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  1. #1
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    Default Demonic vs. Inferior functions

    How are they different, really? I know the demonic function is in the 8th position and the inferior is in the 4th. For INTPs, that's Fi and Fe, respectively. But what I don't understand is how the role of the demonic function is different from the role of the inferior. How would demonic Fi play out in INTP? I've tried to find information about the demonic function without much luck.

    Also I've read about the inferior function being the weakest function. But then, what about functions 5-8, are they supposedly weaker than the inferior? Is the demonic function the weakest of them all?

    I hardly ever hear anything said about functions 5-8 from an MBTI perspective. One reason why I prefer socionics theory to MBTI theory is with the socionics theory, there is extensive descriptions of the 8 functions and what they do (Model A) . In MBTI, it seems like functions 5-8 are hardly ever talked about as if they're out somewhere in the netherworld. Yet we obviously use functions 5-8 on a daily basis. We have to use all 8 functions to survive as normal beings.
    Last edited by Such Irony; 08-01-2010 at 08:26 PM.
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  2. #2
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Have you seen the "Archetypes of the Functions" sticky, especially the last few pages?
    (I also made a better compilation of all the stuff over on PersonalityCafe).

    For one, It's not about strengths, it's about the suppression of complexes and their associated perspectives into the unsconscious. So Feeling in general is inferior, with the external orientation somewhat suppressed, and the internal orientation even more suppressed.
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    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

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  3. #3
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Also, Fi is essentially the alternate path of Ji, so it's going to feel entirely alien to someone whose primary is Ti. It's like knowing how to do something to an expert level, then having all of that taken away and being forced to relearn how to make those internal deliberations while being prohibited from using your old virtually instinctive approach.

    (Ti doesn't demand that you be in touch with yourself and your internal states and use those as an evaluative method, it is all about detaching from the personal inclinations and being "impersonal." With Fi, those internal states and instincts and how they mesh up with the external world are actually the things that help you determine right from wrong, good from bad.)

    Fe's different since it is aimed outwardly, whereas Ti is aimed inwardly; they don't get into each other's territory as much.
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  4. #4
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    My Fe sucks and my Fi is pretty good. But since im an intp i dont use Fi as easily as i use Fe, because Fi would clash with my Ti, because they are both introverted judging functions. Fe wont clash with Ti that easy because the judgment is aimed in different ways(this is why each type has one Ji, Pe, Je and Pi function as the main 4 functions).

    I use my Fi mainly to deny me from doing things that it finds immoral, which Ti judgment alone might accept, its kinda like a moral rule set. I also use it for empathizing, but for small stuff i prefer using sympathy, but when the empathy hits, it hits me much harder than sympathy, because the Fi is stronger than Fe and also i use empathy instead sympathy on things that really matter(but sometimes i might feel vivid empathy on some small things too). Also i use it to process my feelings, but i dont normally have to do this much since im not a big feeler, except i have felt kinda emo for about a year because of this one thing.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    This should be stickied as the most important thread on this board right now.

    I would very much like some more information on this, because it doesn't make much sense. People keep saying I can't possibly be using Ti because I'm NeFiTeSi. Si is supposed to be the one I use with more difficulty right? Because it's the inferior. Well then what does that say about Se being the demonic?



    It would be nice if someone gave concrete examples and explanations for how all the 8 functions affect a particular type, just an example.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    People keep saying I can't possibly be using Ti because I'm NeFiTeSi.
    It is common knowledge that the attitude of the Tertiary function has always been under dispute, which is why it is given so much latitude. Furthermore, in many of the books published by CAPT (Center for Application of Psychological Type) they refrain from even identifying the attitude of the Tertiary function. So for ENFPs, they list the order as:

    Ne
    Fi
    T
    Si

    One of the theories that exists in the type community is the Tertiary is flexible, which means the person can use either, or both, attitudes. In other words, an ENFP can indeed be using Ti, Te, or toggle back and forth, at will, depending upon the situation the person my find themselves.

  7. #7
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    Ok...so in an ENFP, Se would be my demonic function? Hmm I don't see it, though I guess Se can scare me when it's out of control, like I appreciate Se but the dark side of Se is terrifying to me...I don't want to race motorcycles or even get on crazy rollercoasters, and I trust the relative security of Si much more...I also use a buttload of Si for an ENFP, I think.

    So I almost wonder if we looked at this as INFP....that would make Ti my demonic function, and that's totally true. On functions test I score absolute lowest on Ti and it can annoy me to no end, even in academics...I'm like "wow look at this pretentious blah blah blah!" Yeah...

  8. #8
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    I just don't see Fi as being my demonic. I suppose I could be INTJ, but then I'd have Si as demonic, which makes less sense. I actually have pretty good Si and its alot more developed than Se.

    For one thing, I score high on Fi in function strength tests. One of the tests I took, had Fi on the top and scored me as an INFP. I really don't think I'm an INFP and demonic Ti makes absolutely no sense.


    The functions and their positions fit nicely for me in socionics theory..........
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  9. #9
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    hey guys, here's one description list for the function roles.

    Quote Originally Posted by cognitiveprocesses.com - adapted from Understanding Yourself and Others: An Introduction to the Personality Type Code

    The Roles of the Processes
    In each of the sixteen types, each of the eight processes plays a different “role” in the personality. The type code lets you know what role each process plays for each type. This is called “type dynamics.” It is also referred to as the “hierarchy of functions”: Dominant, Auxiliary, Tertiary, and Inferior. The roles are explained below to help you better understand the patterns. In most of what we do we rely on two of the processes—a preferred way of accessing information and a preferred way of organizing and evaluating that information. As we look more closely we can see that one process takes a leading role and the other takes a supporting role.

    In truth, we have access to all eight cognitive processes—the other six are often in the background, playing other kinds of roles. Each has a positive and a negative way of expressing itself. Each bears a different energy cost when we use it.


    The Primary Processes
    The primary processes are those used in the first four roles. Each process tends to emerge and develop at different times in our lives. During these times we are drawn to activities that use these processes. Then, learning the content and the skills that engage these processes is often nearly effortless. We find our interest is drawn to them and our interest is pulled away from things we were drawn to before.

    • The Leading Role (Dominant) (sometimes referred to as the 1st function)
      The process that plays the leading role is the one that usually develops early in childhood. We tend to engage in this process first, trusting it to solve our problems and help us be successful. Being the most trusted and most used, it usually has an adult, mature quality to it. While we are likely to engage in it rather automatically and effortlessly, we have much more conscious control over it. The energy cost for using it is very low. Much like in the movies, the leading role has a heroic quality as using it can get us out of difficult situations. However, we can sometimes “turn up the volume” on this process and become overbearing and domineering. Then it takes on a negative dominating quality.

    • The Supporting Role (Auxiliary) (sometimes referred to as the 2nd function)
      The supporting role is how we are helpful to others as well as supportive of ourselves. Once we have developed some facility with our leading role process, we are more likely to feel comfortable engaging in our supporting role process. In its most positive form, this can be quite like a nurturing parent. In its more negative aspect, it can be overprotective and stunting rather than helpful. When the leading role process is an extraverted one, the supporting role process is introverted. When the leading role process is an introverted one, the supporting role process is extraverted and may be quite active and visible as it provides a way of dealing with the outer world.

    • The Relief Role (Tertiary) (sometimes referred to as the 3rd function)
      The relief role gives us a way to energize and recharge ourselves. It serves as a backup to the supporting role and often works in tandem with it. When we are younger, we might not engage in the process that plays this role very much unless our life circumstances require it or make it hard to use the supporting role process. Usually, in young adulthood we are attracted to activities that draw upon this process. The relief role often is how we express our creativity. It is how we are playful and childlike. In its most negative expression, this is how we become childish. Then it has an unsettling quality, and we can use this process to distract ourselves and others, getting us off target.

    • The Aspirational Role (Inferior) (sometimes referred to as the 4th function)
      The aspirational role usually doesn’t develop until around midlife. We often experience it first in its negative aspect of projecting our “shoulds,” fears, and negativities onto others. The qualities of these fears reflect the process that plays this role, and we are more likely to look immature when we engage in the process that plays this role. There is often a fairly high energy cost for using it—even when we acquire the skill to do so. As we learn to trust it and develop it, the aspirational role process provides a bridge to balance in our lives. Often our sense of purpose, inspiration, and ideals have the qualities of the process that plays this role.


    The Shadow Processes
    The other four cognitive processes operate more on the boundaries of our awareness. It is as if they are in the shadows and only come forward under certain circumstances. We usually experience these processes in a negative way, yet when we are open to them, they can be quite positive.

    • The Opposing Role (sometimes referred to as the 5th function)
      The opposing role is often how we get stubborn and argumentative—refusing to “play” and join in whatever is going on at the time. It might be easy for us to develop skill in the process that plays this role, but we are likely to be more narrow in our application of this skill, and it will likely take more energy to use it extensively. In its positive aspect, it provides a shadow or depth to our leading role process, backing it up and enabling us to be more persistent in pursuit of our goals.

    • The Critical Parent Role (sometimes referred to as the 6th function)
      The critical parent role is how we find weak spots and can immobilize and demoralize others. We can also feel this way when others use the process that plays this role. It is often used sporadically and emerges more often under stressful conditions when something important is at risk. When we engage it, we can go on and on. To access its positive side of discovery, we must learn to appreciate and be open to it. Then it has an almost magical quality and can provide a profound sense of wisdom.

    • The Deceiving Role (sometimes referred to as the 7th function)
      The deceiving role fools us into thinking something is important to do or pay attention to. The process that fills this role is often not trusted or seen as worthy of attention, for when we do engage it, we may make mistakes in perception or in decision making. Then we feel double bound—trapped between two bad options. Yet this role can have a positive side as it provides comic relief. Then we can laugh at ourselves. It can be refreshing and join with the relief role as we recharge ourselves through play.

    • The Devilish Role (sometimes referred to as the 8th function)
      The devilish role can be quite negative. Using the process that plays this role, we might become destructive of ourselves or others. Actions (or inactions) taken when we engage in the process that plays this role are often regretted later. Usually, we are unaware of how to use the process that fills this role and feel like it just erupts and imposes itself rather unconsciously. Yet when we are open to the process that plays the devilish role, it becomes transformative. It gives us the impetus to create something new—to make lemonade out of lemons, rather than lament their sourness.
    so with the shadow processes, are they saying they're typically experienced negatively because when they do poke out from the shadows of our subconscious, it's because they're being a pain?

    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise
    Ok...so in an ENFP, Se would be my demonic function? Hmm I don't see it, though I guess Se can scare me when it's out of control, like I appreciate Se but the dark side of Se is terrifying to me...I don't want to race motorcycles or even get on crazy rollercoasters, and I trust the relative security of Si much more...I also use a buttload of Si for an ENFP, I think.

    So I almost wonder if we looked at this as INFP....that would make Ti my demonic function, and that's totally true. On functions test I score absolute lowest on Ti and it can annoy me to no end, even in academics...I'm like "wow look at this pretentious blah blah blah!" Yeah...
    lol, i feel the same way about Ti, it's my crappiest function by leaps and bounds. i have to admit, the deceiving role sounds pretty accurate.

    Se, on the other hand, i really like. i'm not very good at noticing bundles of detail all at once, but i get sensory stuff in Fi pulses/impressions... i really love letting Ne "tune out" sometimes, and letting Se automatically tune in, like a passive thing - during yoga, driving (fast), biking, horseback riding, floating in the ocean, rollercoasters with lots of flips and turns, etc. ... it's calming and reenergizing to me. not to mention i kind of love the adrenaline rush when pushing it with the more physical things

    i have a hard time thinking i'm really that psychologically advanced to have my last function going decently for me, but maybe i just got lucky to like things like very tactile arts (pottery, painting, drawing, etc.) and enjoying pushing the limits physically, both of which happen to involve Se. maybe the energy i use for Se ends up being taken away from poor Ti too O_o;
    Last edited by skylights; 08-02-2010 at 12:34 PM. Reason: made it slightly less intensively rainbow, haha

  10. #10
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Wow. Ok, tnx Skylights for posting this. I needed to go through this again. This, with the previous threads on ENFPs and INFPs(common issues) has made things clear to me.

    Thank you so much.
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