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  1. #31
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Ah, yes, I see what you all are saying. Cascadeco - stripping off the "organization" or the original structure so that the information can be used however the user wants to use it at a given time. Interesting. Thanks for that.

    It sounds like Ni users take in all the information and then are able to cut-and-paste it or piece it together in whatever ways it needs to. That reminds me of something I heard about Dr. Martin Luther King that I didn't know. Maybe he was Ni-dom (I read recently that he was very much an introvert, contrary to popular belief. Many of his closest friends described him as introverted and very introspective). Anyhow, during his "I have a dream" speech, he had a different speech organized and he began down the path of that speech - as planned - and he got well into the body of that speech (not the "I have a dream" speech, but the other one). The crowd was listening, but they weren't "electrified". It was just another speech. Suddenly, a woman (I forget her name) - she was a friend of his who was on the stage with him - she said really loud (apparently you can hear her say it in the audio), "Tell them about your dream, Martin!" Witnesses say that when he heard her say that, he stopped in his tracks, thought for a second, then moved his speech notes off to the side of the podium, completely switched gears, and immediately went into his electrifying "I have a dream speech" - which had already been given at another previous time.

    A friend of his said something like, "He was an absolute master at 'cutting and pasting' from previous speeches. At any given time, he had the ability to - right in the middle of his speech - to stop and insert a paragraph from an earlier speech if he thought that it fit the current context and the current audience." And that's what he did. As if his Ni (?) heard the woman and intuitively knew that this particular crowd, at this particular moment needed to hear "the dream speech". So, he switched gears - as you said, he took "page 5 from speech A" and inserted into "page 21 of speech B". And that's what made the speech famous - because he switched gears and got it right. That was exactly what that particular audience needed to hear on that day and they connected with his words. It's gotta be Ni, you think?
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  2. #32
    Glycerine
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    People think MLK was generally a NFJ (disagreement over the first letter).

  3. #33
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    Ni... For those who don't "get it".. Life is what you make it (You'd be surprised how far you can go with this.. Good or bad.) The truth is in here. Nothing + nothing still equals something, something + something still equals nothing. There is always one more perspective.. find it. Speak to the universe and listen.. It answers you.

    This works for me.. intuitively..

  4. #34
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    ^ Uh, lol... sorry, I doubt that's going to help in the understanding. Even for me, I tend not to view my processes in those sorts of terms/mysticisms!!
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  5. #35
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    How about this, cascadeco? Ni appears to magically pull a bunny out of a hat but what's not seen, is the hole in the bottom of the hat that leads to the rabbit warren!

  6. #36
    Member amazingdatagirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    I should note that Ne sees patterns that Ni doesn't see. If you give both a metaphorical stack of magazines, Ne will spread them all out and arrange them in a huge pattern, and once arranged, the pattern becomes obvious. Ni will instead remove the spines of all the magazines and stack them up and shuffle all of the pages. When encountering a problem to solve, Ni will "magically" pull out the right articles and sections of articles relevant to the problem and solve it that way.
    I thought that this example was kinda lame at first but am starting to like the analogy.

    In this example, Ne treats the objects (magazines) in their entirety. There is truth to be found both within the individual instance and in their contextual relationships. What type of magazines do I have? Anything rare or collectible? Where did they come from? Why did uumlau dump them on my desk (as if I don't have enough work piled up already)? That April 1973 Popular Mechanics looks interesting. The software bug that I was working on can probably wait (will only take 5 minutes to fix it)...

    The Ni-dom cuts the pages apart (glances over them) and the stack goes in a corner. Boss comes in a couple of weeks later and asks for your input on application development for smart phones. You reach over to the stack (about 1/3 the way from the top) and pull out an article about trends in handheld computing.

    Ni is concerned about functionality. Useful information is extracted and extra stuff (advertising, classifieds, op-ed) goes in the trash. Ti-Ne wants to understand (and enjoy) the intuitive connections that are inspired by the objects. Utility is less important.

    Oops, missed this while I was composing my post (Ti nitpicky-ness)
    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    The result is a custom-tailored answer perfect for the situation at hand. It is problematic in that the answer cannot easily be generalized, because it is very particular to that one case.

    That's how Ni works.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    ^ Uh, lol... sorry, I doubt that's going to help in the understanding. Even for me, I tend not to view my processes in those sorts of terms/mysticisms!!
    Well That's Ni for you.. apparently it has no form, only interpretation

    What I am saying seems very simple to me..

  8. #38
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    Well That's Ni for you.. apparently it has no form, only interpretation

    What I am saying seems very simple to me..
    My point is really that that sort of description is WHY no one really 'gets' Ni and we have all of these sorts of discussions. How you describe it may be how you see it, but it's utterly unhelpful for anyone else. It doesn't say much of anything. I mean no offense, but it's why most people just scratch their heads and don't get it.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    My point is really that that sort of description is WHY no one really 'gets' Ni and we have all of these sorts of discussions. How you describe it may be how you see it, but it's utterly unhelpful for anyone else. It doesn't say much of anything. I mean no offense, but it's why most people just scratch their heads and don't get it.
    Are you saying it's an issue with my language or concepts??

    Also if the title of this thread is "why Ni is so difficult to understand".. My post illustrates this point quite well.. No?
    Mysticism, symbolism and metaphor are part of the package.

  10. #40
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    Are you saying it's an issue with my language or concepts??
    Ni as a cognitive function, being a cognitive function, should be able to be explained in a way that makes sense and that is NOT open to interpretation. As a function, Ni IS something. It processes and works in a certain way. To try to articulate that process is what most people want to know and want to understand - how it works, what it IS as a function. What we're actually DOING.

    How we each experience it may vary a bit, and words we use to describe it may vary, but all Ni doms process in the same way.

    What you described didn't explain the process itself. You say 'it's just intuitive', and 'speak to the universe and listen', but that doesn't say anything. And..lol... *I* don't even know what you mean when you're saying speak to the universe. Do you know what I mean? What are non-Ni-users supposed to gain from reading that statement? etc.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

    My Photography and Watercolor Fine Art Prints!!! Cascade Colors Fine Art Prints
    https://docs.google.com/uc?export=do...Gd5N3NZZE52QjQ

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