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  1. #21
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Fi creates an internal framework of what is ideal, and Ti creates one for what is logical. Both deal in terms of concepts more than what works in reality. Although Ti has the advantage of dealing in realms that can be proven more easily in the real world, which adds a dimension of objectivity that Fi does not have because of what it concerns itself with. Both are working off of principles though - where these come from is debatable. Jung suggests the unconscious mind, which brings forth archetypes (something like "mental instincts") as the basis for the Ti-dom's logic or the Fi-dom's values. So there is an almost innate basis for truth, be it logical or moral, for each, and the individual interprets these images into something able to be understood rationally - concepts & frameworks & ideas & values, etc. Everyone has this, but Ti & Fi doms are most in touch with this aspect of it.

    Using Ne is how both INxPs will take in information and compare it to their reasoning so as not to be in a bubble- morbidly obsessed with your own thoughts/feelings without regard for the external world. Both Ti & Fi types who are not using Ne well & are in a bubble will seem very biased and out of touch with reality. When I think of ludicrous conspiracy theories, I think of an unbalanced INTP . There is such a bias for their internal theory they've denied any external evidence to the contrary and seem delusional.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jung on Ti
    introverted thinking shows a dangerous tendency to coerce facts into the shape of its image, or by ignoring them altogether, to unfold its fantasy image in freedom. In such a case, it will be impossible for the presented idea to deny its origin from the dim archaic image
    So what does this have to do with the OP? I see that your thinking is turned inward - you need logical consistency in your ideas and others' ideas. Your feeling is turned outward - it's focused on your relationships with people and adjusts to the external need. Your Ti is guiding your Fe basically - your values have to be consistent with your logical framework. They don't exist for the sake of themselves, they exist because it makes sense to have good relations with people. That furthers Ti's aims in many ways. However your logical analysis is not to serve an external purpose.

    In an INFP, Te is used to support Fi. We make logical judgments based on external criteria, but we tend to focus on facts that support our idealistic feeling theories. Our understanding of what makes sense logically will adjust to the external facts once we see they are solidly proven in reality; but our acceptance of some facts as unchangeable can be in terms of how they relate to our ideals. However, our ideals are formed for their own sake. They do not need to be validated by anything external.

    And please note I'm talking about the Ji & Je functions without discussing the Pe & Pi functions, which makes them sound a bit extreme (there's that bubble again).
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  2. #22
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Where'd you get Jung's Ti description?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Teacher (Idyllic), ESE-IEI (Si-ESFj), SLue|I|, Sanguine-Melancholy
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  3. #23
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Oh Jeez, why does it even matter?
    The more I think/talk about functions, the more I think it's all BS.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  4. #24
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    Oh Jeez, why does it even matter?
    The more I think/talk about functions, the more I think it's all BS.
    Agreed. Too much thinking about one's self tends to make one stupid and selfish

  5. #25
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    Where'd you get Jung's Ti description?

    Well I own Psychological Types, :glances at it:, and my copy has a better translation than that quote, but for copy + paste purposes, I go here:

    Classics in the History of Psychology -- Jung (1921/1923) Chapter 10
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  6. #26
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Well I own Psychological Types, :glances at it:, and my copy has a better translation than that quote, but for copy + paste purposes, I go here:

    Classics in the History of Psychology -- Jung (1921/1923) Chapter 10
    tl;dr, but thanks.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Teacher (Idyllic), ESE-IEI (Si-ESFj), SLue|I|, Sanguine-Melancholy
    Sage, True Neutral (Chaotic Good), Type III Anti-Hero
    Inventive > Artistic > Leisurely > Dramatic
    7w6 > 4w3 > 9w8, weakside sp/so

    Dark Worker (Sacrificing)
    Freewheeling Designer

    Hayekian Asshole


  7. #27
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    tl;dr, but thanks.
    I assure you, it is there .

    But actually, if you scroll down about 2/3 of the way, you'll find the Introverted Type section; Introverted Thinking and the Introverted Thinking Type are the first discussed after that. I navigate that page pretty easily.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  8. #28
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Oh it's not hard to navigate. It's just a wee bit too long.

    EDIT: I was actually asking for your source so I could read what Jung had to say on the other functions, but then I saw that overflow of text... :horor:
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Teacher (Idyllic), ESE-IEI (Si-ESFj), SLue|I|, Sanguine-Melancholy
    Sage, True Neutral (Chaotic Good), Type III Anti-Hero
    Inventive > Artistic > Leisurely > Dramatic
    7w6 > 4w3 > 9w8, weakside sp/so

    Dark Worker (Sacrificing)
    Freewheeling Designer

    Hayekian Asshole


  9. #29
    Consulting Detective Mr. Sherlock Holmes's Avatar
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    The idea that both INFPs and INTPs can have strong logically based ideals kind of makes it harder to tell them apart! But I will assume you are right and that I am INTP.
    JiNe
    Ti | Fi | Ne | Si | Te | Ni | Fe | Se
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    "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  10. #30
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Fe/Ti might look like a more logical value system because the values are based on what is currently happening (which Ti checks for consistency with the internal standard).

    I think of Fe as a giant list of inter-related heuristics for dealing with situations morally. Whereas Fi is more like a list of ideals -- the external situations are analyzed in light of the ideals.

    Fe will make sure to check the environment as completely as possible before judging. Fi will make sure to check the inner ideals as completely as possible before judging. The reason Fe looks more logical is that they can point to things in the world to ground their judgments.

    (Same reasoning is true in reverse for Te/Ti)

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