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Thread: Ask a Ni-dom.

  1. #21
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    1.Ni uses all the data you have gathered and tries to understand the whole context. Creation of x - development of x - current status of x - futher development of x - the end of x. Plus what are the chances that there will be another x.

    2.Ne and Ni are similar but Ne focuses on reality around the person while Ni is not even limited by that. So you can make connection that apsolutly make no sense. Plus you don't need environment to stimulate you that much.

    Since the real perty will be hidden in my head and I have absoluty no need to verbalize my thinking. Probably I will not even share my conclussions.

    3. Si rellies on past experiances while Ni looks at the past present and future but its "thinking" is less grounded in details/hard fact.
    Good description. I think it maybe it is characterized by:

    - Synthesizing large amounts of disconnected information (big picture, details, past, present, potential future, etc.), looking at things holistically
    - A realization, or "aha" moment such as an idea occurring to you, an understanding, or you know the direction to go (or not to go)
    - There is a theme of changing the context in which things are looked at and viewing them through a different lens
    - You haven't analyzed all the options or scenarios in any coherent way; you just know; there is a level of certainty associated with it - it may be connected to a probability - but in either case, you feel compelled to act upon this understanding
    - A general difficulty in communicating to others or even understanding yourself as to how you got there

    Edit: the ideas or direction may not even be fully formed which makes it even harder to articulate yourself. I find that by writing things down, it helps to crystallize the thoughts, or if you talk through them with other trusted colleagues, you can sometimes get them better articulated.

  2. #22
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    Could you sum up Ni from your own perspective, in your own words?

    Here is one of my old posts.

    This is Ni+Te. I simply can fully sparate them.





    Picture A is Ne.


    Picture C is Ni when it's job is finished. But in reality this is 3 dimensional picture. For example that third dimension can be time.

    In theory you can connect all of the dots with all dots but it is impossible to create because that plan couldn't be placed into motion. (because of practicality I will skip the explanation why this is the case)


    Instead my brain gives my exactly the right "order" of how dots should be connected. But the most important things is that all connection are made in two directions.


    So the case that third dimension is time you can go up and down on this web. Up is future , down is past. I think you can imagine that there is layer upon layer od connected dots that look similar to each other and similar as a picture C. So when you create a connection between two layers you are forseing into the future or past. Also you can create an "artificial" level between levels where you can check if the connection is right / good.


    What Ni allows you to pick up aare facts/events in the past and drive it through present into the future. So what Ni is trying to do is grasping a chain reaction of which other people are not even aware of.
    When it is just a one series of events then people can grasp it but if there is 10 interconnected events that are not even geographically close or similar in nature most people will fail in grasping it. They will probably not even realize that there is a connection.
    And since people can't grasp it they treat it as magic or something like that.




    Basicly this is why Ni-doms tend to look so confused most of the time.
    Which is because you are not providing exact cordinates in that web with layers. By that I mean we have a huge problem placing things into the context since you are just providing facts that are not connected with anything. What means that if I give you my answer it would not hold any real value (to me of course) since it is not connected to the "web of reality" and as such it is just a "pointless" speculation.




    But this is not all.

  3. #23
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    As a INTJ what probably bothers me the most when it comes to other people is that they don't seem to understand the concepts of "space and tme" or how can a single variable change the entire outcome or making their entire belief system pointless.


    For example take WW2. The Japan lunched the suprise attack against USA at Pear Harbour. However the aircraft carriers were not docked there at the moment of the attack. (even if they should have been there). Instead they were goofing around making shipments and undergoing repairs.
    What means that if they were in harbour Japan would have destroyed them and they would know that they have destroyed them. What means that the Japan would probably have taken even more agressive tackic since USA would not have anything to fight the war. At least least not nearly enough to stop the expansion of Japan in Pacific. (feel free to research this)



    On the other hand UK and USSR rellied on US aid quite a bit and even like this they barely managed to hold. Not to mention the shifts of moral (and strategy) that would have happened if Japan managed to take the entire Pacific without almost no loses.


    So basicly if the story about aircraft carriers is correct (I don't know for sure since I wasn't there) the entire Allied victory in WW2 is based on luck. Or perhaps it would be better to say on a bad luck of the Axis powers. I mean there is still plently of propaganda about this victory. But to me this is only a propaganda since the luck balanced the odds in the start.


    And to make things "worse" Pearl Harbour was quite shallow so the US had easy time pulling ships out of the sea and fixing them. In the case that the harbour was 10 meters deeper there would have been a whole another story. So this way US managed to salvage most its fleet with time and it had enough left not to be over run just like that.


    So from the perspectire of Ni this is for how much the world actually dodged the global fascism: the few ships that were not where they should have been and the fact that a certain harbor that is technically in the middle of the nowhere was shallow. Everything else is just the outcome/consequence of these two facts.


    This can be told in more detail and complexity but this is enough for the point to be made and as you can see it was a little bit too close of comfort.



    Of course you can go even further and say that the entire history is just a chain reaction and no one is deserved for anything. Since everything was predetermined. (what makes complete sense from Ni perspective)

  4. #24
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Well first I came up with questions in involving trees, invisible cats, and fires, but here is a slightly better question:

    I am a mid size company with limited financial resources trying to evaluate three different pathways forward to maximize profit. I can only pick one of three and they are very different in nature. How would you evaluate the best path forward? Dont worry if you dont know exactly the right words to use. Just describe what your gut would tell you to do.

    (Hint: INTJs kick ass at this shit.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    Well first I came up with questions in involving trees, invisible cats, and fires, but here is a slightly better question:

    I am a mid size company with limited financial resources trying to evaluate three different pathways forward to maximize profit. I can only pick one of three and they are very different in nature. How would you evaluate the best path forward? Dont worry if you dont know exactly the right words to use. Just describe what your gut would tell you to do.

    (Hint: INTJs kick ass at this shit.)

    Just for the record I refuse to tak any resbonsibility for my advice since you I don't know too little.


    Personally I don't see why to limit this on just those three.


    What can you do to increase a profit ? Makes sure that people get tasks which match their skills and make sure that no one is too stressed. (since stressed people are unproductive)
    If people in the company are not that much friendly to eachother you can even make a rule that the person with a weakest results will be thrown out of the company each year. Also you should check how much are you are spending on a electricity, heating ...... etc. For example if you have the office and everybody has only a 6 hours of work to do. It would be wise that people do it at once so that a heating of the bulding can be turn off during the other 18 hours.
    (it all depend on how big the company is and what it is its business/goal )




    As for that three options. It is almost pointless to say anything if there is no details. (in a way)

    First you evaluate the risks/problems of all options than do the same with gains. After that it would will be easy to decide. (probably)

    However make sure that you see/consider the entire picture. Since without that you are doing everything wrong. Also try to see if there are holes in the market that you company can fill in. Also it would be wise to check what are companies similar to yours are doing (if you can do that). Since maybe they have a better strategy or by their actions you can figure out that there will be a hole left in a market somewhere.



    Also it would not hurt to study where your company can expand. Especially since that usually rises profit the most and makes it easier to expand further.
    It would be also smart to take a hypotetical loan(s) and then calaculate what you can do with it and how it will effect the company on the long run.


    In short this is it. Without actual data I can't go much further.

  6. #26
    man-made neptunesnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post


    Picture A is Ne.


    Picture C is Ni when it's job is finished. But in reality this is 3 dimensional picture. For example that third dimension can be time.
    Really?

    My first instinct was that Picture A was Ni, and Picture C was Ne.

    Ne to me seems like a tree and every idea branches into another but essentially has a basis whereas Ni has a singular objective and everything is a direct offspring of that.

    ...

    I guess it doesn't really matter.
    It's probably just a matter of interpretation.

  7. #27
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neptunesnet View Post
    Really?

    My first instinct was that Picture A was Ni, and Picture C was Ne.

    Ne to me seems like a tree and every idea branches into another but essentially has a basis whereas Ni has a singular objective and everything is a direct offspring of that.

    ...

    I guess it doesn't really matter.
    It's probably just a matter of interpretation.


    Well you are not the first one who said this.


    The problem is that picture C does not have a third dimension and that is why it does not fit Ni.


    Also it deprend on what do you think that the picture presents: methood or a product.

  8. #28
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Happy Puppy View Post
    Well first I came up with questions in involving trees, invisible cats, and fires, but here is a slightly better question:

    I am a mid size company with limited financial resources trying to evaluate three different pathways forward to maximize profit. I can only pick one of three and they are very different in nature. How would you evaluate the best path forward? Dont worry if you dont know exactly the right words to use. Just describe what your gut would tell you to do.

    (Hint: INTJs kick ass at this shit.)
    You can look at this from a couple of different perspectives While you can make short term numbers by cutting costs and being more efficient, the way to build the business, and increase profit in a sustainable manner is growth of revenue. The strategy depends on the type of business. Let's say you serve a large set of customers with common needs, you will want to:

    1. Have a very clear idea as to what your competitive differentiation is. What is it that you do better than anyone else?
    2. Understand your customer's needs better than your competitors
    3. Understand the biggest competitive threats to your business
    4. Best people - you need to have mechanisms to hire, grow, and retain the best performers
    5. Build customer loyalty

    So, if you assume the 3 options are considering all of these things, the best option is the one allows you to change the playing field with respect to your competitors. You defend certain hills at all costs. There are new hills that you want to conquer. It allows you to do that effectively. It allows you to take advantage of your competitive differentiation, your superior understanding of your customers needs, and your strengths, to grow revenue which leads to increased profit.

    It would be best to involve other types in the decision - STPs or STJs for example, to make sure that the option selected is practical and providing enough short term return.
    Edit: then if the option you're selecting will have a significant impact on the people in the company, you'd want to involve NFs in identifying those considerations

  9. #29
    Senior Member sticker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    1.Ni uses all the data you have gathered and tries to understand the whole context. Creation of x - development of x - current status of x - futher development of x - the end of x. Plus what are the chances that there will be another x.
    During the data collection phase, is that Si doing the job? If it's of a particular area of interest, do you end up doing tons of research to gain an expertise in that area?
    Is it possible for Si and Ni to be working together and at the same time since Ni needs data in the first place for it to 'work'? (Unless I'm getting the whole idea about Ni wrong.)
    Everyone is unique. ...Just like everyone else.
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  10. #30
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sticker View Post
    During the data collection phase, is that Si doing the job? If it's of a particular area of interest, do you end up doing tons of research to gain an expertise in that area?
    Is it possible for Si and Ni to be working together and at the same time since Ni needs data in the first place for it to 'work'? (Unless I'm getting the whole idea about Ni wrong.)
    Not in all cases since in many cases that data was created by Ni in the first place.
    However I use Se more often for gathering completly new data.


    Yes. I like to know plenty about things that interest me.


    All 8 function are active all the time (basicly)

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