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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by nebbykoo View Post
    Why does anyone need to determine if someone is N or S? Either you're interested in them and what they say or you're not.
    I know a guy who loves to talk about hotwings and beer. Seems pretty 'S' by the OP.

    He is also an aerospace engineer and earns $200K/year. How do you explain this?
    He went to college. Explains hotwings, beer, and edumacated.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by animenagai View Post
    Ummmmm Marm, this guy actually tested as an INTP (because I made him take the test). Not only that, he read the description and said it was accurate. He even fist bumped :P. There is no doubt that he is an INTP. The difference between S's and N's when it comes to sports is that an N is much more likely to start analysing everything, even if there are no practical consequences. This has nothing to do with intelligence, merely a tendency to analyse. He very much fits into this mold. Look Marm, I don't know what to say, people who know these INTP's tell you that they're really into sports and you, someone who don't know these people are running with a basic belief that we are all mistaken. Do you realise how cyclical you're being? Do you realise that maybe your belief that strong N's can't be crazy sports fans is a fundamental reach? I can link you to sports forums where these guys follow sports religiously and they are obviously N.
    I dunno. Apparently a lot of ESFPs also test as ENFPs. I sometimes test as INFJ, even ENTP or INTJ one time, and I can tell you quite plainly I am not an NT.

    Like I said, agree to disagree. If I spent most of my days enraptured with hairstyling, cosmetics, learning to be an esthetician, and learning fashion design out of preference rather than need (like having to make money) I think I would question my own N-ness, so I'm not just applying this to sports.

  3. #53
    Senior Member animenagai's Avatar
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    The thing is, he's a good friend. I just know he's an N. The topics in which he's willing to dwell in are very N, the way that he talks is very N. He fits the INTP description to a T. From hating society, thinking about something academic when people are gossiping, to doing intellectual things with absolutely no practical consequences. The only 'difference' is that he's a huge sports head .
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  4. #54
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    I think Ji/Je would play a stronger role in what one's interests and attitudes towards things are. Ne is abstract in the sense of pulling various ideas together, juxtaposing, and abstracting a point from that. I don't think many would be "obsessed" with sports like marm is pointing out, but something like that could still play a part in their worldview. In fact, they could never call themselves holistic if they were too inclined to wave off subjects - even ones like football. Both Ne doms kind of fancy themselves as having a sort of cosmic view. A strong Ne would probably extrapolate some possibility from sports, whatever that may be. Maybe even the nerdiest of the nerdiest INTP scientists (forgive the stereotype) might use some example or anecdote from baseball to illustrate a method to apply to some seemingly unrelated research they're engaged in. But he would have to know about baseball pretty well to do this. N types are like anyone else who eat, shit, and sleep and deal with subjects and materials on the same planet everyone else lives on. It's how they interpret that makes them a little different. Not what they're interested in per se.

  5. #55
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    ^agreed.

    as an S, i'm highly offended when someone tries to degrade or dumb down or close-mind S types. it may very well be the case that some are, but certainly not a worldwide phenomena.

    i'm an ISFP that will often test as an INFP. i'm most certainly more S than N, however. but a lot of my interests lean towards philosophy, religion, psychology, metaphysics, art, music, dreams and their meanings, anthropology, archaeology, history, culture, language, etc. i have absolutely no interest in sports, or cars, and i don't consider myself to be highly materialistic (in the sense that i don't go out and shop til i drop).

    but i'm a sensor. most of the time, i just explore via my Se and sometimes i'll react upon them. i enjoy dancing and savoring the moment. occasionally, i'll associate meaning or signs to things i come across, or will interpret normal symbols as something more (like an Ne)... but this isn't my natural way of functioning... but it's not as though it's impossible for me to, either.

    you guys forget that we're more than just S or N. a lot of my interests (philosophy, religion, anthropology) are most likely fueled by my primary Fi... or even tertiary Ni.
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  6. #56
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randomnity View Post
    All that "always" and so certain! I think there's an element of truth here but it'll be misleading if you rely on it as anything more than a clue. It's true that S's will tend to prefer (and thus talk about) tangible things more often (people are included in this category) but they'll also talk about ideas sometimes and while Ns are more likely to enjoy more abstract ideas, they still may have a significant interest in tangible things. A lot of the time it'll depend on the relationship between the two people, how much each one likes "small talk", the environment, their mood, their interests...Ns definitely talk about everyday things or their hobbies sometimes.

    But yes, as a general rule of thumb it's probably a useful clue (not the entire argument).
    exactly. also, a perfect example of an istp taking a vague infj overgeneralization and calling bullshit! (i've had it happen to me oh so many times!)

    i'll run my own N vs S tests sometimes to explore types of connections and to get a sense of how i want to proceed with the conversation. while maintaining my confidence level for my hypotheses.

    my brother is an entp and we always begin our talks with sports. true, we branch and navigate the topics in strange ways, considering whether phil jackson's leadership skills would make him a strong candidate to be the leader of the free world, how that would affect our global popularity, and how his political merits compare to bill clinton's. with Ns you can often get a different kind of space, you can keep a lot of hypotheticals going in the background and talk about possibilities that don't quite align while still finding value in the process. N types often (also depends on enneagram) like theory, or mapping out constraints. it's a big part of how we gather perspective, less based on what is known to be true and more based on what could be true. so much about getting the FRAME right. at the same time, the differences between Se/Ne and Si/Ni are just as pronounced. the enjoyment really has to do with your ability to adapt to multiple types of information processing and the communicative needs of those types along with what you're generally looking for in conversation period.

    i like theory, and more than anything in the world, i like possibilities that are difficult to find. when someone has gathered perspectives that are extremely novel, fresh, surprising (kind of like when you take a bite of something prepared in a way that is, for you, absolutely new and you are delighted), well, that's what makes me want to talk. it seems like a combination of that plus a question of whether the participants can find a nice flow and figure out rather quickly what the participants can contribute and how to manage interest to a shared sphere. i generally have a group of ntp friends who are most conducive to my natural interests, but i also have Fi friends who share similar values, who are so grounding and good, and who help me explore and become more at home in my own emotional world. they're able to reflect back aspects of this to me, while kind of surrounding me in their own faith, values, beliefs, etc. when those are in harmony with yours, it's a great feeling. so accepting. it is probably easier to find this with other N types, for me, because they allow me to maintain my ideas, the contradictions, the playfulness of the dark and the light interacting and forming weird chemistry experiments. as long as its honest. i do feel like a crazy person around S types much of the time, which is not exactly the most fun.

  7. #57
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i like theory, and more than anything in the world, i like possibilities that are difficult to find. .
    i like to add on to this, that one of the major differences between S and N is that, S's like practicality.

    for instance, it's not that sensors are anti theorizing... but rather, we must see the practical, applicable use for it.

    i used to major in anthropology. one of the reasons i pulled away from it, though i found it very interesting (cultural, physical, archeology, linguistics), is that with many of the case studies or archeological studies... i found no actual use or purpose that served any real human need. (this factor is a combination of my being a sensor as well as Fi valueing.) what human good can digging up archaeological sites truly serve, other than to feed fascination? that's how i felt. i also felt as though there could be better ways of serving humanity than studying cultural anthropology. i found its benefits to be limiting, and ultimately decided that if i truly wanted to make a difference, to find some other mechanism. such as volunteer work, peace corps, or nursing.

    also, sensors will often pull from their own experiences... it's tangible. i do it all the time. it's easier for me to demonstrate a point if i can easily pull from my own background, rather than coming up with an imaginary scenario.
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  8. #58
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    I can see your point of view on the idea wanting to help in more practical ways, but at the same time, I'm surprised that even though you studied it, you wouldn't see any other application other than feeding our fascination. I'm not sure if that's cynical or practical.

  9. #59
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    don't get me wrong, i thought it was a subject that was of dire importance to study. it really opens up scope. i've told many a friends that they should take an anthropology class or two before making closed minded statements. and in that respects, i found anthropology to be important.

    but i felt as though there wasn't much else to be gained, i suppose. sort of, "who cares?" when it came to case studies about whether or not the first humans in the americas were the clovis people or not. don't get me wrong, it's interesting and all, but all the debates behind it i felt were fruitless. it doesn't make much of an impact one way or another. and i felt the same about many other topics that came up... i also feel as though a lot was just speculation, and we are trying to answer questions that will never truly be answered... or rather would never have a unanimous answer. such has, how did man evolve speech and language. there are too many theories and too many debates on the topic, and ultimately, though it's all very fascinating to consider... what difference does it really make? but i also don't think we'll ever truly have the answer to that.

    sorry... went off topic.
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  10. #60
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyAnnaJoan View Post
    don't get me wrong, i thought it was a subject that was of dire importance to study. it really opens up scope. i've told many a friends that they should take an anthropology class or two before making closed minded statements. and in that respects, i found anthropology to be important.

    but i felt as though there wasn't much else to be gained, i suppose. sort of, "who cares?" when it came to case studies about whether or not the first humans in the americas were the clovis people or not. don't get me wrong, it's interesting and all, but all the debates behind it i felt were fruitless. it doesn't make much of an impact one way or another. and i felt the same about many other topics that came up... i also feel as though a lot was just speculation, and we are trying to answer questions that will never truly be answered... or rather would never have a unanimous answer. such has, how did man evolve speech and language. there are too many theories and too many debates on the topic, and ultimately, though it's all very fascinating to consider... what difference does it really make? but i also don't think we'll ever truly have the answer to that.

    sorry... went off topic.
    I'm not interested in extremely "unanswerable" questions either. History is important to me though because there is meaning to be found (rather than answers, in the sense you're talking about). And some people, although rare, actually have done their little part in using this kind of information to try to help others too. Take Joseph Campbell, for instance. Granted, he wasn't an archaeologist, but a student of history/mythology. Similar subject material. Yet, his own books were more like inspirational self-help titles rather than strictly historical books. His work influenced other writers too, who in turn have tried to help others learn from the past. And you never know where the trail leads. We wouldn't have even some simple pleasures, like some entertaining movies, without the work of archaeologists, historians, or interpreters like Campbell. George Lucas was influenced by him and carried some of those ideas when writing Star Wars. But it all started with someone caring about the past.

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