accept to give in to the temptation of explaining everything and adhering body and soul. Do not succumb to the charm of promised miraculous understanding at your fingertips."


    I accuse type consciousness of bringing this noisy chitchat in my mind and especially the loop part.


  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by s0532 View Post
    What kinds of effects have learning about MBTI and identifying with a type had on you?

    I've been thinking lately that I believe I behave more INTP now than I did when I was younger. Could be due to many reasons, lots of transitions in the past few years, but I would say the simplest explanation is probably type awareness.

    Seems like a good idea to take stock, every now and then, of how type consciousness might impact one's behavior.
    I had hoped to find something in personality theory, but I'm not sure I did.

    Okay, that's unfair. I was introduced to the idea that the gamut of types is a Good Thing(TM), and was further convinced by the notion it's good/okay/aceptable/excusable to operate by how you want to be.

    Unfortunately, the flaws and shortcomings of type theory outweigh the above. MBTT doesn't begin to explain a lot of how I am, or it merely addresses it in an overly simplistic manner. This is especially apparent when I try to 'type' others and then have them subsequently shatter my inane characterization of their nature - as it should be shattered - by acting naturally in ways they're 'not supposed to'.

    (This may reflect only on my expecting too much from MBTT)

    Now when it type others, it's usually only in the sense of which quadra they fall into, or which functions are glaringly apparent - i.e. an extraverted feeler versus an introverted thinker - and then I leave it at that.

  10. #30
    Member s0532's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundowning View Post
    I had hoped to find something in personality theory, but I'm not sure I did.

    Okay, that's unfair. I was introduced to the idea that the gamut of types is a Good Thing(TM), and was further convinced by the notion it's good/okay/aceptable/excusable to operate by how you want to be.

    Unfortunately, the flaws and shortcomings of type theory outweigh the above. MBTT doesn't begin to explain a lot of how I am, or it merely addresses it in an overly simplistic manner. This is especially apparent when I try to 'type' others and then have them subsequently shatter my inane characterization of their nature - as it should be shattered - by acting naturally in ways they're 'not supposed to'.

    (This may reflect only on my expecting too much from MBTT)

    Now when it type others, it's usually only in the sense of which quadra they fall into, or which functions are glaringly apparent - i.e. an extraverted feeler versus an introverted thinker - and then I leave it at that.
    This is an interesting post. Is it fair to say MBTI would be more interesting/ appealing to you if type parameters held more consistently- say, if the specifics of type profiles held truer to personal experience? I'm wondering if Ns are bound to be more vested in MBTI insofar as it seems inherently concerned with abstract and generalized patterns.

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