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  1. #11
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    That's probably true, because my feelings will have an influence on my logic especially if I feel strongly about it. Though sometimes I just come out and say "I know it's not logical but this is how I feel"
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  2. #12
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    That's probably true, because my feelings will have an influence on my logic especially if I feel strongly about it. Though sometimes I just come out and say "I know it's not logical but this is how I feel"
    And truly, feelings on a matter can be just as valid or correct (or in some cases, more so) than detached logic. I think logic may be misconstrued as superior, and feelings to be wholly irrational and unreliable. I've seen people logic their way into trouble and bad marriages and what have you, just as readily as feeling their way into all of the above.

    T doesn't make a person a hard case.
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  3. #13
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    In so many cases, people are always stuck on one dichotomy; most commonly S/N or J/P. Why is this?
    I have always believed that the S/J is too close to call, in particular when referencing to NTJ/STP types. From her comparison of ESTP/ENTJ.
    Both STPs and NTJs want to get things accomplished and get that achievable result as quickly as possible. They tend to make quick decisions.

    All STP types have a core need for having the freedom to choose the next thing they are going to do with a drive to action and to make an impact, whereas NTJ types have a core need for mastery, self-control, knowledge and competence. The difference is STP types’ need for competence is different than the NTJs being competent ahead of doing something and their need to understand something completely before they go ahead and act. STPs will be more likely to quickly grasp the essence of something and then go ahead and take action, gaining competence as they go.

    Furthermore, both NTs and SPs have a preference for taking Pragmatic Roles so the freedom to choose the next action resonates, as autonomy is the hallmark of pragmatic role taking. Pragmatism means doing what ever it takes to reach a goal, often ignoring rules or social norms. For the NTJ, that freedom is around devising and getting others to follow a strategy. For the STP that freedom is more often about the necessary tactical actions to get something accomplished.
    One thing I remain baffled by, is why people believe they can discern differences in type, by using simple dichotomies. At some point there should be an understanding that a global usage precludes the basic understanding that Si is different than Se, as is Ne/Ni and so on.

  4. #14
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I've been told by my parents and elders that I've talked to at length about things and even my math teachers have said I have a better grasp of logic then I give myself credit of, as well as I supposdley I have more common sense then a lot of people even though I don't see it that way.

    And I agree that sometimes feelings are better then logic but sometimes logic is better then feelings it depends on a situation, like for a job if you need to do something but you don't feel like it, your probably better off using logic to convince yourself to do i. Even if''s false logic, because when it comes to convincing yourself to do what you need to succeed/not get fired it doesn't matter how you convince yourself to do the task at hand as long as you do.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  5. #15
    Highly Hollow Wandering's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezra View Post
    In so many cases, people are always stuck on one dichotomy; most commonly S/N or J/P. Why is this?
    IMO: because the dichotomies are a weak and clumsy tool to determine someone's type.

    I'm definitely an INFJ, and yet I systematically type as an INFP. Why? Because I really do like to keep my options open as long as possible before making a decision, for example. Things like that. Things that are supposedly "P". Except that, hey, my Dominant function is Ni, a Perceiving function! So *of course* I like to keep my options open: it's what Ni does... until it finally iNtuits some kind of solution.

    The problem is that the dichotomy tests try to determine my *outside* behaviour (which is what P/J is about) by asking me how *I* see myself. Huh, bad idea, because as an Introvert, the way I see myself is mostly the way I am *inside*. If you want to know how I appear to others, go ask them, not me. If you ask me, I'm going to tell you how I see myself inside, because as an Introvert, that's my main field of interest. So instead of describing my Extraverted Auxiliairy, I'm going to describe my Introverted Dominant - hence the P conclusion.

    The dichotomies could be an accurate way to determine someone's type IF they interacted with each other. "Ah, you're a strong Introvert, we need to take that into account when determining P/J". "Ah, you're a Feeler, we need to adjust the P/J questions to test for Fe rather than Te". Things like that. As they are now, the dichotomies are way too rigid and separate from each other to yield consistent results.

    As just one tool in an array of tests, though, they can bring very valuable information. But only when taken along with other indicators (cognitive processes tests, temperament tests, interaction styles, and so on).

  6. #16
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    It is funny, but I am closest between T and F, but I have no doubts that I am F.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wandering View Post
    .

    I'm definitely an INFJ, and yet I systematically type as an INFP. Why? Because I really do like to keep my options open as long as possible before making a decision, for example. Things like that.
    Yes, my husband likes to take a long time making a decision. Sometimes because he puts off gathering information. However once he comes to a decision, he wants it to be final and to "carry out the plan."

  8. #18
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    I am a very mild J, which could explain why I score high on Ni, Ne, and Ti in the cognitive processes test. My Si is also reasonably developed.

  9. #19
    Highly Hollow Wandering's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    Yes, my husband likes to take a long time making a decision. Sometimes because he puts off gathering information. However once he comes to a decision, he wants it to be final and to "carry out the plan."
    Exactly: *once* a decision is made, then it is usually final and to be carried out. So he and I are definitely "Js on the outside" (which is a redundancy, but anyway), ie how we appear to "the world", to people who are not privy to our internal processes: they see us suddenly making a decision and then sticking to it and trying to implement it as soon as possible . However, to ourselves and to anyone who knows us well, we don't look so much like Js, because of the sheer TIME it can take us to actually make that decision in the first place!

  10. #20
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    It is funny, but I am closest between T and F, but I have no doubts that I am F.
    Hence, IFP. My two strongest are T and I (which I guess you can correlate to mean Ti). Based on that, as Wandering explains would give me a perception auxilary.

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