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  1. #51
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    It seems like ENFP is being suggested purely by generalized behaviors. Again, its the dom. Ne, the Get Things Going Interaction Style, and the tertiary Fe (plus personal background) that might produce all of this as well.
    Another big clue I had glossed over:
    To me logic is the greatest instrument for determining actions that will ultimately help people in the long run
    This is the Parent complex. Parent (auxiliary) Ti. If it were tertiary, it would probably not be so much about helping people. And if extraverted, it would be more externally focused (probably not so much "to me..."; it would be more about what the external situation dictates).
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

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  2. #52
    Senior Member StrawMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    @ChrisC99: You sure use a lot of [fluffy] words to make a simple point. I vote ENFP for you.
    I second that.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisC99
    absolutely gushing sentiment, annoying people with over-the-top enthusiasm and sticking my nose in 'counseling' them (whether they ask for it or not!);
    Sounds like ENFP. Although some over-the-top enthusiasm may be seen in ENTPs also.

  3. #53
    Senior Member Spurgeon's Avatar
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    I agree with those who said ENTP, for the same reasons they cited. They all had to do with your reasoning process.

    The arguments for ENFP were downright silly. They focused on irrelevant things like your being emotional and using "fluffy" language.

  4. #54
    Tier 1 Member LunaLuminosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    It seems like ENFP is being suggested purely by generalized behaviors. Again, its the dom. Ne, the Get Things Going Interaction Style, and the tertiary Fe (plus personal background) that might produce all of this as well.
    It could...

    Another big clue I had glossed over:
    This is the Parent complex. Parent (auxiliary) Ti. If it were tertiary, it would probably not be so much about helping people. And if extraverted, it would be more externally focused (probably not so much "to me..."; it would be more about what the external situation dictates).
    Ah ok! Missed that part... it does sound aux-Ti'ish.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    I agree with those who said ENTP, for the same reasons they cited. They all had to do with your reasoning process.

    The arguments for ENFP were downright silly. They focused on irrelevant things like your being emotional and using "fluffy" language.
    Yeah, I'm not claiming one way or another yet. I know as well as any.... I get claimed as NF a lot becaue of a sort of "fluffiness" to me but now I'm pretty sure it's just the dom-Ne and silly to blame some serious judging function for it Emotional, yes as far as experiencing emotion is not type-related. But the one point that had me slightly leaning ENFP is how he says he is so comfortable sharing his innermost feelings, and how willing on here he is to describe himself as this sort of gushingly sentimental counselor figure. Actually being able to know, much less express, innermost feeling, is more often a weak point for ENTPs (ime). And I would think it would take a whole lot of Fe development for an ENTP to be fully comfortable with playing the sentimental counselor role. Again, I'm nothing close to decisive on these things but those were the impressions I picked up so far.

    I, for one, like the ENZP type.... leaves things at the essentials and has the added coolness of the letter Z. No need to ask for more

  5. #55
    Member ChrisC99's Avatar
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    WOW! I take off for a few days, and when I come back all this! All this wonderful discussion and insights - it's almost like watching an exciting HORSERACE of psychological extrapolations! "And coming into the lead we have ENTP...no, wait, ENFP is making a run, ENFP is pressing quick into the lead...and oh, ENTP retakes the lead...what a THRILLING race this is, ladies and gentle-psych buffs!" XD (And best of all, it's all about ME! Ha, just kidding...seriously, all of this does help me to learn - and us collectively discuss - more about the types and theory in general ;D)

    ENZP? Why, that definitely has a snazzy ring to it LunaLuminosity - I like it! Sounds like it could be a line right out of the Matrix: "Some think. Some feel. But I...Z!" *Puts sunglasses on* (I know that has nothing whatsoever to do with The Matrix...but just go with it XD)

    Hmm, so you're essentially suggesting that using logic as a personal premise for extrinsic humanitarian motives implies Fe based on Ti. That would seem to be a valid argument - very nice observation there, Eric B!

    Here's another finished paper plate to feed our campfire, though: I was recently reading about the differing way ENTPs versus ENFPs are supposed to act in romantic life. The former is supposedly able to detach from someone very readily once they no longer stimulate them intellectually, and are reputedly hard to get to know as they prefer not to share their innermost feelings readily; in an emotionally trying time they'll try to make a joke instead. I, on the other hand, share ALL of my innermost feelings with somebody within the first 5 minutes; 'wearing my heart on my sleeve' is the phrase people have used to describe my behavior. I smother a love interest with affection right in front of everybody (sometimes to their embarrassment :/)...because, well, shouldn't we? And even though I date a LOT of people, I haven't settled on somebody because I have this very idealized view of 'the one' - someone whose heart will beat in tune with mine like no other, where you can almost hear the music. And while having an intellectual match in somebody would be nice, it's not the most important thing to me. I have a fear of settling with somebody and then leaving them if they don't turn out to be the one (though I admittedly do have a habit of 'leading people on', writing them poetry and wanting to say 'I love you' one moment, and then saying 'no no, I meant let's just be friends!' the next)...and once somebody loses interest in me, even if it's someone who's mistreated me, I have EXTREME difficulty letting go. I'm characteristically 'clingy' in that respect. I wouldn't think any ENTP would be known for these, however prominent (or immature!) their tertiary!

    On the other side of the coin, while I'm asking whether there are any ENTPs with my emotional behavior let me ask this also: are there any ENFPs who display my sort of analytical bent? As has been pointed out, my posts here alone (however stream-of-consciousness and oozing with fluff!) DO seem to reflect a thinking-based way of evaluating questions. BUT, doesn't Te (as one might see in a tertiary-strong ENFP) ALSO by definition move one to systematize their surroundings and use reason to interact with their outside world (or even use a logic-heavy approach when giving somebody counsel, for example)? Or would that kind of analyzing almost invariably derive from the intraverted thinking function? Alternatively, could Ne-dominance alone account for that analytical nature?

  6. #56
    Member ChrisC99's Avatar
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    OH! One last thing: I'm not a perfectionist. I don't give a hoot if people pronounce or spell a word incorrectly or what have you...while I believe in logic as an instrument to solve the world's problems, I just don't feel it's important in day-to-day interactions (it's really to-mah-to, not to-may-to? WHO CARES!). I DO, however, consider feelings important in everything I say or do: I never, ever say something if I think it may hurt people, and I struggle to be careful in my wording for just that reason (though I admittedly CAN offend people by saying too much or being too outspoken at times too!).

    While concern for the feelings of those around me seems to imply Fe...does the fact that my everyday interactions invariably have to pass through a 'feeling filter' but not a 'logic filter' before I undertake them, so to speak, imply Fi over Ti?

    Thanks agaaaaiiiiiiin!!

  7. #57
    Senior Member Spurgeon's Avatar
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    I would recommend taking this Cognitive Development Survey: http://www.cognitiveprocesses.com/as...velop_old.html

    Unfortunately the "submit" button doesn't work, but it's easy to calculate yourself. And it shouldn't take more than 15-20 minutes.

    It definitely helped me decide between ENTP and ENFP.

  8. #58
    Member ChrisC99's Avatar
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    Ah, that was an excellent instrument for shedding valuable insight there, Spurgeon - thankya oh so kindly!!

    Some of the questions in the link were initially confusing to me, and it at once seemed as thought BOTH of the extraverted judging functions suited me, but niether in the intraverted sense. Alas, further reading on cognitive function theory and discussions thereof revealed valuable clues.

    When an extraverted intuitive-dominant has thinking as their auxiliary (or 'helper function' as I like to call it) the way an ENTP does, then the inward, personal thoughts that follow or 'back up' the ideas they're bursting with via interaction with the outside world are impersonal: they're based on patterns, organization. Yes, the extraverted feeling tertiary can vary from a mere afterthought to a well-developed mode of interaction and expression, depending on the person...but that intraverted pattern-seeking auxiliary will still be the root basis for what an ENTP does, one way or the other. For an ENTP, feelings are justified by impersonal logic, and what's deemed appropriate for the group at large is more important than individual feelings.

    It was an easy misidentification for me to make, designating intraverted thinking as my auxiliary, since both extraverted intuitives by definition live to generate ideas first and foremost. But lo and behold...that is not how my mind works. Once I've achieved the thrill of interacting with the world and coming up with glistening new ideas, the personal thoughts that ensue based on that are not impersonal and detached, they do not seek factual patterns above all else. They are an elaborate system of values defining and redefining why I do everything I'm about to do, who it will ultimately help in the long run. Accepted conventions mean nothing to me: what's right has a deep moral base, derived from putting myself in the other person's shoes. Conversely when I seek approval from others, it's also to feed my personal feelings; there is no logical base. I don't seek facts or systematize them for their own sake, only to achieve a desired end. I systematize and apply logic in the outside world (Te) only to serve the pursuit of a purpose to which I attribute personal value...and as the puerile function I can tend to neglect the mundane details of systematizing. The reasoning is not self-justified or done for its own sake, as an intraverted auxiliary would be; it's done to serve the pursuit of ideas (Ne) and the sense of what matters are of personal importance to myself or others at the individual level (Fi) - and THAT is the function that is self-justified.

    Well then it's settled - I AM officially certified for ENFP-hoooood! In this certification I hereby reserve the right to be hyperactive, zany, and experience flights of insight before I even know what to do with them XD...but thoroughly love every step of the way!

    *Bangs gavel*

    Aww, thank you all so much!! This was fun...I'll MISS this forum discussion! Now I think I'll go see what OTHER threads there are to explore/create

  9. #59
    Senior Member Spurgeon's Avatar
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    You'll be back to questioning it again. Mark my words.

  10. #60
    Member ChrisC99's Avatar
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    Of course I will! Delighted to see you're getting to know me from my posts ;D Or maybe it's just because I'm a characteristically indecisive ol' ENFP...I mean ENTP...I mean, I mean...XD

    I'm going to go hit on some INFJs now, ttyl!

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