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  1. #1
    Senior Member paradox fox's Avatar
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    Default MBTI and Cognitive Functions

    All right. So I understand MBTI types and how they are determined, and I mostly understand the Eight Cognitive Functions and can give examples of each function. I see what the pattern is for putting them in order (Fi Ne Si Te, Se Ti Fe Ni, etc.) What I don't understand is how the two are correlated.

    How did they determine and assign those combinations for all the different MBTI types? Was it through induction (reading the type description and assigning the combination) or deduction (combination first, correlated to type second)? (Hope I got induction and deduction straight, but that is entirely beside the point!)

    Also, is there a way to just look at a code and know if it's a Judging or Perceiving type, without having to straight up memorize them all?

    That's all.
    Just because I'm an INFP doesn't mean I'm emo!

  2. #2
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    I would say deduction.

  3. #3
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Take the four-letter type and pick out the middle two letters, for example INFP...we get N and F.

    This tells you that N and F will be the top two functions.

    Next, look at P/J--this tells you which of those two functions is extroverted (not which one is dominant.) If you're a P type, the N/S will be extroverted; if you're a J type, the T/F will be instead.

    So for INFP, we have N and F, and the P tells us that the N is extroverted, so we get Ne and Fi.

    Lastly, the I tells us that the introverted one is dominant, so we have dominant Fi and secondary Ne.

    So these four functions are used in the top two by P types: Ne, Se, Fi, Ti
    And these four are used in the top two by J types: Ni, Si, Fe, Te

    That's about it.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  4. #4
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    Yeah, I sort of skimmed the OP, so let me answer it:

    If you are a J, that means your dominant judging process is extraverted, so it would be Te or Fe.

    If you are a P, it is introverted, so Ti, Fi.

  5. #5
    Supreme High Commander Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paradox fox View Post
    All right. So I understand MBTI types and how they are determined, and I mostly understand the Eight Cognitive Functions and can give examples of each function. I see what the pattern is for putting them in order (Fi Ne Si Te, Se Ti Fe Ni, etc.) What I don't understand is how the two are correlated.

    How did they determine and assign those combinations for all the different MBTI types? Was it through induction (reading the type description and assigning the combination) or deduction (combination first, correlated to type second)? (Hope I got induction and deduction straight, but that is entirely beside the point!)

    Also, is there a way to just look at a code and know if it's a Judging or Perceiving type, without having to straight up memorize them all?

    That's all.
    MBTI has its roots in the works ot Carl Jung. I gather that when he started all this off, he didn't have a four letter code, just the idea of functions themselves. It was Myers and Briggs that developed the code we use in MBTI. Thus, I think it is safe to safe that the type descriptions come from the functions, not the other way round.

    Function order is largely based upon theory with some experimental back up. I think it was Myers./Briggs observation that introverts primarily display their auxilary to the world that resulted in the differnce in how MBTI and socionics define P/J.

  6. #6
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paradox fox View Post
    All right. So I understand MBTI types and how they are determined, and I mostly understand the Eight Cognitive Functions and can give examples of each function. I see what the pattern is for putting them in order (Fi Ne Si Te, Se Ti Fe Ni, etc.) What I don't understand is how the two are correlated.

    How did they determine and assign those combinations for all the different MBTI types? Was it through induction (reading the type description and assigning the combination) or deduction (combination first, correlated to type second)? (Hope I got induction and deduction straight, but that is entirely beside the point!)
    They based them on the functions passed down from Carl Jung. They added the J/P dichotomy to explain that introverts show their auxiliary function to the world. So it was functions first, then Myers-Briggs created their Type Dynamics Theory (using the 4 letters). Various others have tried to theorize how all eight functions play out, including Beebe and Thompson, but it's generally accepted to be futile in practice, once you get past the 'shadow' function, or number 4.

    At least that's my take, but I'm a new student in typology.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member paradox fox's Avatar
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    Thanks, all!

    I guess it makes sense that Se and Ne indicate a Perceiving preference. They apply information gathering to the external environment. Te and Fe would be Judging because those functions apply decision-making to the external environment. That thought popped into my head last night.
    Just because I'm an INFP doesn't mean I'm emo!

  8. #8
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    This is a helpful and clarifying thread.

    So with regards to the 4 functions in the type and the additional 4 shadow functions, how do preferences relate to strengths, for example as measured by the cognitive functions assessment in this link?

    Understanding the Eight Jungian Cognitive Processes / Eight Functions Attitudes

    It would seem that the preferred function should have a higher score than the non preferred. It would also seem that the dominant and the auxiliary should be #1 and #2 respectively.

    Here's an example. I took the assessment a couple of weeks ago and was surprised at the ordering - specifically as it related to the shadow functions, and that two shadow functions had higher numbers than the auxiliary (this didn't seem to make logical sense).

    Ni 46.7 Dominant, Excellent Use
    Ti 37.5 Shadow, Excellent Use
    Ne 34.3 Shadow, Average Use
    Te 29.3 Auxiliary, Average Use
    Fi 28.0 Tertiary, Average Use
    Fe 24.5 Shadow, Average Use
    Se 23.2 Inferior, Limited Use
    Si 18.0 Shadow, Limited Use

    Thoughts?

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  9. #9
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander29 View Post
    This is a helpful and clarifying thread.

    So with regards to the 4 functions in the type and the additional 4 shadow functions, how do preferences relate to strengths, for example as measured by the cognitive functions assessment in this link?

    Understanding the Eight Jungian Cognitive Processes / Eight Functions Attitudes

    It would seem that the preferred function should have a higher score than the non preferred. It would also seem that the dominant and the auxiliary should be #1 and #2 respectively.

    Here's an example. I took the assessment a couple of weeks ago and was surprised at the ordering - specifically as it related to the shadow functions, and that two shadow functions had higher numbers than the auxiliary (this didn't seem to make logical sense).

    Ni 46.7 Dominant, Excellent Use
    Ti 37.5 Shadow, Excellent Use
    Ne 34.3 Shadow, Average Use
    Te 29.3 Auxiliary, Average Use
    Fi 28.0 Tertiary, Average Use
    Fe 24.5 Shadow, Average Use
    Se 23.2 Inferior, Limited Use
    Si 18.0 Shadow, Limited Use

    Thoughts?
    My take? It means the tests are not very rigorous and complete (which this one isn't), and/or that we don't understand completely what functions a person uses, and why (which is true too). This test could be poor and you are really Ni/Te/Fi. Or you could be an INTJ that prefers to use Ni/Ti/Ne/Te/Fi, which I would write like this:

    Ni/Te/Fi
    Ne/Ti/Fe

    I just commented about all this stuff here. I don't know much, but I am fascinated by functions and how very little we know about how we use them. Question for you: When you test INTJ, do you test strongly/moderately/weakly on the N/S and T/F divides? What are your percentages? I would guess you test strongly N and T based on your function results, but I'm intrigued to know if I'm right.........
    Ni/Ti/Fe/Si
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    ~Torah observant, Christ inspired~
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    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

    songofmary.wordpress.com


  10. #10
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    extraverted Sensing (Se) ***************************** (29.2)
    average use
    introverted Sensing (Si) ********** (10.7)
    unused
    extraverted Intuiting (Ne) ************************************************** (50.9)
    excellent use
    introverted Intuiting (Ni) ********************************** (34.5)
    good use
    extraverted Thinking (Te) ********** (10.8)
    unused
    introverted Thinking (Ti) ********************* (21.2)
    limited use
    extraverted Feeling (Fe) ********************************* (33.4)
    good use
    introverted Feeling (Fi) ************************************************* (49.9)
    excellent use

    As, I suspected, I is an ENFP!

    `
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