Why is 'Small Talk' associated with S Types?

[Elfboy]

I think that all of this self-glorifying "I hate small talk" business is silly and missing the point. If you claim to hate small talk it's either because (1) you dislike (or don't want to be bothered with) communicating with others in general, (2) you are socially dysfunctional and want to blame it on other's lack of ability to converse about "deeper" things, or (3) because you're lying to make yourself seem N to idiots on this forum. Of these three possibilities, I think that only (1) can have any sort of correlation to personality type. And it would be on the E/I or, to a lesser extent, T/F axis rather than S/N.

Small talk is a social ritual that functions as a method of negotiating relationships between people in communication. Among other things, it allows, for instance, one to gauge the mood and willingness of their interlocutor in order to determine the limits of possible conversation. In other words, the point of small talk is not to exchange content through communication, but rather to understand how to communicate in any particular instance (with any particular person.) Function over content. To say that small talk is pointless because you talk about mundane things is, therefore, nothing other than a triviality.

Personally, I do generally dislike engaging in small talk. But the reason that I do is because I dislike communicating in general with people to whom I am not well acquainted (i.e., people who I would have to engage in small talk with in order to communicate, because I don't know them well and therefore don't know how to communicate with them), not because the topics are boring. To say the latter would be akin to saying that I dislike candy wrappers because they don't taste as good the candy bar. Which is stupid.

Furthermore, to say that you are bad at small talk is the same as saying that you are bad at being social.

I tend to use small talk as a means to end and tend to dislike it for a number of reasons
1) as you stated in bold, small talk is a social ritual and i dislike being bound social conventions, even if I can see the validity in them. i suppose it's similar to how Ss can see the validity in logic and theory, but they don't like to use more than they need (I'm making a rather sweeping generalization here, please correct me if you disagree)
2) being N obviously I would rather talk about the secrets of the universe than the weather or obvious detail oriented conversations
3) I'm an E4 which so I can't stand anything that is conventional or normal
4) I'll admit, I am kind of a snob. I don't exclude people for things like race, appearence or religion, but I do exclude other people who are of low intelligence, weak mental fortitude or lack integrity. oh, and people who are people pleasers (people pleasing is SO pathetic)
5) similarly, I am a very self centered person and if someone can't benefit me in any way, I'd rather not waste time with them (not very F of me is it lol)

 

[Sunny Ghost]

I tend to use small talk as a means to end and tend to dislike it for a number of reasons
1) as you stated in bold, small talk is a social ritual and i dislike being bound social conventions, even if I can see the validity in them. i suppose it's similar to how Ss can see the validity in logic and theory, but they don't like to use more than they need (I'm making a rather sweeping generalization here, please correct me if you disagree)
2) being N obviously I would rather talk about the secrets of the universe than the weather or obvious detail oriented conversations
3) I'm an E4 which so I can't stand anything that is conventional or normal
4) I'll admit, I am kind of a snob. I don't exclude people for things like race, appearence or religion, but I do exclude other people who are of low intelligence, weak mental fortitude or lack integrity. oh, and people who are people pleasers (people pleasing is SO pathetic)
5) similarly, I am a very self centered person and if someone can't benefit me in any way, I'd rather not waste time with them (not very F of me is it lol)

I think the point trying to be made here is that small talk is precisely a means to an end. I don't know that anyone truly loves making small talk. It can be fun to make jokes with people and be charming in that sort of manner when first engaging with people. But small talk is initially a way of... well... either being charismatic, such as hoping to uplift a random strangers mood, or making long silences amongst strangers less so and hopefully more interesting (like waiting in a line or something at a coffee shop, etc.), or hoping to get to know someone better by first initiating in light hearted conversation and seeing where it may lead--maybe somewhere deeper, maybe nowhere... but you can't know until you start somewhere.

 

[guesswho]

You watched waking life?

What an awesome surreal movie that was....

 

[Sunny Ghost]

one of my favorites.

 

[Orangey]

1) as you stated in bold, small talk is a social ritual and i dislike being bound social conventions, even if I can see the validity in them. i suppose it's similar to how Ss can see the validity in logic and theory, but they don't like to use more than they need (I'm making a rather sweeping generalization here, please correct me if you disagree)

God, you know, I knew that if I used the phrase "social ritual" some idiot would take it out of the context of the sentence and be all "I hate social rituals 'cause I'm a non-conformist." Congratulations for meeting my expectations.

2) being N obviously I would rather talk about the secrets of the universe than the weather or obvious detail oriented conversations

You've obviously failed to comprehend what I wrote. Also, "secrets of the universe?" You've also just given me second-hand embarrassment.

I digress from the main topic here, but where are you guys getting this idea that "detail-oriented" is synonymous with "mundane" or "trivial?" A conversation about, say, global eco-politics (which some of you goons would like to claim as an N topic) could include more or less detail, but if it included more detail, why would it suddenly become a mundane thing to talk about? Being detailed describes a way in which to talk about something; being mundane describes a subject matter. Two different meanings.

I think the point trying to be made here is that small talk is precisely a means to an end. I don't know that anyone truly loves making small talk. It can be fun to make jokes with people and be charming in that sort of manner when first engaging with people. But small talk is initially a way of... well... either being charismatic, such as hoping to uplift a random strangers mood, or making long silences amongst strangers less so and hopefully more interesting (like waiting in a line or something at a coffee shop, etc.), or hoping to get to know someone better by first initiating in light hearted conversation and seeing where it may lead--maybe somewhere deeper, maybe nowhere... but you can't know until you start somewhere.

Yes.

 

[Elfboy]

God, you know, I knew that if I used the phrase "social ritual" some idiot would take it out of the context of the sentence and be all "I hate social rituals 'cause I'm a non-conformist." Congratulations for meeting my expectations.



You've obviously failed to comprehend what I wrote. Also, "secrets of the universe?" You've also just given me second-hand embarrassment.

I digress from the main topic here, but where are you guys getting this idea that "detail-oriented" is synonymous with "mundane" or "trivial?" A conversation about, say, global eco-politics (which some of you goons would like to claim as an N topic) could include more or less detail, but if it included more detail, why would it suddenly become a mundane thing to talk about? Being detailed describes a way in which to talk about something; being mundane describes a subject matter. Two different meanings.



Yes.

I understood your point perfectly, I actually agreed with most of it. it's just that it was more complicated than you mentioned so I elaborated.

 

[gromit]

I think the point trying to be made here is that small talk is precisely a means to an end. I don't know that anyone truly loves making small talk. It can be fun to make jokes with people and be charming in that sort of manner when first engaging with people. But small talk is initially a way of... well... either being charismatic, such as hoping to uplift a random strangers mood, or making long silences amongst strangers less so and hopefully more interesting (like waiting in a line or something at a coffee shop, etc.), or hoping to get to know someone better by first initiating in light hearted conversation and seeing where it may lead--maybe somewhere deeper, maybe nowhere... but you can't know until you start somewhere.

This is a really good description!

 

[Tamske]

I think the point trying to be made here is that small talk is precisely a means to an end. I don't know that anyone truly loves making small talk. It can be fun to make jokes with people and be charming in that sort of manner when first engaging with people. But small talk is initially a way of... well... either being charismatic, such as hoping to uplift a random strangers mood, or making long silences amongst strangers less so and hopefully more interesting (like waiting in a line or something at a coffee shop, etc.), or hoping to get to know someone better by first initiating in light hearted conversation and seeing where it may lead--maybe somewhere deeper, maybe nowhere... but you can't know until you start somewhere.

Indeed, but I like to exchange means and end. Doing smalltalk to... get to what? What gets most on my nerves is the doing smalltalk for socializing purposes. Socializing in order to socialize? Can't we play a game in order to socialize? Or discuss about literature to socialize? Why can't we eat from the two walls, "enjoy the company of friends" and "enjoy the interesting conversation / the board game / ..." at the same time? I've experienced more than one time that people are amusing themselves more (and it's not only me who does it) when there's something to do besides "being together". Yes, I'm keeping the "silly games for eight persons or more" both on the shelf and in my mind for the party I'm organising next week.

 

[skylights]

^^ yeahh i tend to like to socialize doing something, too. just talking, with someone you don't really know, is a little awkward! i like doing side-by-side activities, like painting or something to get to know someone. then you can bond over whatever you're doing instead of trying to focus so hard on the bonding itself that it becomes awkward


but i think small talk is like a touch-and-go game of sorts, so you can feel out each others' interests first and not step on one anothers' toes. mini-socializing in order to get a feel on how to properly socialize with that person. like a bike with training wheels, even though you look a little silly

 

[Sunny Ghost]

Indeed, but I like to exchange means and end. Doing smalltalk to... get to what? What gets most on my nerves is the doing smalltalk for socializing purposes. Socializing in order to socialize? Can't we play a game in order to socialize? Or discuss about literature to socialize? Why can't we eat from the two walls, "enjoy the company of friends" and "enjoy the interesting conversation / the board game / ..." at the same time? I've experienced more than one time that people are amusing themselves more (and it's not only me who does it) when there's something to do besides "being together". Yes, I'm keeping the "silly games for eight persons or more" both on the shelf and in my mind for the party I'm organising next week.

 

[Orangey]

I understood your point perfectly, I actually agreed with most of it. it's just that it was more complicated than you mentioned so I elaborated.

When what you added is already accounted for by my rules (2) and (3), and you believe that you were "elaborating," I cannot help but conclude that you didn't understand my post.

 

[InvisibleJim]

I disagree with the concept that small talk is associated with S-types. Sure, they prefer generating sensory information and exchanging it as a matter of course; and Ni dominants (INXJs) are noted for feeling a very thin connection to their Ni center when they get pulled into the sensory processes; but I don't think this means small talk is excluded. I also can understand why the Ti dominant INTPs might feel small talk isn't important if it's not relevant to their interests.

 

[Elfboy]

When what you added is already accounted for by my rules (2) and (3), and you believe that you were "elaborating," I cannot help but conclude that you didn't understand my post.

No, I got it, and for the most part I agreed with it, but agreeing with you wasn't the main point of my post. in which case a "(Insert quote here) omg soo true" or something of that nature would have sufficed. I quoted you in point 1, but the point where I really agreed with you was point 4 where I said I was a snob and don't like small talk because it makes me feel less intellectual (more N as you said). The main point was why I personally don't like small talk for xyz reasons, but I also agreed with you that point 4 is common among Ns. you were probably confused because my arguments don't tend to be very organized unless I plan them out.
However, on a seperate note, point 3 is more significant in my opinion. I believe small talk has more of an Enneagram correlation than MBTI (which is simply cognition preferences, how you do things). Enneagram is about motivation (ie why you do things) and has a stronger (but certainly not direct) correlation with interests. Enneagram 4w3s don't like small talk because it's "ordinary" and we try to make everything glamorous and sophisticated or we get bored quickly. 4w3 celebrities for example wear outrageous outfits simply because they would be bored wearing what most people wear.

 

[rhinosaur]

What about asking off the bat what are your goals for the next 5 to 10 years and where do you stand on politics, sexuality and the economy? That's the kind of small talk I'd like to start with. I get a bit lost for words when convos start with hows the weather, what did you do today, hows travel etc.

I'd personally feel pretty uncomfortable if a person I'd just met started out with any of those topics. Take it slow, we can work up to the personal stuff if I like you.

 

[Laurie]

I'm good with small talk (either that or I don't know what it is). I ask random questions like
me: "Have you ever noticed that there are a lot of guys here that are eating by themselves?"
Him: "No"
me: "Well.. look around. In fact there seems to be only guys here. Most of the people here are guys."
Him: "Haha..that's because girls travel in packs. So either there is a big group of them or not"
me: "Ah..I see. Because we're the hunters. They travel in packs to protect themselves."
Him: "Like hyenas"

^Conversation I had today.

Also, if someone zones out I'll ask them what they were thinking about. I'm actually pretty aggressive when it comes to that. Answers like "Nothing" get rejected...

But yeah, when it comes to people I always have many questions about them. I just learnt to actually ask these questions instead of trying to answer them myself. This has led to many of surprises. It's definitely something I learnt though.

But, I might not be N. I'm fairly certain I'm ixtp though.

That's fun small talk. It confuses people when I say off the wall stuff though so I've gotten better at blending in more.

Weather is small talk?? I don't know, it's pretty serious around here. If it's 7 degrees out and you can't see across the street and people are driving 20 on the freeway it's a pretty exciting thing to talk about. (Was that small talk?)

I've always thought that "hating small talk" is a way of saying "I can't figure out how to interact with people so I say I'm above it"

 

[Randomnity]

Can someone precisely define small talk? I'm getting confused reading this thread. I thought it was essentially anything that is exhausted after 2 sentences. And why is everything either small talk or "describe your future for the next 10 years"? Surely there's medium talk? More of that plz.

 

[Sunny Ghost]

Small talk-- Casual or trivial conversation; chitchat; light conversations about everyday things.

Agreed, small talk is quickly exhausted... which is why it's funny to hear people in this thread believing this is some phenomena that carries on for hours. To me, small talk is something that is used in passing (i.e. seeing an acquaintance and stopping to be friendly for a moment), or at random in waiting areas of some sort (striking up a short conversation with a person sitting by you, etc.) , or with a cashier at a check out lane (attempting to be friendly), etc.

Ha, I suppose "medium talk" would be along the lines of striking up a conversation with coworkers about random stuff going on either with one anothers lives, catching up, or complaining about work stuff that is going on... Or shooting the breeze with friends. Talking about food, movies, sports, etc. Or at least, that's how I think of it.

Deep conversations are more philosophical, spiritual, religious, therapeutic, political, analytical... fully disclosing ones self to another, their feelings, values or ideas.

Just thought of that quote, “Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people." Although... I think you'd have to take into account the comfort level one has with the person they are talking with.

 

[Elfboy]

Small talk-- Casual or trivial conversation; chitchat; light conversations about everyday things.

Agreed, small talk is quickly exhausted... which is why it's funny to hear people in this thread believing this is some phenomena that carries on for hours. To me, small talk is something that is used in passing (i.e. seeing an acquaintance and stopping to be friendly for a moment), or at random in waiting areas of some sort (striking up a short conversation with a person sitting by you, etc.) , or with a cashier at a check out lane (attempting to be friendly), etc.

Ha, I suppose "medium talk" would be along the lines of striking up a conversation with coworkers about random stuff going on either with one anothers lives, catching up, or complaining about work stuff that is going on... Or shooting the breeze with friends. Talking about food, movies, sports, etc. Or at least, that's how I think of it.

Deep conversations are more philosophical, spiritual, religious, therapeutic, political, analytical... fully disclosing ones self to another, their feelings, values or ideas.

Just thought of that quote, “Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people." Although... I think you'd have to take into account the comfort level one has with the person they are talking with.

I would define it more as a spectrum, with small talk on one end and deep, philosophical conversation on the other. on a scale from 1 to 10, let's call small talk a 1 and discussing the meaning of life as a 10... chit chat to me is somewhere closer to small talk, perhaps in the range of 3-5.
I have a tendency to jump right into 6-8 range conversation with people right of the bat and sometimes I have to remember that that can be kind of stiffling or throw people off.

 

[Sunny Ghost]

I was speaking in reference to striking up small talk with strangers or distant acquaintances. You jump into the 6 to 8 range with people you hardly know?

I could very well be wrong, but that may be more of an extroverted quality, and less a sensor quality, to want to jump right in and expose oneself and one's ideas. Or an ENxx.

I can't speak for everyone's type, but for ISFP's at least, with Fi-dom leading and Te inferior, we're less inclined to want to share unless we're very very comfortable. We hold our feelings, values and ideas very close. Perhaps this is why people will consider us to not take life so seriously. But there definitely have been instances in which I just met someone brand new, and was unexpectedly able to really open up. However, that is a rareity, but gets me very excited when it happens. I would think most people would crave to have deep conversations with others versus cheap conversations, but for most it's a matter of connection to the person they are speaking with.

 

[Orangey]

I would think most people would crave to have deep conversations with others versus cheap conversations, but for most it's a matter of connection to the person they are speaking with.

Exactly. Nobody enjoys "small talk" for its own sake. It's just a tool that can be used to communicate with people that one shares a more or less distant relationship with. The end can be either to limit conversation to non-deep topics because that's the nature of your relationship with said person, or to slowly become familiar enough with them to move on to more personal or (to avoid using the word "deep" again) involved topics.