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  1. #1
    Ginkgo
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    Default SPs, WTF Are They?

    Am I the only one who feels that SP is possibly the least understood temperament? That may speak for me more than anyone else, but... in over a year, I've been browsing the forums, and it seems SPs carry the lightest burden of stereotypes. Oddly, I view this as a sign that the "SP" temperament hasn't fully cemented in the minds of people to the point where they start making their own judgements about the people they come in contact with, and a sign that maybe SPs are understood regardless of how others view the temperament. Or something.

  2. #2

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    Ninjas!





  3. #3
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    According to Keirsey SPs have tactical intelligence, enjoy being bold and making an impact, and can be quite creatively skilled in terms of either making things with craftsmanship or artistry, with SFPs leaning more toward artistry and STPs toward building.

    While some SPs might be athletic of course they all aren't, it's just one of the ways their tactical intelligence could be focused.

    Keirsey also says that ISFPs are inclined toward writing novels just as much as NFs are, so it's not as though all SP creativity has to result in something visual or auditory.

    Of course I'm talking about Keirsey because Se shows up in different ways amongst the four types, to group them together collectively and say "what is an SP" seems more like a Keirsey question.

    And one of the reasons I doubt him is because he says Idealists and Artisans can oppose one another but the truth is I feel more of a cross over between the two types.

    That's probably why talking in terms of Se is better, and I do agree that Se is misunderstood. Apparently having Se doesn't guarantee expertise at being able to hit baseballs which are flying at your face.

    So let's just say SPs are pirates.


  4. #4
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    According to Keirsey SPs have tactical intelligence, enjoy being bold and making an impact, and can be quite creatively skilled in terms of either making things with craftsmanship or artistry, with SFPs leaning more toward artistry and STPs toward building.

    While some SPs might be athletic of course they all aren't, it's just one of the ways their tactical intelligence could be focused.

    Keirsey also says that ISFPs are inclined toward writing novels just as much as NFs are, so it's not as though all SP creativity has to result in something visual or auditory.

    Of course I'm talking about Keirsey because Se shows up in different ways amongst the four types, to group them together collectively and say "what is an SP" seems more like a Keirsey question.

    And one of the reasons I doubt him is because he says Idealists and Artisans can oppose one another but the truth is I feel more of a cross over between the two types.

    That's probably why talking in terms of Se is better, and I do agree that Se is misunderstood. Apparently having Se doesn't guarantee expertise at being able to hit baseballs which are flying at your face.

    So let's just say SPs are pirates.

    I know at least one SP who disagrees with the stereotype of SPs being artisans/craftsman because it misses what they're really about; it ignores the key motivations associated with Se. I must agree with him on this.

  5. #5
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    Well how about we start with clarifying the motivations of Se, then.

    On functions tests I score higher on Se than Si or either of my T functions, so it must be similar to Ne, or so people keep telling me.

    I have a pretty good grasp on Si, but for some reason Se is harder for me to understand. Other than "be here now in the real world."

  6. #6
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    I lack all artistic and craftsman-like skills alltogether
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I lack all artistic and craftsman-like skills alltogether
    Are you good at sales?

    Keirsey talks about that, too. About SPs, especially ESTPs, being good at sales or business. Tactics. Politics. Maneuvering.

    And ESFPs being entertainers, knowing how to provoke other people's emotions and/or how to work a room. Keirsey talks about how SPs are just as interested in people's motives as NFs, but that SPs do it in order to gain something, and are more cynical about it.

    Not that I'm a fan of Keirsey, cuz I'm not. I'm just explaining more because I read his book and it does go into more detail than the crappy short descriptions on the Interwebz.

    I think someone knowledgable just needs to clarify Se as a function, that would be swell.

  8. #8
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    to quote myself before on the difference between Se and Ne... because I'm awesome

    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    For a brief description of the traits associated with these functions, to help people understand things a bit better

    Se- extroverted sensing, the ability to notice the world around you and collect facts for later synthesis by your Ti or Fi… the ability of Se is to collect information from the surroundings (and we’re not just talking about immediate physical surroundings here- movies, music, books and other people are also relevant sources of data!) and noticing signifigant occurrances- and Se can have quite an appetite for information until it is satisfied that it has a grasp on the whole picture/situation. Se learning involves real world examples or actual hands on experimentation. Does the chemistry concept make more sense after you’ve done the experiment in lab instead of just hearing the professor describe it? This could very well be Se helping you out. With very well developed Se you can feel at one with the world around you and develop the ability to easily read situations and figure out how to react based on what reaction you desire. Other functions might view it as somewhat naïve to trust what you’ve learned from experience or from your senses.

    Ne- Ne is Se’s intuitive counterpart… Ne might not notice the birds stopping singing, a bluejay calling or a shadow moving across the grass, or even that the soup that they’ve been eating is really, really hot (for the first spoonful or so)… While Se is concerned with what is (other functions are good enough at helping out with figuring out what could be with the outside information!) Ne is concerned with what could be. This, of course, can lead to paranoia on the bad side or on the good side it opens up an entirely new theoretical possibilities. What Se is collecting from the rest of the world, Ne is collecting from the space somewhere between their ears… say the possibility mentioned above occurs and the birds stop singing… if the Ne dom hears this occur the mind will immediately go into possibilities of why this could possibly occur (could it be DDT? Is it fall already? Did all birds simultaneously find a delicious worm?..... is there a hawk around?) while the Se dom would notice that they stopped singing, a blue jay called and that there was a shadow and would be staring up at the hawk. Oh, Ne also probably understands the concept of that chemistry principle perfectly fine on a theoretical level and will end up setting their lab coat on fire with the bunsen burner if allowed into the lab! Ne plays with theories and possibilities, Ti or Fi give them a warp and weft onto which to weave their ideas properly.
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  9. #9
    Senior Member captain curmudgeon's Avatar
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    I suck at artistry, craftmanship, and sales...

  10. #10
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    i was confirmed that i am not an SP my se is beyond retarded. you should ask my soy sauce it knows, oh it knows.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

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