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  1. #21
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Being forced to read long discussions about "tertiary Te" and "inferior Ni" and junk like that.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

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  2. #22
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    Being ignored by someone they want.

  3. #23
    Supreme High Commander Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I've found ESFPs to be mercurial. They seem to want to keep everything happy and enjoyable and engaging on the surface... but clamping down on their P and/or crossing their F values can lead to either depression OR an explosion... after which, without it even needing to be resolved per se, they can float back into their "happy" self again.

    Te is the tertiary for ESFP. It's an anchoring function. I see them use it to get structure in their lives / create stability. Once ESFPs get channeled, I see some of them have a lot of doggedness and focus on some goal they have in mine and they "Te" things to get there.

    Ni is the inferior. With S primaries, N is the inferior, and what I commonly see is unrealistic intuitions consuming their attention and creating a lot of fear. When S types get thrown for a loop, they can get caught in a "fear" cycle because they cannot "realistically imagine" the future and just become scared of EVERYTHING.

    My ESFP son had to work through a particular change in his life, and the day he found out, he couldn't sleep -- he laid in bed projecting ahead years and years and couldn't stop. What if this happens? What if that happens? What if? What if? All of these fears had the same priority in his head because he couldn't prioritize them or determine their likelihood. Possibility = probability to him, which actually isn't true. Te is great at working issues to their conclusion, but Ti helps put things in balance and sensing the inherent truth of something to begin with.

    ESTPs can get into a fear cycle too, but the Ti presence as secondary seems to reduce the "irrationality" of the fear cycle. The tertiary is Fe -- ESTPs are great wheelers and dealers, like Tieger says they are within the TP group, which uses Fe to implement their T goals and so they can LOOK social and engage without it being their primary purpose. Another thing that surprised me when I saw it was how committed/loyal ESTPs seem to be to groups, despite their typical pragmatism; one assumption could be that this just comes from a stabilizing Fe tertiary.

    For ESxP, the Ni inferior also can lead to massive misreading of someone's intentions; there can be a high level of accusation/suspicion of someone's motives if they do something the ESxP doesn't or is offended by. ESFP hates negativity, so they'll shy away from those accusations unless they're blown a gasket; but I think you can expect ESTP to more actively pursue those suspicions especially in a social context where "games" are being played and people are jockeying for position.
    My father is an ESTP, and his inferior shows it self in unrealistic assesment of the future as well, but in his case it manifests as endless optimism! Some times he will completely over look the fact that things might not work out the way he wants. It's no wonder I grew up to be such a pesimist - the family needed it as a stabilising influence. Some one had to remember the umbrella, if you know what I mean.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by yvonne View Post
    i just have to come here to tell you guys how grateful i am for your insight! we discussed about these things yesterday with my so and i feel so much closer to him now... i am very, very, very, very happy!
    I am so glad you were able to use this thread for a good purpose in your relationship with your so. To me, that is what MBTI is all about!

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFlame
    To me, their tert Te looks like magic. Just these out of nowhere moments where they can come up with ingenious solutions to to problems...solutions that can seem completely unconventional, but work. And I think that's something incredibly important and common for ESFPs to develop to get them out of the frequent emergency situations that pesky Se-domness tends to get them into.
    That is very insightful. Thank you! I think I understand it now!

  5. #25
    A passer by yvonne's Avatar
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    i've also noticed that my ESFP (male) is better at showing that he cares by doing something concrete for me, not so much at talking things through, or being very affectionate and a patient listener... i know that he cares and wants to make me happy, but he doesn't want to "get to the bottom of things". i think i've learned to communicate my thoughts to him better recently.

  6. #26
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    Go Crazy???????
    Aren't they naturally crazy?? ..

  7. #27
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I've found ESFPs to be mercurial. They seem to want to keep everything happy and enjoyable and engaging on the surface... but clamping down on their P and/or crossing their F values can lead to either depression OR an explosion... after which, without it even needing to be resolved per se, they can float back into their "happy" self again.

    Te is the tertiary for ESFP. It's an anchoring function. I see them use it to get structure in their lives / create stability. Once ESFPs get channeled, I see some of them have a lot of doggedness and focus on some goal they have in mine and they "Te" things to get there.

    Ni is the inferior. With S primaries, N is the inferior, and what I commonly see is unrealistic intuitions consuming their attention and creating a lot of fear. When S types get thrown for a loop, they can get caught in a "fear" cycle because they cannot "realistically imagine" the future and just become scared of EVERYTHING.

    My ESFP son had to work through a particular change in his life, and the day he found out, he couldn't sleep -- he laid in bed projecting ahead years and years and couldn't stop. What if this happens? What if that happens? What if? What if? All of these fears had the same priority in his head because he couldn't prioritize them or determine their likelihood. Possibility = probability to him, which actually isn't true. Te is great at working issues to their conclusion, but Ti helps put things in balance and sensing the inherent truth of something to begin with.

    ESTPs can get into a fear cycle too, but the Ti presence as secondary seems to reduce the "irrationality" of the fear cycle. The tertiary is Fe -- ESTPs are great wheelers and dealers, like Tieger says they are within the TP group, which uses Fe to implement their T goals and so they can LOOK social and engage without it being their primary purpose. Another thing that surprised me when I saw it was how committed/loyal ESTPs seem to be to groups, despite their typical pragmatism; one assumption could be that this just comes from a stabilizing Fe tertiary.

    For ESxP, the Ni inferior also can lead to massive misreading of someone's intentions; there can be a high level of accusation/suspicion of someone's motives if they do something the ESxP doesn't or is offended by. ESFP hates negativity, so they'll shy away from those accusations unless they're blown a gasket; but I think you can expect ESTP to more actively pursue those suspicions especially in a social context where "games" are being played and people are jockeying for position.
    i can easily spiral into the same thing your son did. probability=possibility.

    i don't know if i'm all that bad at misreading intentions. i try to take people for what they say.. it's actually a big pet peeve of mine when people misread and jump the gun like that, so i try not to do it myself. i swear to god, i even had a bad dream about it this morning. i dunno..there was some dialogue in the dream of someone accusing me of some agenda.. barely remember it, but i woke pissed off.

  8. #28
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xNTP View Post
    Also, lots of acid.
    That happened to me too. Still getting over it.


    Still kinda perusing through this thread... I've mentioned this before when I thought I was IS*P, but maybe the point about exploding then chilling out afterwards is just another thing that's ESFP'ish. I've been in situations that really built up in an ugly way, and the second I did something about it, I ended up laughing afterwards. Sometimes I end up apologizing too quickly. I almost think I should just maintain the shittyness for longer, even if I no longer feel it within.. just for the sake of not confusing matters too much.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Ming's Avatar
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    It's not that we have no ambition; it's just that we're lazy. We love life as it is. There's no need to progress anymore..

    Well I'm 15, so I can't really say anything, but I have ambitions. I myself think that I'm doing things at my pace; maybe your son is too..

    I would believe just let him do it at his own pace. Until he does something really bad. Then you can use your holy motherness and hit the crap out of him. Then he's yours

  10. #30
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    Question ESTP/ESFP shadow functions?

    Sorry I guess I posted a similar post to this last year . . . just wondering if enneagram 4s typically test out as ESTP or ESFPs?

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