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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    One thing that I've noticed is that Ni can overexplain simple things, yet given something terribly complex, can give a simple explanation (via Te/Fe) that yields new understanding to others
    Thank you.

  2. #122
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Love this thread in its dissection of Ni down to core and explainable components. It's like myth busters!
    Yes! I also love the Mythbusters show
    We're, in effect, trying to do the seemingly impossible of describing Ni. I've tried, of course, but it turned out metaphorical--so it doesn't quite fit the bill.
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  3. #123
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Ooo! I like that description of Ne - "an idea is defined [Si] by how it interacts with other ideas [Ne]"

    So for Ni, it would be, "an idea is understood by its functionality [Ni] in the real world [Se]." Does that sound right?
    That seems right. It sounds like Ni is a function-generating machine, 'seeing' the relationships between events, things and people via abstraction.
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  4. #124
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    Synchronicity.. Is it just a coincidence.?? An intuitive mind rarely thinks so.

    Before I was really aware of what Typology was and I certainly had little education as far as the functions go..

    I described it as having access to your subconscious.. Everybody does.. or rather your subconscious has access to your conscious mind.
    it's probably a little of both. Your subconscious does not speak a particular language..It's knows the languages you know, and might even know every language ever spoken, but when it speaks, It speaks in metaphor , symbolism and mysticism. Even the words it uses when it does speak in a language, are just symbols. Your Subconscious sees more, feels more, hears more, smells more, processes and KNOWS more than your conscious mind does.

    SO what if the bridge between your subconscious , which is a realm of limitless potential, infinite ideas and where anything is possible, can be crossed more easily for some? What if the conscious mind in some people, just has a capacity or is more willing, for more reception to the messages the subconscious is sending, 24/7.. Even when we sleep the subconscious does not.
    I feel most Ni is just that; Communication between the conscious and subconscious mind.
    Some people just listen, can listen, or are more willing to listen, than others.

    One thing for certain, trying to explain or even remembering a dream* can be near impossible. But it has left it's emotional and intellectual impressions on you anyway.
    Then one day something triggers that impression and connections start being made.. Often very vague connections. often indescribable connections.
    It's at this point for the Ni user that something emerges (AH HA!), while for others, it is dismissed. This itself might not even be a conscious decision.

    *Dream, being conscious or unconscious, and just a word I am using to describe a "kind" of communication between the subconscious and conscious minds.
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but our human imagination is indeed finite: It has its contours, thanks to our natural history on this planet. Thus, there's a limit to what we can theoretically imagine.
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  5. #125
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bologna View Post
    FWIW, in that quote, you did come across like someone who was merely sick of symbolism, rather than someone who was devoid of it
    No one said someone was devoid of symbolism.
    Thanks for missing the point of my entire post.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but our human imagination is indeed finite: It has its contours, thanks to our natural history on this planet. Thus, there's a limit to what we can theoretically imagine.
    Please listen very carefully.. You lost me at "sorry to burst your bubble"
    This is because No one is going to tell me what my bubble is .. let alone burst it.
    I appreciate that you have an opinion and it might even be valuable, The problem is ,, you have no manners from my standpoint and I refuse to deal with people who don't.
    This is tragic in the sense, that had you communicated with a little humility, and perhaps asked me to have a look at what you think, without riding in some high horse and your guns blazing, you might have something worth hearing.
    But I am not going to hear it.
    That is your loss BTW, not mine.. since my bubble remains very intact.

    Thank You

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  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    No one said someone was devoid of symbolism.
    Thanks for missing the point of my entire post.
    The single word "devoid" threw you off of what I meant? Who's missing the points of whose entire posts?

  8. #128
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    You know what- it's not worth it.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    Anyone who "fucking hates symbolism" or thinks "Assigning greater meaning to things or events is fucking annoying" is in my opinion, the last person on earth with a preference for Ni. What the anti-Ni comments do suggest, is someone who prefers to take information and events "as is," which is Se.
    Yes and someone with aux or tert Se/Ni is a conflicted soul who cant determine if they want to stick with meaning or just take events as is. It sucks I tell you...it really sucks.

  10. #130
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    For someone to claim to be an Ni type while simultaneously decrying meaning and symbolism is probably the most obvious sign a person does not have a preference for Ni. Ni assigns meaning and symbolism as readily as breathing in and out.

    ...

    Anyone who "fucking hates symbolism" or thinks "Assigning greater meaning to things or events is fucking annoying" is in my opinion, the last person on earth with a preference for Ni. What the anti-Ni comments do suggest, is someone who prefers to take information and events "as is," which is Se.
    I do not believe your conclusion follows from your observation.

    In particular, I don't see INTJs as being oriented towards symbolism, per se. The "meanings" or "symbols" with which INTJs deal are predominantly technical in nature, and I don't have a difficult time believing that a technically-oriented INTJ might say, "Assigning greater meaning to things or events is fucking annoying." Fuzzy-wuzzy touchy-feely symbols and "greater meanings" would be very suspect - if not repellent - to most INTJs.

    Symbolism doesn't have an "if and only if" one-to-one relationship with Ni. It's a subset of the many expressions Ni can take.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

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