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Dario Nardi's Neuroscience of Personality

highlander

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Maybe this has already been said and I missed it. But I think it would be interesting to do a larger scale experiment with more people... and see if you can identify the person's type based on their brain scans.

Agree this would be very interesting. MBTI doesn't seem to be recognlzed by the formal academic or psychology community. Eventually, I think this will change. This could provide some kind of proof.
 

INTP

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Agree this would be very interesting. MBTI doesn't seem to be recognlzed by the formal academic or psychology community. Eventually, I think this will change. This could provide some kind of proof.

MBTI and jungs typology was briefly mentioned on one of my 'personality psychology 1' lectures, but they did say that big 5 has more research to validate it etc, so its used more nowadays. they pretty much only told the basics and there was only like one or two slides to both jungs typology and MBTI. on top of that the lecturer said that sensing and thinking were the rational functions and feeling and intuition the irrational :/ , had to correct him after the class ofc, and he "meant to fix that mistake on the slide".

i think its not that MBTI isnt recognized by the academia, its just that they think that big 5 does the same job, but has more proof to back it up, so its used instead. personally i think that MBTI has much more to offer than big 5 does in some areas, big 5 is bit like meh, even tho it might tell you how extroverted you are etc, it doesent really have that "wtf has someone been following me and taking notes about my daily life" effect that MBTI has, also big 5 is pretty much nothing but scales about you, and there isnt much use to scales without any more in depth understanding about what the scales represent, like which jungs typology offers.

oh and this research that nardi has done so far is no where convincing to academia, especially compared to tens of thousands of big 5 studies(which satisfy the academia) ranging from neuro- to social psychology :/
 

INTP

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It was a joke for Salome. Since she mentioned that for us to argue I would have to say something she would disagree with first. ;)

i know, i was just trying to show the correct way to win the argument
 
A

Anew Leaf

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Agree this would be very interesting. MBTI doesn't seem to be recognlzed by the formal academic or psychology community. Eventually, I think this will change. This could provide some kind of proof.

Maybe we should do the experiment here!! PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: EVERYONE GET YOUR BRAIN SCANNED!!!
 

Cellmold

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Maybe we should do the experiment here!! PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: EVERYONE GET YOUR BRAIN SCANNED!!!

Ive wanted to, but I have no idea who to ask or how to legitimately get someone to go along with the notion of a brain scan without any illness.
 

Folderol

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I'm dying to get this book and digest it head to toe. This is rare for me because books rarely hold my attention. I honestly hate reading for entertainment when it's really long.

I don't know if this post is allowed or not, but what looks to be the cheapest place to get it? It's not sold at many places, and it seems to be $24.95 each time. I was hoping to get a deal! Another thing is it seems there is no digital version available. I don't have an eBook reader, but I would prefer to read things on my computer.
 

Folderol

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Maybe we should do the experiment here!! PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: EVERYONE GET YOUR BRAIN SCANNED!!!

Did you know the brain mappings Nardi did involved injecting stuff into the subject's scalps first? I don't want to deal with needles! It was necessary too, to amplify the electrical signals in the brain to get more accurate results. And he didn't even probe stuff deeper in the brain. Imagine the pain (or huge needles) needed for that! Actually, I don't want to imagine!

Ive wanted to, but I have no idea who to ask or how to legitimately get someone to go along with the notion of a brain scan without any illness.

Did you watch the video on youtube where he talks about it? Being as he's a professor, somewhere (California? You can look it up), I would say maybe try to volunteer yourself as a human test subject for any of his further experiments. It's obvious he'll be going in the direction of MBTI regardless. Another way is what if you appeal to the doctor's intellectual side? You could also just tell that it's your money and you are curious (shut up and take my money).
 

INTP

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Did you know the brain mappings Nardi did involved injecting stuff into the subject's scalps first? I don't want to deal with needles! It was necessary too, to amplify the electrical signals in the brain to get more accurate results. And he didn't even probe stuff deeper in the brain. Imagine the pain (or huge needles) needed for that!

Its just some shit on your head so that electric signals from your brains would be transferred to the sensors better, its not injected inside the skull or anything like that.. The same thing was done with pouring water on the head, but i think they use some other solution nowadays since water tends to dry out faster that other stuff that does the same job.
 

Salomé

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Dario Nardi is clearly the most brilliant and insightful individual to ever lift the lack of clarity on typology since it's creation.
Now you're trying too hard.

I wasn't being serious, I was trying to be tongue-in-cheek - joke fail on my part. :laugh:
It seems to be a common misunderstanding of the type that we disregard data.
Actually, we hoard it. And we examine enough of it to know that all that glitters is not gold.

I do think there's enough in there to spark further examination, do you not agree?
I don't know. I'm still in the dark. I was hoping Seymour would shed some light, but he appears disinclined to do so. :shrug:
I do think it's false advertising to call this "neuroscience".
There are so many problems with Nardi's work. It would be great if a genuine neuroscientist, (or just someone with a bit of rigour) repeated it. But that's unlikely to happen.
 

Standuble

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I can't believe I did not hear about this sooner. I guess the rock I crawled out from has soundproofing. Here I was spouting off Thomson's work and this seems much more specialised.
 

OrangeAppled

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Did you know the brain mappings Nardi did involved injecting stuff into the subject's scalps first? I don't want to deal with needles! It was necessary too, to amplify the electrical signals in the brain to get more accurate results. And he didn't even probe stuff deeper in the brain. Imagine the pain (or huge needles) needed for that! Actually, I don't want to imagine!

Did you watch the video on youtube where he talks about it? Being as he's a professor, somewhere (California? You can look it up), I would say maybe try to volunteer yourself as a human test subject for any of his further experiments. It's obvious he'll be going in the direction of MBTI regardless. Another way is what if you appeal to the doctor's intellectual side? You could also just tell that it's your money and you are curious (shut up and take my money).

I need to start stalking Dario Nardi.... I am SO dying to have my brain scanned. Having a needle stuck deep into my brain sounds like something I might like also.

I can't believe this study has so few people considering the size of the "MBTI community"; I imagine many of us would love to be a part of something like that. Unless people DID have to pay for a course or something (his "workshops" are ridiculous.... around $1300 for 3 days! :shock: ).
 

Salomé

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^MBTI isn't science. It's a money-making racket. His sample wasn't tiny because he couldn't find enough volunteers, it's because he had to spend a couple of hours with each person. And too much of that might cut into his "lecture circuit" time.
I wonder how much Google paid him to tell them nothing they didn't already know?
 

Folderol

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I need to start stalking Dario Nardi.... I am SO dying to have my brain scanned. Having a needle stuck deep into my brain sounds like something I might like also.

I can't believe this study has so few people considering the size of the "MBTI community"; I imagine many of us would love to be a part of something like that. Unless people DID have to pay for a course or something (his "workshops" are ridiculous.... around $1300 for 3 days! :shock: ).

It wasn't really scanned, it was with electrodes attached to their head and then he interpreted and averaged the results he got. I know what you mean though. And as he said in the video, if he is going to be drawing conclusions from typology, then those types better be correct (or as correct as possible). This means that all of the subjects went deep into typology and were sure of their type. This probably included more than just reading shit on the internet LOL (though one could make a devil's advocate case for it pretty easily). Also, we need to remember that all of his test subjects had to be physically present, in order to do his tests. Plus he needed to make sure that they were sure as well in some way to verify the first point I said. Perhaps he would have liked to expand the pool size, but that was a consideration. Another thing is data consistency - if he looks for more subjects, I would assume he would like to mirror that in all areas (not like "Well I am testing 6 INTPs, meanwhile the rest of the types get only "3 or "I have 4 ESTP, 6 INFJ, 7 INTJ", etc) - with this in mind, it means that he cannot simply add ONE subject to the test. He would at a minimum need to add 16! Multiples of 16! And when you consider that analyzing all of the data took a long time to begin with that is nuts.

Like all colleges, workshops, etc that are extremely expensive, my opinion is you are not paying for knowledge, you are paying for the time to interact with somebody knowledgeable, especially in the physical realm taking place in (prestigious place or whatnot and the reputation it holds > this can transfer to the person speaking putting them in higher esteem). I see it akin to designer clothing (REAL designer clothing, not oh these jeans have a name I don't recognize and are more expensive than other things, therefore they are brand name].

^MBTI isn't science. It's a money-making racket. His sample wasn't tiny because he couldn't find enough volunteers, it's because he had to spend a couple of hours with each person. And too much of that might cut into his "lecture circuit" time.
I wonder how much Google paid him to tell them nothing they didn't already know?
Daaaaaaaamn you are cynical. Gimme a break. First of all, where did you find evidence of his "lecture circuit" attitude? I want specifics. If you have them then I might change my opinion on the spot. So far I didn't see it as that though. I will give you that the one where he talks about the book referenced in this subject's title is a bit of an ad/self promotion, but how else can he talk about something he has done/his own area of expertise without it being that at all? See, I see the expensive lectures as a kind of service... he knows some people might want to pay for it regardless of cost, and he knows he needs money to run tests, so why not give out classes? (even if it's not what he would prefer to do). (And on a side note, what do you see that kind of reasoning as, the previous sentence? They feel like it's Fi, "I can see how it would make sense with what I value, like how I can explain it into a system that I would value, and how that would translate to somebody else still, therefore it may be true", but at the same time, I think I am more of an INTP because that kind of logic seems idealized "x, y, and z are true (assuming a perfect universe and ideal conditions). I just cannot distill it further between the two - I'll probably make a separate topic on that though, but about this one instance, fi you want to reply anyways you can just PM me)
 

Jaguar

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Daaaaaaaamn you are cynical. Gimme a break. First of all, where did you find evidence of his "lecture circuit" attitude? I want specifics. If you have them then I might change my opinion on the spot. So far I didn't see it as that though.

Salomé did not use the word "attitude," she used the word "time."
Read her sentence. Again.

Salomé said:
And too much of that might cut into his "lecture circuit" time.
 

JAVO

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Initial thoughts

Interesting research! I haven't read the book or even listened to the talk yet, but glancing over his slides, it looks very intriguing.

At first glance, a few things stand out, which are mostly effects of low budget and little experience and training with EEG.

1. Skull caps appear to have been used. They're easier to use, but the results obtained are not as accurate or precise as when the electrodes are placed individually on the scalp.

2. It's good that he used the standard 10-20 electrode configuration, but he really needs more electrodes since his focus is localizing signals in the brain. These also help eliminate signal artifacts from things like eye movement.

3. Since I haven't dug into the details yet, I'm not sure what montage (electrode comparison method) was used. I assume it was some type of average reference, but a Laplacian montage seems like it would be more suited for his location-related research. (But the minimal number of electrodes used makes that challenging.)

4. I hope the software he used was able to somewhat filter out eye movement artifacts, otherwise we might be seeing a correlation of type functions with certain less obvious eye movements in the Fp electrodes. (Using more electrodes would help with this too.)
 

Folderol

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Salomé did not use the word "attitude," she used the word "time."
Read her sentence. Again.
I read it fully the first time. I got the impression that she said he was most concerned with expensive running lectures from non science to make money. Given that it's about money then, what about his attitude (way he presents himself, something you say/read), points to the fact that he does lots of lectures?
 

Jaguar

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I read it fully the first time.

Then you chose to purposely misquote and demand something from her you are not entitled to.
Go do your own research on Nardi. It's not anyone's job to do yours.
 
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