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  1. #181
    alchemist Legion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chubber View Post
    I have to wonder about why Ni will only consider possible doom, because that is something inferior Ne would do. And as you clearly explain later, that function 3 & 4 are the shadow functions. If the shadow functions are negative, then wouldn't it make sense that function 1 & 2 are positive and thus Ni-Dom/Aux would be positive and not just thinking doom and gloom?





    I'm asking, because I considered being ISTJ based on that doom and gloom, which I then read up on happens to be associated with inferior Ne examples of ISFJ and ISTJ quickly imagining the worst possible outcomes in a new scenario, either people or objective, respectively.
    I know a Ni-dom that definitely has feelings of "this bad thing is going to happen", like say they knew they were going to be fired from their job, and soon enough it happens.

    I'm an ISTJ and I often get panicky about things that could happen, or could have already happened but I don't know about yet. But it's usually not at all accurate like a Ni-dom's prediction would be, it's just going all worst-case-scenario.

    So I would think the position of a function would determine how accurate its prediction is? But I have read that the lower functions do have a negative sort of character. I don't know enough about it really.
    Likes chubber liked this post

  2. #182
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Just give Ni-doms some MDMA and happy pills and the result will be this. Blissful doom!

    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I could not disagree more that Fe users are illogical. That is a baseless stereotype. Any type can be logical or illogical.
    baseless? Fe is defined as illogical, the definition is the base. (Although a real human will not always fit the model, the Fe-type definition is exact)

    If you do not believe in the definitions of the typing system, then how can you even talk about this system ? What are you doing here?

    This shows you do not trust/understand typing at all.

    To discriminate and categorize human behaviour IS stereotyping/archetyping. If you don't like to do that, you are on the wrong forum.

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by robowolf View Post
    Yes definitely, if said Ti user is a Vulcan.
    You mean a Vulcan of Star Trek? Yes that is EXACTLY what Ti is. Its a stereotypical human with maximum Ti. These Vulcans also have second function Ne, because they are kind of weird and alien and abstract. So its a stereotypical INTP.

    Please note that such Ti-Vulcan's are leaving a helpful-trail like an Fe! Their Ti-intent has an unintended Fe-shadow-effect. They do not have Fe, it's just that the act of Ti can be misinterpreted as Fe.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    To me, it doesn't seem rational or logical to put your life in a clear risk for the sake of another unless their life clearly and objectively outweighs yours. When it comes to strangers, there is no way to divine what their worth is, so I do not see worth putting yourself in explicit risk of causing two people to die instead of one.
    .....

    But yes, I am selfish in the sense that if I see that I am about to die, but if I save myself another person will die, I will save myself.

    ...

    Financial gain. I am not spiritual and do not care about that. This has no bearing on type at all though.
    If I take everything you say as the truth, this is the simple answer:

    You are logically-selfish (nothing wrong with that). You are a Ti-user. (probably INTP).

    You are not an ENFJ for sure. ENFJ's are very spiritual, they will never say financial gain. Also their Ni will avoid the possibility of negative stereotype being attached to them if they would say "financial gain" (They are like smart social snakes keeping things discrete, even if they actually wanted financial gain, they would never say it for fear of being seen as a bad person).
    Also the fact that you write quite a lot is a sign you do not have Ni like an ENFJ, you are simply not discrete enough to have Ni.

    But we were not talking about Ni, we were talking about the fact whether you were Fe or Ti as first function.
    If you had Fe you would be willing to sacrifice yourself. An Fe roughly operates as a collective, not as an individual. Fe goes down with the ship, trying to keep it up even if its illogical from an individual/selfish perspective. Ti abandons the ship to save himself. You fall in the last category. (Nothing wrong with that).

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by chubber View Post
    I have to wonder about why Ni will only consider possible doom, because that is something inferior Ne would do. And as you clearly explain later, that function 3 & 4 are the shadow functions. If the shadow functions are negative, then wouldn't it make sense that function 1 & 2 are positive and thus Ni-Dom/Aux would be positive and not just thinking doom and gloom?
    Inferior Ne? Inferior Ne = 3rd/4th function Ne = shadow of 1st/2nd function Si. So you are talking about Si.
    So you think that Si considers possible doom. But Si cannot see so far. Si only sees actual problems (you could call it "actual doom", but "actual doom" would be just smaller daily problems than ultimate destruction). Si looks closer, more the actual, more the details. Real doom is too far and too blurry for an Si. Only the Ni has its perceptual lens exactly tuned for far-far-far-away ultimate doom.

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hive View Post
    While routine may be paramount for many aspies in their everyday lives, they do in fact perceive and understand other people's emotions well (cognitive empathy), but have trouble responding appropriately to them (affective empathy). Also the shitload of artists with the condition (Stanley Kubrick, David Byrne, Gary Numan, to name a few) speaks volumes about their capacity for imagination.
    The understanding of emotions is perception, its Ne insight.

    The very social and helpful ESFJs for example have totally no insight into others, they just blindly help:.
    - Ne understands/perceives/has-insight-into the other, but it does not act upon it. (e.g. have trouble responding, trouble with affective empathy, as you said). Ne is perception only it doesn't act.
    - Fe acts upon it / responds to it, but doesn't understand/perceive/have-insight into the other at all. Fe is judgement only, it cannot perceive.

    And obviously Ne is imagination.

    And obviously Ti is for the whole logical routine thing.

    So stereotypical asperger is just stereotypical INTP

  8. #188
    failed poetry slam career chubber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Researcher View Post
    Inferior Ne? Inferior Ne = 3rd/4th function Ne = shadow of 1st/2nd function Si. So you are talking about Si.
    So you think that Si considers possible doom. But Si cannot see so far. Si only sees actual problems (you could call it "actual doom", but "actual doom" would be just smaller daily problems than ultimate destruction). Si looks closer, more the actual, more the details. Real doom is too far and too blurry for an Si. Only the Ni has its perceptual lens exactly tuned for far-far-far-away ultimate doom.
    I was actually referring to the inferior Ne of the ISxJ.

    Catastrophizing

    Whereas effective dominant Extraverted Intuitive types thrive on the exciting possibilities the future will bring, Introverted Sensing types in the grip of inferior Extraverted Intuition anticipate the future with fear and trembling. As their descent into the grip proceeds, they become ever more negative, less willing to tolerate the unfamiliar, and more wildly imaginative about disastrous outcomes. One ISFJ described this as “awfulizing.”
    This is why I thought that Ne-Dominant is seen as positive where as Ne-Inferior as negative.

    Which is why I questioned your original statement about Ni-Dominant predicting doom and gloom, which in my view would be negative. I would like to update my understanding, since I seem to be confused between the two.

    Example, if Ni-Dominant is negative, would Ni-Inferior then be positive? (I don't see that happening for ISFPs where Ni is Tertiary, unless maybe they are real ESFJs)



    edit: Or do you mean that when Ni-Dominant is in the grip of their inferior Se?

    Dealing with details, especially in an unfamiliar environment, can trigger inferior Extraverted Sensing in Introverted Intuitive types. In fact, these types frequently mention that feeling overwhelmed by details often provokes characteristic inferior function reactions. Unexpected events that interrupt planned activities can also unsettle INTJs and INFJs enough to arouse their inferior function. One INFJ said that “sometimes it can be something like having to get from the airport to a hotel. It can happen if I’m driving a rental car in a foreign city, and even if I’m in my own country.”

  9. #189
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Himeko009 View Post
    Many forget, but Asperger's is not a personality disorder, is a neurological condition! They can be of any type, although they tend to introversion and have difficulty with the Fe (As to understand social rules, not empathy itself).
    I completely missed this earlier. Yup. @Researcher I think you're being too bias about @Hard's type. it seems as though after he said he was on the spectrum you immediatly started insisted he was an INxx type, which is fallacious as you do not have enough info from one thread to accurately type him. Also I am very weary of online typing the people I've typed in real life (which has only been about a handful but 100% correct) if I had typed them based off what they share online I would've been way off.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  10. #190
    Senior Member robowolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Researcher View Post
    You mean a Vulcan of Star Trek? Yes that is EXACTLY what Ti is. Its a stereotypical human with maximum Ti. These Vulcans also have second function Ne, because they are kind of weird and alien and abstract. So its a stereotypical INTP.
    I agree that Vulcans are Ti-Ne, but they're not stereotypical INTPs. INTPs are Ti-Ne-Si-Fe, their feeling function is the last one and might be a bit underdeveloped but it's there. They're much more comfortable making logical decisions but they're still human.

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