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  1. #41
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim
    As the above post has been proving eerily popular:


    it's still early, jim, don't give up

    i like this:

    It is the nature of the Ne dominant to first seek out all potential avenues of idea that are 'practical' before they can be content with their chosen sensatory outlets (Si). It is in the nature of Se dominant to first seek out and experience all potential avenues of sensation to be content before falling back on a collusive idea (Ni) when stressed or excited.
    i think i fit that pattern very well. i would say my ESFP friend and ENFP cousin both do, as well. the ESFP engages all sensory possibilities, while ENFPs engage all conceptual possibilities, then we can be satisfied with the other. i think it shows up in how we prioritize attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    Over time talking to you, I would think of you as sanguine first.
    yeah. not that i know you better than you, marm, but nothing about your online personality really says phlegmatic to me.

  2. #42
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post


    it's still early, jim, don't give up

    i like this:



    i think i fit that pattern very well. i would say my ESFP friend and ENFP cousin both do, as well. the ESFP engages all sensory possibilities, while ENFPs engage all conceptual possibilities, then we can be satisfied with the other. i think it shows up in how we prioritize attention.



    yeah. not that i know you better than you, marm, but nothing about your online personality really says phlegmatic to me.
    Yeah, exactly.
    06/13 10:51:03 five sounds: you!!!
    06/13 10:51:08 shortnsweet: no you!!
    06/13 10:51:12 shortnsweet: go do your things and my things too!
    06/13 10:51:23 five sounds: oh hell naw
    06/13 10:51:55 shortnsweet: !!!!
    06/13 10:51:57 shortnsweet: (cries)
    06/13 10:52:19 RiftsWRX: You two are like furbies stuck in a shoe box

    My Nohari
    My Johari
    by sns.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    Over time talking to you, I would think of you as sanguine first.
    Yeah I probably am. Phleg-Sang is just me when I'm tired/burnt out/depressed and I just totally shut down and am like "fuck no."

    Even on here I seem pretty Sanguine, I get involved in all kinds of things which are unnecessary, there's nothing low energy about my posting style. Lulz.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    yeah. not that i know you better than you, marm, but nothing about your online personality really says phlegmatic to me.
    hahahahah!

    clearly that was chosen with the mindset "I am not getting enough done! I feel guilty!"

    oh and @ Jim ...I lied.

    I also have been thinking of taking a break from the forum for a while, it wasn't just because of what you said. I probably will here soon.

  5. #45
    Post-Humorously stalemate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    I have found that many ENFPs using lying and hyperbole to look important, smarter, better, etc (men and women). The ESFPs I know use lying and hyperbole to tell stories and make people laugh, but don't give a shit if others think them stupid (men).
    I have never used hyperbole and it would be possible to embellish upon my natural importance, intelligence, or betterness.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalemate View Post
    I have never used hyperbole and it would be possible to embellish upon my natural importance, intelligence, or betterness.
    I'm very conscious of my usage of hyperbole in my story-telling, especially things which I've written on-line, because I think it makes things more interesting or funnier. I was told in high school that I exaggerated things I said when I told stories, but it had no bearing on building up my own intelligence or importance or whatever.

    My mom does it when she orally tells stories although she doesn't write as much as I do. My grandparents used to call it "lying." But it's not lying. She does it specifically to make her stories about people and things more interesting, which is common in story telling traditions. It's why I don't trust the Bible, because frankly it seems like another hyperbolic fairy tale or folk tale.

    I mean it gets the point across. Story telling is IMPERATIVE to the human experience, just like music, because story telling transmits culture, history, morality, and point of view. Sometimes hyperbole is what is needed to hold people's attention, so they really get the point.

    Think of movies like Big Fish and The Curious Case of Benjamin Button...or Forrest Gump, even. I love movies like that because they hearken back to traditional folk story telling, it's not entirely unlike Jack and the Beanstalk or David and Goliath.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    I'm very conscious of my usage of hyperbole in my story-telling, especially things which I've written on-line, because I think it makes things more interesting or funnier. I was told in high school that I exaggerated things I said when I told stories, but it had no bearing on building up my own intelligence or importance or whatever.

    My mom does it when she orally tells stories although she doesn't write as much as I do. My grandparents used to call it "lying." But it's not lying. She does it specifically to make her stories about people and things more interesting, which is common in story telling traditions. It's why I don't trust the Bible, because frankly it seems like another hyperbolic fairy tale or folk tale.

    I mean it gets the point across. Story telling is IMPERATIVE to the human experience, just like music, because story telling transmits culture, history, morality, and point of view. Sometimes hyperbole is what is needed to hold people's attention, so they really get the point.

    Think of movies like Big Fish and The Curious Case of Benjamin Button...or Forrest Gump, even. I love movies like that because they hearken back to traditional folk story telling, it's not entirely unlike Jack and the Beanstalk or David and Goliath.
    I meant impossible to embellish. I was trying to be all meta and ironic and lost it with a typo. :p

  8. #48
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    Actually though I do what you are saying about using hyperbole to tell a story just to make it more awesome. Who cares about details when I can spice it up for dramatic effect?

  9. #49
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Actually I'm more between the Phlegmatic Sanguine and Sanguine, because I'm not quite that low energy always. I'm much more driven and fiercely independent sometimes than that. I think I was going through a period of burn-out from school/depression when I picked that, though I can see sides of myself in both.
    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    yeah. not that i know you better than you, marm, but nothing about your online personality really says phlegmatic to me.
    All "Phlegmatic" in that blend means is that the expressive behavior is moderate, or as we would call it, "ambiverted". I/A/E is driven by energy that either pushes us towards people (extroversion) or away from them (introversion). Keep in mind, that in this case, what I'm calling "introversion" and "extroversion" are really what Keirsey calls cooperative and pragmatic. MBTI I/E is Inclusion (Interaction Style); this is Control we're talking about.

    So to be in the middle, and express as a Phlegmatic, you don't have the energy pushing you towards or away from people in the area of Control (leadership and responsibilities). You can go either way, expressing leadership, or shying away from it.
    So compared to the pure Sanguine or Supine, there will be a bit less energy. You even mention "burn-out". That might be from the lower energy. So you will go back and forth in "drivenness".

    However, in the Responsive (wanted) area, you "respond as a Sanguine", meaning you're fully energized to want interaction from people. In the area of Control, this would correspond to Berens' Motive-focus: "focus on motives of why people do what they do, in order to work with them". So there will be energy from that, even if there is lower energy in the expressive dimension.
    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    Over time talking to you, I would think of you as sanguine first.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Yeah I probably am. Phleg-Sang is just me when I'm tired/burnt out/depressed and I just totally shut down and am like "fuck no."

    Even on here I seem pretty Sanguine, I get involved in all kinds of things which are unnecessary, there's nothing low energy about my posting style. Lulz.
    Well, remember, there is also the Interaction Style, where you fall purely on the Sanguine side (Get Things Going, which is both ESFP and ENFP). That alone makes you on the surface a very Sanguine person. (You did say Phlegmatic-Sanguine in Inclusion as well, but if you're no longer having I/E uncertainty, and are sure of E, then you're likely just pure Sanguine in Inclusion http://www.pastoral-counseling-cente...-inclusion.htm. Or, it could be the same thing as Control; going back and forth between expressiveness and burning out).
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by stalemate View Post
    Actually though I do what you are saying about using hyperbole to tell a story just to make it more awesome. Who cares about details when I can spice it up for dramatic effect?
    Yes, and we should embrace our drama as a strength. Drama makes performers, story tellers, entertainers of all kinds. Drama digs down to the root of feeling in human experiences and heightens it in order to both educate and entertain.

    I totally relate to Beebe's model of Auxillary Fi teaching others through personal experience, good lord, don't I ever.

    It's just that both ENFPs and ESFPs do this. :marionette:

    According to Keirsey the need to entertain is more ESFP and the need to "develop others" is more ENFP.

    I feel kind of strangulated by Keirsey for that reason. I'm just not as NF as he makes his NFs out to be...they're so freaking into working in human resources and "people are innately good" and all that jazz. I do not belong in human resources, nor do I belong in counseling, and I have not believed that people were "innately good" for many years. I don't necessarily believe they are "innately bad" either. I believe they are innately human.

    He makes the four temperaments too extreme.

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