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View Poll Results: Which group has more difficulty as it relates to gender norms, life, and society?

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  • Male NFs

    52 59.77%
  • Female NTs

    35 40.23%
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  1. #91
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    A lot of men say they want strong, independent women, but then get all pissed off when they actually display their strength and independence by defying their expectations. The crux of the matter is that females have it worse than males already, tossing in NTness in an SJ world just makes it worse. For the NF male, well, at least he's still a male.

    Plus, isn't Edward from Twilight an NF male? Case closed.



  2. #92
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    I think it's unwise to assume males have advantages in most everything, compared to females.... specially nowadays. Men have some distinct advantages in "western" society, but women have some equally distinct advantages. On the whole I don't think men are any better equipment to tackle life and I must say it kinda irks me to hear people perpetuating (I don't mean you per se Jock) that idea. Mostly because when it comes to social conduct and stuff...self-fulfilling prophecies are really common.


    That being said, I have no idea how to answer the topics question. I certainly don't think being an NF male or an NT female is a bad omen...on the contrary actually. It's just a matter of learning how to use the weapons at your disposal. I think NF males and NT females have the potential to be extremely well balanced individuals (compared to the society ST and SF respective expectations).

  3. #93
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
    News flash: No one has it easy! Life is not easy. And one persons dramas are not easier than another from their personal perspective because no one has it easy.
    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    And no one may have it easy, but some may have it easier. To say that all people go through life with the same level of ease is ridiculous.
    Absolutely on both counts.

    Mind you, this is an irrelevant discussion. A white NF male born in an "old money" family will have it easier than a black ESTJ (or whatever your "optimum" type is) born to a single mom in the ghetto. Of course this is an exaggeration since most people are somewhat in the middle but my point is that the most important factors that make life "easier" are completely unrelated to type.

    By the same token, if you're brought up to have social skills and common sense, this will go a long way towards making life easy, regardless of type.

    If we're going to narrow in on isolated type, I would say that extroverts have it "easier" than introverts before talking about T and F. Or even judgers vs. perceivers.

    And if you're comparing NT vs NF you might as well compare ST vs SF too. I don't think there's any relative difference in the "gender role" upset - or if anything, it's larger for Ss since we tend towards more practical, hands-on things that are more readily separated into gender-specific careers (mechanic, fire fighter, whatever). So it's arguably more of a discord with ST females than NTs.

    Not to mention, even in an isolated, hypothetical situation, I don't think the two can be compared since you can't take away the difference in gender.
    -end of thread-

  4. #94
    ¡MI TORTA! Amethyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goodgrief View Post
    That's because you're a goblin.
    Haha, good call.

  5. #95
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    I think it's unwise to assume males have advantages in most everything, compared to females.... specially nowadays. Men have some distinct advantages in "western" society, but women have some equally distinct advantages. On the whole I don't think men are any better equipment to tackle life and I must say it kinda irks me to hear people perpetuating (I don't mean you per se Jock) that idea. Mostly because when it comes to social conduct and stuff...self-fulfilling prophecies are really common.
    It's not an assumption. It's one of those inconvenient fact thingys.

    Facts like:


    • Women do two thirds of the world's work yet receive only 10% of the world's income and own 1% of the means of production
    • Two thirds of the world's illiterate people are women
    • 90% of people with eating disorders are women
    • The ratio of women to men in political power is 1:5


    Here are some from the "western" country in which I live:


    • Women earn on average 23% less than men
    • At least 100,000 women are raped each year and the conviction rate is only 6.5%
    • 1 in 4 women will experience violence at the hands of a current or former partner.



    Sorry it "irks" you. It irks me too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #96
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    ^ Where did you get the 2/3 of the work statistic? Is that measured in raw hours?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  7. #97
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    ^ Where did you get the 2/3 of the work statistic? Is that measured in raw hours?
    It's widely cited.
    Original source seems to be Barber Conable, president of the World Bank. It covers paid and unpaid work.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  8. #98
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Wow. That sucks.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  9. #99
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    It's not an assumption. It's one of those inconvenient fact thingys.

    Facts like:


    • Women do two thirds of the world's work yet receive only 10% of the world's income and own 1% of the means of production
    • Two thirds of the world's illiterate people are women
    • 90% of people with eating disorders are women
    • The ratio of women to men in political power is 1:5


    Here are some from the "western" country in which I live:


    • Women earn on average 23% less than men
    • At least 100,000 women are raped each year and the conviction rate is only 6.5%
    • 1 in 4 women will experience violence at the hands of a current or former partner.



    Sorry it "irks" you. It irks me too.
    By perpetuating, I meant indoctrinating young women to think a priori they stand no chance.

  10. #100
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    By perpetuating, I meant indoctrinating young women to think a priori they stand no chance.
    I'd rather young women knew what they were up against. Might shake them out of their apathy. If it doesn't, they deserve what they get.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

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