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  1. #21
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    So what I hear y'all saying is that there's a subtext missing ... that the actual literal communication above is not the issue, there's something else ... correct?
    Perhaps the manager doesn't want to go to the head office to ask for an extension. In which case, it doesn't really matter what the Te user said, or how it was said.

  2. #22
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    I really don't have a problem with the way it was stated in the OP, as long as the undertone was neutral and not, "Good going, moron; there are about 30 factors you didn't consider." And as long as the person stating the roadblocks wasn't the type that was all problem-pointing and never solution-having.

    As others have said, the hardest part would be communicating that to the higher-ups, who often are the "I don't care, just get it done!" types. It's probable that the Ti user would have already thought of all the possible roadblocks and tried to communicate them to the higher-ups before they had to take it to the underlings to get it done.
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  3. #23
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    For me it causes me to think things should be re-worked. I would take it upon myself to approach my superiors to ask for a brief extension, no more than a few days, to accomodate the very real and logical obstacles the 6 January date presented. Sometimes higher ups are out of touch with what is going on with the lower levels, and I would see it as an opportunity to hopefully make a very rational compromise.

  4. #24
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    In the meeting, when you announce the date, the first person to respond says, "You want people to have these evaluations done for their staff by that date? The financials won't be completed by then so there's no data ready to show how well they performed in 2010. The company master plan hasn't yet been updated, so there are no goals for 2011 to use to set new goals or performance targets. Three of the staff are already away for Christmas and won't be back until 3 Jan 2011. They then only have 3 days to do their appraisals."
    Hahaha^^^this sounds exactly like something i would say in a meeting. The enfp down the hall from me got an award at his lab job labeled "stater of the obvious" as he would point out the impossible and bizarre things people were asked to do that no one else in the room would question, but they were all thinking.

  5. #25
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Tone and history go a long way in what is being said. If I am thrown off-guard by someone bluntly pointing out a mistake I made as their superior (actually it has happened to me during lectures), I usually take one of two routes:

    If I'm not sure of the validity of the comment I will say something like, "I will take your comments under advisement", or "thank you for bringing that to my attention, let me think about it".

    If it is obviously true, i will feel embarrassed that I didn't catch it earlier, but I will tend to compliment the person for pointing it out like, "yes, that is true. Thank you for pointing it out. Let me see what I can do to fix it."

    When students have pointed out typos in my presentations or some detail I missed, I will sometimes say, "good catch!" or something like that.

    I'd have to look up the actual studies but people come off as most intelligent with strangers when they listen to what the other person says and compliments them. People tend to have an underlying assumption, "if this person thinks I'm smart and that I have important things to say, they must be pretty smart themselves". At any rate the willingness of an authority figure to be loyal to the information that guides the group in place of personal image can gain a deeper respect and trust. I usually counter a public mistake with extra effort to not make a mistake again or find a way to especially demonstrate competence.
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  6. #26
    Carerra Lu IZthe411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Annwn View Post
    I'd have to look up the actual studies but people come off as most intelligent with strangers when they listen to what the other person says and compliments them. People tend to have an underlying assumption, "if this person thinks I'm smart and that I have important things to say, they must be pretty smart themselves". At any rate the willingness of an authority figure to be loyal to the information that guides the group in place of personal image can gain a deeper respect and trust. I usually counter a public mistake with extra effort to not make a mistake again or find a way to especially demonstrate competence.
    That's a great point, and it's true.

    So as much as the Te-er has to say it in a certain light to not offend, the Fe-er has to be one that isn't more concerned about what people think of him over the issue at hand.

  7. #27
    Writing... Tamske's Avatar
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    Answering the OP.

    To me, it mostly depends on which people are there in the meeting. Do I really need to assert myself as the boss otherwise they just goof off? Or are they good co-workers willing to do effort? In the first case, I would be really embarassed - because, yes, they are right, but they will see it as a "win" (we were right and she was wrong!) and making me feel like I "lost" a bit of my authority again.
    In the second case, I would simply answer: "Wow, you're right. Which date do you propose then?", agree on a new date and communicate this to my superior with the very same reasons. If they are true for me, they are true for my superiors too! I wouldn't see this as a problem but as a helpful solution.

    I'm of course thinking of two different classes. One of them really fought against me and saw every little mistake as a reason to whine and to complain. I didn't want to make mistakes there; they always sought for problems and for reasons why I was the worst teacher ever and why they shouldn't work or study. Every stupid thing that went wrong - even if it was just a forgotten minus sign on the blackboard - was cause for concern and worries for DAYS afterwards.
    On the other hand, I had a very nice class too. When there was a mistake on the blackboard, they just pointed it out, I corrected it and I forgot the incident. It wouldn't take a minute. And when they asked to postpone a test, I didn't really see problems with that either. I felt at ease with that class.
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Looking for advice!
    Here's a scenario: you, Fe/Ti or Ti/Fe person, are leading a work meeting today. You have decided that you need the first phase of all personnel evaluations completed by 6 Jan 2011. Head office gave you that date, and you didn't see a problem with it at first; so you agreed and now need to communicate it down the food chain.
    Te/Fi person here.

    In the meeting, when you announce the date, the first person to respond says, "You want people to have these evaluations done for their staff by that date? The financials won't be completed by then so there's no data ready to show how well they performed in 2010. The company master plan hasn't yet been updated, so there are no goals for 2011 to use to set new goals or performance targets. Three of the staff are already away for Christmas and won't be back until 3 Jan 2011. They then only have 3 days to do their appraisals."
    It sounds like there is a problem with the information flow: how come this was not known before?

    I guess your manager(s) have an incomplete view, and you need to bring this information to them and change the date accordingly.

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