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  1. #571

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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Not really enough info. Almost certainly INxx though. Either INFJ or INFP would be most likely in my estimation, but leaning towards INFJ. INFPs, while subtle, don't tend to go for being deliberately mysterious and obscure.
    She seems to focus a lot on paradoxes and contradictions in her lyrics, which I've read in other threads here is supposed to be indicative of Ni (supposed as in I don't know how true this is). These for example:

    Is it dark already, how light is a light?
    Do you laugh while screaming, is it cold outside?
    Two elements collide in my open hand,
    Making me a viewer. I am water and sand.
    Open atmosphere
    Take me anywhere, take me there.
    We have water mouth
    Sand in pockets and a strained household.
    When the night falls
    There is fire in the bungalow.
    I wanted to see right through from the other side
    I wanted to walk a trail with no end in sight
    She is doggedly true to her own creative ideas, even among accusations of pretension, but I'd imagine that could come with FiNe as well as NiFe. Ne types are the ones more likely to challenge status quo, break out of boxes, right? Is the Ni equivalent simply subverting outdated paradigms, shuffling between them, can't keep one indefinitely dominant?

    "It's always fun to try out different roles," she replies. "I would like to quote [gender theorist] Judith Butler, who says, 'We are always in drag'. That has to do with the idea of authenticity: is there really any time when you are your true self? I would say that we're always playing a role. Even guys with guitars who sing about their emotions, they are playing a role of a person who does that."
    But sometimes it's hard to tell what are 9 motivations from that popular "mystical" painting of Ni. She seems to circle around themes of oblivion, merging with something larger, mysticism, etc a lot. One of the masks she's worn is of an Ibis.

  2. #572

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    This works:

    Entry 94: Introverted Intuition | Drafts

    - Extraverted intuition (Ne) is expansive and brainstorming; introverted intuition (Ni) is singular and intensive.
    - Ne uses patterns to explore the possibilities; Ni uses patterns to assert the inevitability.
    Hello
    Likes uumlau, windoverlake, Ene, Anaximander liked this post

  3. #573
    noʎ ɟo ǝʇnɔ ʍoH Mademoiselle's Avatar
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    Ni is a treasure, faith is the key.
    As for me, I have the key, and the treasure, but I chose not to open the door to womderland, as I have a family and a life to take care of.. A more challenging way to live.

    Die after a worthy life.
    '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
    ||||||||||||
    …Order >> Chaos >> Order
    ————

  4. #574

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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    Very good article! Thank you for sharing it.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14

  5. #575
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    I see he's using my old illustration. I did that when I was coming to understand the difference between the N attitudes more, though still trying to fully grasp, myself, what I was explaining there. (Most of these explanations beat around the bush, and can't seem to put one's finger on exactly what the process actually is).

    I've since come to understand the difference between all function attitudes as doing the same things, but the focus being "individual" vs "environmental". Ne looks at things in light of patterns in the environment (though these patterns may be stored in memory), while Ni (just running across what I said in #523) Ni fills them in with stuff repressed from memory (not necessarily intentionally; likely just deeply forgotten stuff).

    So the illustration is still good if you understand the "i" area as representing the "internal" world of "individual" perception (whether conscious or unconscious memory), and for Ne, memory is where the other patterns (beside the one being observed and compared currently) are referenced, and the connections are made externally, while for Ni, the connection is made in the unconscious; generally looking at one pattern on the outside (not necessarily a bunch of them at a time, as shown, though it could hypothetically connect a bunch).

    This is much simpler than the way I was trying to put it, then.
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  6. #576
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Guys, here is Ni in a nutshell. (Copied from another forum where I feel more comfortable writing things.)

    The Ni in INTJ is not determined by the nature of one's beliefs. Ni is a perceiving function; it is determined by the perception involved. An Ni perception comes to the person in a flash of Great Truth.

    For example, an INTJ I used to work with took a course on genetics. He told me that, as he was examining the nature of the human gene, a great revelation suddenly came upon him. He suddenly realized that genes could not have been created without a Creator.

    Whether this is scientifically true or not is irrelevant due to the nature of the revelation which expresses a Great Truth.

    The nature of the Ne function lies in putting various pieces of evidence together to form a hypothetical concept in need of scientific proof. The Ni Truth does not require scientific proof, it is sufficient unto itself.
    "There seems to be a deep instinct in human beings to make compulsory that which isn't forbidden."

  7. #577
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    Guys, here is Ni in a nutshell. (Copied from another forum where I feel more comfortable writing things.)

    The Ni in INTJ is not determined by the nature of one's beliefs. Ni is a perceiving function; it is determined by the perception involved. An Ni perception comes to the person in a flash of Great Truth.

    For example, an INTJ I used to work with took a course on genetics. He told me that, as he was examining the nature of the human gene, a great revelation suddenly came upon him. He suddenly realized that genes could not have been created without a Creator.

    Whether this is scientifically true or not is irrelevant due to the nature of the revelation which expresses a Great Truth.

    The nature of the Ne function lies in putting various pieces of evidence together to form a hypothetical concept in need of scientific proof. The Ni Truth does not require scientific proof, it is sufficient unto itself.
    Your observation has no need of scientific proof.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  8. #578
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Your observation has no need of scientific proof.
    Neither does the definition of 'table.'
    "There seems to be a deep instinct in human beings to make compulsory that which isn't forbidden."

  9. #579
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Jung believed that Ni perceptions were the product of some unconscious mechanism. This may or may not be the case. It is simply in his background to explain everything psychologically. Psychological Truth is the product of his Ni perception which in itself required no need of scientific proof. And as far as I know, Jung never made a single effort to scientifically validate any axiom he believed.
    "There seems to be a deep instinct in human beings to make compulsory that which isn't forbidden."

  10. #580
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Ayn Rand, who is considered an INTJ, based all of her intellectual beliefs on axioms which she verified on the basis of her unquestionable "instincts" (to use her term). Although later in her life she intellectually recanted the idea of human instinct, those "instincts" stand as axioms which she dogmatically held to and considered incapable of proof, only demonstration "in reality." (See, For The New Intellectual and Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology.)
    "There seems to be a deep instinct in human beings to make compulsory that which isn't forbidden."

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