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Extraverted Feeling: A Quick Reference Guide

V

violaine

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I'm interested! (The forum is running so slowly for me at the moment though I don't know how much I'll be able to join in if it doesn't resolve for me.)
 

skylights

i love
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note - if i talk about Fe in a negative manner, it's not to be an asshole, but because it's the negative sides of our functions that are often very hard to see for ourselves. i've learned so much about how i can come off as confusing, or mean, or counterproductive in a Fi way, and i don't think other Fi types could have given me that same kind of feedback as Fe types.

my disclaimer is that i think Fe is excellent and i surround myself with Fe types IRL. :yes:

violane said:
Give, give, give, give, suddenly realize to your own horror that you are being taken advantage of, doorslam to protect self. Must be really confusing from an outsider's POV. Better to monitor boundaries more closely from the outset.

haha, yeah, it is kind of confusing. i think for me it also happens that someone will give, but i don't really want what they're trying to give, and i try to accept it gracefully anyway because i appreciate their effort, but at some point i really need to ask them to stop, and then they get upset. but then probably i should also voice my personal boundaries from the outset, and that wouldn't happen.

anyway, also, i have a Fe dom friend (tested and self-affirmed) who i suspect is a 3w2 sp/so on the enneagram, and she's really interesting in terms of how she neglects herself sometimes. it's more of a psychological neglect - she definitely takes good care of her body - if she has a physical need, like sleep, then she'll attend to it before almost anything else - and she definitely thinks of herself first a lot of the time - but in terms of how she makes commitments to people, she almost always overbooks herself, and has a hard time saying no to people she likes even if she's overwhelmed.

it comes off as very self-sacrificing (which it is) and like she's very, very responsible (which she is), but what can happen sometimes is she'll overbook herself to the point of getting sick of whatever she's committed to, but she doesn't feel like she can get out of it, and she'll become cynical and be a stressed out mess inside, and can't wait to be done with whatever it is.

(of course the Fi flipside self-neglect is self-absorption... both are unhealthy when there's too much of it... anyway. i think it's cool to parallel Fe and Fi just like you can parallel Fe and Te. theoretically all of the functions should be mirror images of one another...)
 

MacGuffin

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I'm not putting the positive spin on Fe here...the author is. It's sugar-coated. As for "real" flaws of Fe, what about mob mentality, for one? There is a slight indication that Fe smothers (They want to nurture people, whether or not the people need to be nurtured)....but it's glossed over.

I'm not really seeing how Fe is sugar-coated in this description. There aren't really many negative aspects discussed in either the Fe or Fi description, but Fi-users seem inclined to see otherwise. The real flaw of Fe being used to bully is no more listed than the Fi flaw of seeking self-martyrdom.
 

Lightyear

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I'm not really seeing how Fe is sugar-coated in this description. There aren't really many negative aspects discussed in either the Fe or Fi description, but Fi-users seem inclined to see otherwise. The real flaw of Fe being used to bully is no more listed than the Fi flaw of seeking self-martyrdom.

I agree. Please let's not get into the whole Fi vs Fe debate again. Yes we Fe-users can be manipulative assholes. Happy now?
 

MacGuffin

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I agree. Please let's not get into the whole Fi vs Fe debate again. Yes we Fe-users can be manipulative assholes. Happy now?

Nice try, superjerk! You're just saying that to seem all vulnerable so you can get your way!
 

JocktheMotie

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I agree. Please let's not get into the whole Fi vs Fe debate again. Yes we Fe-users can be manipulative assholes. Happy now?

Way to take the high road. I can see your manipulative Fe tentacles as clear as day. Now you're just trying to make the Fi users look like hypersensitive whiners at this point that can't get out of their own way long enough to have a legitimate, probing discussion.

Nice try, but I'm not buying it.
 

JoSunshine

That's my name biotch!
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They want to nurture people, whether or not the people need to be nurtured.

They tend to overlook their own emotional and physical needs.

THAT is a huge flaw. "I know what you need better than you do." I have seen examples that are extreme to the point that it is down right repulsive and dependence fostering in the most self-serving way. :sick:

THEN if you take point one and follow it up with point two, you have a real mess on your hands. "Look at everything I do "for you" and I don't even have time to [all the ways I emotionally and physically neglect myself]."

The whole smothering thing and control by "caring" is a real downfall for many Fe users...but not me of course :harhar:
 

OrangeAppled

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I'm not really seeing how Fe is sugar-coated in this description. There aren't really many negative aspects discussed in either the Fe or Fi description, but Fi-users seem inclined to see otherwise. The real flaw of Fe being used to bully is no more listed than the Fi flaw of seeking self-martyrdom.

And other users seem inclined to insist that the Fi-users are saying the Fi description is all negative, when that is not what is being said; it seems to me, the sensitivity is on the side of these, who are taking undue offense at the criticism from the Fi-users of a description. Besides, there is a difference between lack of outright negative commentary and markedly positive comments. Neutrality is fine, but I don't see such neutrality in the other descriptions as clearly as in the Fi one; the others are much more clearly positive, overall. There is also a distinction between negative & inaccurate, or only accurate from a very limited perspective.

We'll see if/when the Ti description is posted how well it is received; but if there is any criticism from Ti-doms, it likely will be viewed as "rational" & justified. However, Ti is much easier to describe than Fi anyway, as Jung himself & several typology authors have noted, so there will probably be less to debate anyway.

Anyway, carry on Fe-ers about how hard it makes your life to be so giving & selfless :rolli: .

JocktheMotie said:
Now you're just trying to make the Fi users look like hypersensitive whiners at this point that can't get out of their own way long enough to have a legitimate, probing discussion.

We were having an interesting discussion in the other thread until people started whining that we dare to critique the Fi quick guide (& this quick guide, for that matter).
 

MacGuffin

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And other users seem inclined to insist that the Fi-users are saying the Fi description is all negative, when that is not what is being said; it seems to me, the sensitivity is on the side of these, who are taking undue offense at the criticism from the Fi-users of a description.

{snip}

Anyway, carry on Fe-ers about how hard it makes your life to be so giving & selfless :rolli: .

Perhaps it is the manner of commentary that colors Fi-users this way?

The first one to criticize the Fe description was a Fi-user:

You know, Fe being attributed as the source of all the F goodness in the world really trods on Fi based giving and altruism. I take exception to these overly glowy descriptions of Fe; where is the dark side? Where is the balance?

Meanwhile, over in the Fi thread the conversation quickly went to how the Fi-users disagreed with parts of it. Not many have said whether the Fi-users were right or wrong in their criticism, I just merely commented on the fact that's how the discussion went for Fi-users in both threads.
 

cafe

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Just reading that description makes me feel exhausted. I mean, I care about people and stuff, but I don't want to actually be around them and do stuff for them all that much. Bleh. It's not personal, I just have stuff I'd rather be doing -- usually by myself.
 

Totenkindly

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Let's not start the Fe vs Fi debates again... We've already done that three zillion times on this forum, doesn't it get old? I mean, it's to the point where I don't even want to open another Fe or Fi thread, or do so only hesitantly.

Just cover Fe.

(Or let's talk about how wonderful Ti is, as Fe's complementary opposite!)
 

MacGuffin

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Let's not start the Fe vs Fi debates again... We've already done that three zillion times on this forum, doesn't it get old? I mean, it's to the point where I don't even want to open another Fe or Fi thread, or do so only hesitantly.

Just cover Fe.

(Or let's talk about how wonderful Ti is, as Fe's complementary opposite!)

They started it!

Mom! Fi-user is touching me!
 

slowriot

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Hey, hey I was a bad kid in the Fi thread too *blushes*


Edit: Am I the only one that cant find the popcorn emoticon? I think it seems useful in Fi/Fe threads.

And we need a liferaft emoticon
 

Forever_Jung

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However, Ti is much easier to describe than Fi anyway, as Jung himself & several typology authors have noted...

Yes I think that is the problem, Fi is tricky. Particularly, it is hard to describe and observe Fi in its positive forms as Jung noted in Psychological Types:

Carl Jung said:
It is unquestionably difficult to give an intellectual presentation of the introverted feeling process, or even an approximate description of it...It is a feeling which apparently depreciates the object; hence it usually becomes noticeable in its negative manifestations. The existence of a positive feeling can be inferred only indirectly, as it were.

p.489-490

So hopefully we can cut the author some slack here on his Fi description.

Edit: All Fi vs. Fe squabbles aside, I thought this was a very good description of Fe.
 

proteanmix

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OK, please let's not do this. I've noticed the people who have tried to make this an issue are the typical people who make such things issues when it comes to Fi and Fe. PB, I can move your most to What's my Type if you'd like.

I have this book Jaguar referenced. He basically copy + pasted the last part of the chapter about each function where they take defining statements from people who use a particular function. Fe and Fi both have nine pages each as do all functions. The chapters describe each function from the outside in and from the inside out. He choose a breakdown of statements from each Key Feature, which means there's also a lot that I'm sure for the sake of effort was left out.

Maybe those who find these descriptions incomplete should check out the book on google books to see if anything was missed in this summary.
 

PeaceBaby

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See, OA and I are very different people (just focussing on the two of us as most vocal); and her contention with these descriptions is not the same as mine, yet both of us (as Fi doms) feel there's something wrong, so we are trying to name it from our own unique POV's.

Because likely the CORE of what's wrong is the same, and that's why we feel the need to pick it apart, see what the CORE issue is because both of us have the same feeling, if not for the exact same reasons.

If her and I (and other Fi-ers) were to work away at exploring that, we would very likely identify the issues and narrow down both their scope and focus.

It's likely INFP's have the most issue, followed by ENFP's ... then we would scrape away at why just we Fi doms take contention with the lists, and then we would dig deeper to internally explore our own selves in this process, perhaps exposing an area or areas of insecurity or growth opportunity.

We will just keep exploring and exploring it, 'til we get to a place where we feel we have true understanding. When I feel something is wrong, I need to work that feeling as long as it takes and for as much effort as it takes, to get myself to feeling right.
 
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