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INTPs - why do they love fancy-shmancy snooty debates?

Eric B

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Another way to understand it is through the classic temperament blends.
NT is Choleric in the area of leadership and action. This means they have a sort of aggressiveness (I.e. "Pragmatic") as well as an independence from submission to others. The Interaction Style (social area) tells us the other temperament blended with Choleric. ENP is Sanguine. So ENTP is. SanChlor, and this is said to be the most rambunctious and competitive of all the blends. The INTP is less so because of the introversion, of course. They're less "expressive".

While the NTP's are "informative" or people-focused, socially, the NTJ's are directive, or task-focused, and hence don't come across as argumentative as NTP's; as debating is relating to people.
 
T

ThatGirl

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My father is an INTP and it pisses me off more when he tries to "dumb himself down." So condescending.

Other than that, usually the only other thing that bugs about the way INTPs speak, is that they have zero concept of priority. How to paraphrase the most relevant aspects of the content.

I don't usually get fed the criticisms in the OP.
 

mrcockburn

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I think that's the difference. The INTPs (and their cousins) see the process of the debate (and its foundation) as important, whereas I just want to get to the bottom-line and get something done about the problem we're debating.

It's why I don't usually debate politics unless I plan to take action (that is, grass-roots LOL) and I need to summon people for a rally, list, etc.
 

Nonsensical

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:steam: :violin: :angry: :smoke: :eek: :duel: :rules: :BangHead: :jofticon_1: :tongue10: :nono: :dry: :thumbdown: :glasses: :glasses: :glasses: :worthy: :thelook: :strawman: :girlfight: :redherring: :2ar15: :chillpill::moodeath: :jesus: :spam_laser: :popc1: :2up: :yay:

Ah, emoticons. That hopefully scared off all the INTPs. :wink: Now we can slam discuss them in peace.

All types love their debates, and all types have debate snobs, but what's the deal with the INTPs?

"Ad hominem", "logical fallacies" "red herring" "strawman argument" "circular fallacy" "Scrotum reasoning" BLAH all of this Harvard latin jargon...

:wtf: Is all of that? (Sorry, just had to get rid of any :ninja: INTP scragglers...) They will go ON and ON with their snooty armchair philosophy legal studies debates, and the only red herrings I know of belong in my SAMMICH.

I'm supposed to be reading poems for homework tomorrow... :ninja: YAY procrastination!

LOL. thanks you soooo much. I'm applauding you right now :jew:
 
G

Glycerine

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Other than that, usually the only other thing that bugs about the way INTPs speak, is that they have zero concept of priority. How to paraphrase the most relevant aspects of the content.
haha, it's awesome when it goes like this:

INTP: *long 10 minute explanation*
Me (in a sentence or two): "So you were pretty much saying this....."
INTP: "yeah, pretty much"
Me (thinking): "Why couldn't you have just said that... grrr"
 

MacGuffin

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haha, it's awesome when it goes like this:

INTP: *long 10 minute explanation*
Me (in a sentence or two): "So you were pretty much saying this....."
INTP: "yeah, pretty much"
Me (thinking): "Why couldn't you have just said that... grrr"

I find about half the INTPs love explaining things in a conscise and witty manner.

The other half can be windbags.
 

ZPowers

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Ok, I just googled it. Red Herring = Intentional diversion.

WHY DON'T YOU PEOPLE JUST SAY THAT? It's the same number of words!! :doh:
Red Herring is fewer syllables (or, if typing/writing, letters). Acousticophobia is fewer words than 'fear of noise', but 'fear of noise' takes less time to say. Plus, I tend to think of a red herring as a clue, argument or piece of evidence that has been planted to throw someone off, while a diversion would be, say, setting a fire or causing a blackout so no one pays attention to you committing some other crime or act simultaneously. Also, I think Red Herring sounds better.

And we wouldn't have one of the best lines from 'Clue': "Communism was just a red herring!"
 

LunarMoon

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1. Because there's too many words to expect everyone to know them all, do you not realize how many words exist in the English language, never mind the idioms etc. I only first heard of these obscure terms here on TypeC.
Debate Lingo is limited to some thirty phrases and I only see ten of them used on a regular basis. If you can remember ten names, dates, or episodes of Lost, then memorizing ten Latin phrases, that are supposedly used in a superfluous manner, should not be difficult.

2. How many times have you had to hear/use the term "strawman fallacy" in your professional/social life?
Quite a bit, especially if you account for internet discussions. If I were to dabble in politics or the debate club that I attended in high school then that number would be increased by ten times. I certainly use the ten Latin phrases that I know of more often than my knowledge of German or French.

3. Actually, I *am* learning a second language. Actually, I'm learning 3 at once. So the last thing on my agenda is to learn about :redherring: .
Then you are an extreme exception and should be proud of that fact. That said, if you're attempting to chug down the entire Japanese Katakana system, for instance, then memorizing "red herring" will be the least of your worries.
 

Orangey

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The fallacies are easy to remember. In fact, it was necessary for the written portion of the GRE (though admittedly they did not require that we memorize the Latin.) They're also used ALL THE TIME in academic writing.

I memorized them early on (in high school) because I was tired of coming across phrases like "post hoc" in my reading and either not knowing, or having to cross-reference, their meaning. It seems like I'd be missing a lot, or incompetent in some way, if I didn't know them (especially since they're simple and pretty easy to remember.) And once you know them, it's difficult not to use them for greater concision.
 

Fluffywolf

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I love to think. I love to think more than anything in the whole world.

I love to debate, I love it so much that I love it more than having sex.

I sometimes secretly debate in the hopes of elevating the thought processes of the other sentient being to my level. It doesn't happen much, but when it does and that connection is made, I will likely spew a fountain of glorifying emotions throughout my body and possibly even ejaculate..
 

Resonance

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I'd just like it to go on record that Fluffywolf in no way represents the majority of INTPs nor do their comments reveal any sort of special insight into the minds of NTPs.

:coffee:
 

miss fortune

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to answer the OP... sexual frustration... the happy and easy label to slap on anything :coffee:
 

Fluffywolf

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I'd just like it to go on record that Fluffywolf in no way represents the majority of INTPs nor do their comments reveal any sort of special insight into the minds of NTPs.

:coffee:

Partypooper.


If I am to seriously reply to this topic, I would merely repeat what I have often said before. And thus the reason INTP's like to debate, without further delay, is this:

When there is a subject of certain value that is debatable, because of subjective values, where the answer is not black and white or answerable in a simple logical fashion. We INTP's like to measure and expand, step by step, take in the views of others, put them next to ours, search our memory banks for related points of interest and debating in great detail. Because we our still processing and constructing our own view on the matter. We either solidify, or molding/changing, our view on the matter into a better, more encompassing standpoint. This is an ongoing process that will never truely stop for us on such grey matters.

When we start the debate, we have an image of how we wish to portray our opinion, that is often a very complex web of thoughts and subjects, making relations to other similar matters. As we debate we put all those thoughts out there, and we love it when people target any of these particular thoughts with potentially better arguements. Then we may assimilate those arguements into our own repertoire, or as a new perspective has opened up for us, take those arguements and mold it in a more complex better arguement.

Our view on the matter will then grow and solidify further. And we will be satisfied having more knowledge to back up our opinions for the future.

We debate the way we do in order to grow and expand. To reach better, stronger, unbreakably solid views on everything that falls into the grey category. Why do we do this? Because when we decide and act in our lives, we do not wish to rely on merely our feelings or intuition. Instead we prefer to base our general direction on arguementation and thought. That is where our strength lies, that is who we are through and through.

We project ourselves outwardly into the world based on a complex array of conscious thoughts. We use our intuition to create structure from chaos, we use feeling to add a moral perspective to our way of thinking, but what we project externally is the finalized product. The package tested by our conscious mind and accurately stamped "ready for delivery".
 

Salomé

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^It's not the debating OP objects to. It's the fancy-shmancy snootiness. IOW, the fact that we always win. :coffee:
And once you know them, it's difficult not to use them for greater concision.

Since when has concision been an ENTP priority? ;)
 

Fluffywolf

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^It's not the debating OP objects to. It's the fancy-shmancy snootiness. IOW, the fact that we always win. :coffee:

But it's not about winning, it's about getting better. If they don't want to get in on our action and are left behind, it's not our fault for winning, it's their fault for losing!
 

Helios

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"Ad hominem", "logical fallacies" "red herring" "strawman argument" "circular fallacy" "Scrotum reasoning" BLAH all of this Harvard latin jargon...

:wtf: Is all of that? (Sorry, just had to get rid of any :ninja: INTP scragglers...) They will go ON and ON with their snooty armchair philosophy legal studies debates, and the only red herrings I know of belong in my SAMMICH.

Technical terms are useful because they allow something to be quickly designated, without the need to resort to lengthy definite descriptions. If you do not understand what this or that term means, I suggest that you either learn what it (conventionally) does mean, or do not participate in debate that might demand a modicum of intelligence from its participants.
 
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