User Tag List

Results 1 to 7 of 7

  1. #1
    deleted
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    1,946

    Lightbulb Four subclasses of NT, four subclasses of NF, etc.

    This is just something I thought up from experience:

    I'll quickly explain the premise. I know some of us here are into MBTI/Socionics as it is, though I was thinking of a clearer categorization for people, that deals with the fact that all four types within a quadra have the same values and get along the best, but all four come from different sets of strengths: namely the reknown NT, NF, ST and SF stereotypical clubs that I think many of us see a clear delineation in. Ie. in theory there would no longer be two types of NTs, but four types of NTs, + four types of NFs, four types of STs, and four types of SFs, and they each differ in emphasis and cognition and each value things more similar to their quadra, each according member of the other three clubs. If you're NT you still have their behavior and strength overall, you just aren't typical "NT" anymore and you belong to your own unique subclass of NT. Or your own unique subclass of NF, etc.

    This idea would seem to fit people in real life pretty well, and if we were to have a good set of descriptions per each "club" and each "quadra" then we could make further observations about the four different club members, and each different quadra member. This theory revolves around the realization that you have values in common with people of all four clubs, and given the correct outlook as to what those values are, these ideas may be implemented closer to the 16 types as they are, but more than that, they can seriously be taken to form something twice as intricate about personality types than what we know now, and all from the same mental practices we're familiar with.

    Instead of necessarily saying there's already an NT Beta type, which leads one to think of where there is an NT Delta type, etc, perhaps the best way to construct this is to look at NT types as a whole, and from there begin to acknowledge four various subclasses of NTs we may begin to clarify. The quadra emphasis comes after the fact of making these observations along with some usual quadra observations, but there is twice as much room now to allow for more conceptualization besides the 8 information elements alone. One must think ie. if one were a subclass of NT, wouldn't one's ego functions differ to some extent from the other three?

    The advantage of using any forum to construct some observations is that everyone makes these observations already, that within a club of NT types, as well as the other clubs, it often seems like there are more than two value-sets going on, and one cannot expect to relate well to half of the people in their club than they can as much one-fourth of them. The "quadra" emphasis needs not to be as obvious as the differentiation within each club, but only be an after affect which appears to place four type values in alignment. So perhaps noting the stark color difference within each club is the most important aspect of the graph.

    The organization of it would look like this: (without necessarily the old quadra names, but quadras that fit nonetheless)



    There are four main Socionics and MBTI dichotomies. Two of these, N/S and T/F, when combined form one of the two "four-preference" dichotomies used in this theory called the "club" (the other being "quadra.") Here are some possible short-descriptions of the four clubs (taken from an old test):

    The Pragmatist (ST) - His focus is on productivity, function, achievement, efficiency, effecting change, building, engineering, business, and/or acquiring power. He's pragmatic and seeks to improve his individual position.
    Pragmatists (STs) share more in common with Researchers (NTs) and Socials (SFs) and have the least common with Humanitarians (NFs).

    The Social (SF) - He cares about people, making connections with them, and interpersonal interactions. He often enjoys hosting and going to parties, gossip, familial interaction, and other types of activities that value or emphasize socialization.
    Socials (SFs) share more in common with Humanitarians (NFs) and Pragmatists (STs) and have the least in common with Researchers (NTs).

    The Humanitarian (NF) - His focus is on the greater societal needs and problems; often has interests in philosophy, art, psychology, sociology, and/or politics. He's humanitarian and seeks to improve society.
    Humanitarians (NFs) share more in common with Socials (SFs) and Researchers (NTs) and have the least in common with Pragmatists (STs).

    The Researcher (NT) - His focus is on researching areas of interest. He often puts much thought and time into an area of interest, finding information on the topic, making conclusions and deductions, and then presenting these plans, hypothesis, theories, and predictions. He values understanding and knowledge with less emphasis on either his personal benefit or society's.
    Researchers (NTs) share more in common with Pragmatists (STs) and Humanitarians (NFs) and have the least in common with Socials (SFs).


    As far as what quadras can divide these further up, even at their individual level, is still in question, though it may easily be the quadras described within Socionics (if not something better).


    So the idea essentially takes the NTs, for instance, and looks at the unique differences within them, and instead of grouping ENTPs and INTPs together with simple differences in introversion and extroversion and their given correlations, it ignores these types and sees four unique types that are different from one another: xNTx 1 is simlar to xNTx 2 is simlar to xNTx 3 is simlar to xNTx 4 is simlar to xNTx 1.

    One might have more introverted tendencies on average, or more P tendencies, who knows (just how N types have more P tendencies on average; it's all correlation) but we try to arrive closer to the essence of personality.


    So what observations can you make about four unique types within your club, from your experience?

  2. #2
    Intergalactic Badass mujigay's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    1w9
    Posts
    532

    Default

    For what it's worth, I've always looked at each temperament as having four different subtypes anyway.
    1w9 sx/sp
    A little song, a little dance, a little seltzer down your pants.

    All that is gold does not glitter
    Not all those who wander are lost

  3. #3

    Default

    tl;dr

    but the first paragraph is exactly the way I approach MBTI anyway. I don't put nearly as much weight on P/J as I do N/T/F/S when typing people. I just find it naturally more logical I guess, as a lack of way of explaining my Ni. I break people down into NT/NF/ST/SF also.

  4. #4
    deleted
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    1,946

    Default

    @LaconicSesquipedalia

    When you look at the introverted functions outside of the context of preferences P and J and such, they seem to make a lot more sense. I know lots of people who test IP but they don't have a strong sense of introverted judgment, they rely a lot on Ni, as though their P traits leak through that they don't like controlling their second function as much. I'm similar I think I have a lot of P traits like exploring ideas, in my head a lot, but I'm also pretty introverted. "Making decisions" doesn't seem like much of a force in my life as does "getting inspiration" from my N function, and so winding through my mind's impressions and imagination I can come to new avenues externally. Some INTJ stereotypes maybe from Keirsey pin them as active, always having clear cold judgments and decisions ready--I think sometimes that fits more Te primary ENTJs who type introverted because their social skills lack, but I've always seen INTJ as more Ni > Te, you can notice the N >> T > F >> S in their function strength. Even INTPs having more detached judgments accessible fit this inherent T > N as well, like Daria and L from Death Note, even if their actual personality is not always equal, you still get a good constant sense of Ti.

    I still think we have some good type examples of INTJs on this forum from famous threads, fictional characters like recently Light from Death Note, as a more 1w9 INTJ, and Walter White and Gus from Breaking Bad as INTJ. (These are all the people were mentioned recently in threads, so sorry they're fictional and seem more interesting.) So I don't think people's function understanding really lacks, moreso than just there are some clashing stereotypes. This type of exercise of noticing various types of NT might help to alleviate some differences we see.

  5. #5

    Default

    Honestly, I don't even get that deep into typing others. I generally just type them by each of the individual preferences, leaving I/E to just its own preference, not influencing my view on the cognitive functions.

  6. #6
    deleted
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    1,946

    Default

    I use preferences too, but only secondary to functions. I don't type deeply either I have an efficient system and go by my hunch.

    I might start organizing my typings on a list.

  7. #7

    Default

    that would be good, that way you could let others analyze your typing and then improve on it.

Similar Threads

  1. Shoud the N types be classified as NP and NJ instead of NF and NT?
    By Cat Brainz in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 12-14-2016, 05:37 PM
  2. [NF] Mothers of NF's
    By Phantonym in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 53
    Last Post: 11-15-2010, 12:48 AM
  3. Replies: 144
    Last Post: 08-29-2009, 01:39 AM
  4. NTs understanding of NFs and vice - versa
    By Gauche in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 32
    Last Post: 03-02-2009, 12:41 PM
  5. [NF] If you've ever wondered what a world of NFs would be like...
    By wwbeachbum161 in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 10-13-2008, 09:13 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO