ISTJs considered 'nice guys' while INTJs are considered cold-hearted evil beings.

[Anew Leaf]

If these are Star Wars references, I don't understand them.. (I never saw the series AND I NEVER WILL)
/STUBBORN

I did, however, look up Ewoks.

There's one of those deep inside every Thinking type.

Yes, it IS a Star Wars reference!! Amgs... I think you should take a short trip out to Doncha' Knooooow Laaaaaaand... For like 8 hours. All we will do is have hot cocoa.....

There is nothing to point out, and therefore nothing about which to become indignant.

(This thread is indeed silly.)

Nothing? or...... Everything!?!

Gather round, children, & observe!

A common breed of veiled indignation, in its natural habitat.

*has s'mores supplies and shares*

 

[Lexicon]

[MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION]

 

[Anew Leaf]

[MENTION=13402]Saturned[/MENTION]

Now we just need to lie in wait for yet another deer IXTJ to trot into the meadow and feast upon the salt lick of NoGooeyCenter.

 

[Coriolis]

Gather round, children, & observe!

A common breed of veiled indignation, in its natural habitat.

I don't know whether this is wishful thinking, an absence of logic, or both. You cannot make something into what you wish it to be, simply by saying it is.

 

[Riva]

Are ISTJs the nice ones? Have I met ISTJs who are nice? Decent maybe but rarely nice. Honest, loyal yes.

Have I met any evil INTJs? Cold hearted appearance maybe but they are shockingly helpful and polite - the ones I know.

Helpful is a nice word.

I'm trying to care about this topic. The real answer is when you look into an INTJ's eyes you can sometimes see that anything is possible. Really, anything. Deep down the only real constraint is opportunity and conscience. But what I'm mostly hoping is HAL 9000 was not ISFJ, because that'd ruin the instructional question:

HAL 9000

ISTJ or INTJ?


I say clear cut ISTJ. Others say different.

Enneagram 6? 6w7 maybe. Or was he a 2?

 

[Cellmold]

I don't know whether this is wishful thinking, an absence of logic, or both. You cannot make something into what you wish it to be, simply by saying it is.

But what something may be when it cannot be clearly discerned and is not shared is open to interpretation. Unfortunately even when it is shared and stated clearly....individuals will always see other elements that can be either fabricated or true, yet hidden from the particular individual of examination.

So the truth of what something is or what it will be in this social context....is extremely fuzzy.

 

[Lexicon]

I don't know whether this is wishful thinking, an absence of logic, or both.

Doesn't wishful thinking usually take place in the absence of logic?

You cannot make something into what you wish it to be, simply by saying it is.

And agreed, of course not. It's all in good fun [at the potential expense of Thinking types, that is].

 

[Coriolis]

Doesn't wishful thinking usually take place in the absence of logic?

It usually is accompanied by an unwillingness to face the facts of a situation. Yes, I would call that illogical, but sometimes the wishful thinking almost has a logic of its own. It is often an integral component of delusional thinking, used to maintain some comfort level when someone is confronted by something they do not wish to face.

And agreed, of course not. It's all in good fun [at the potential expense of Thinking types, that is].

In that case, carry on. We can certainly take it, and I see no reason at the moment to spoil your fun.

 

[sulfit]

Why so? What has the change from Si - Ni got to do with being a nice guy or a cold-hearted being of unsightly prejudice. Quite an over exaggeration and it's also quite sad when some people wholeheartedly take it as truth.

In Socionics the type that closest corresponds to ISTJ (SLI) is described as Positivist and Asking (more on this here). The type that most closely corresponds to INTJ (ILI) is Negativist and Declaring. Negativist types tend to point of how flawed something is, what's lacking or missing, what cannot be done. As Declaring types ILIs state such things as a fact, with confidence. As a result people think that they are arrogant pessimists out to ruin everyone's mood and spoil everyone's good time. The ISTJ/SLI being Positivist and Asking make a more likable impression.

 

[yeghor]

Why so? What has the change from Si - Ni got to do with being a nice guy or a cold-hearted being of unsightly prejudice. Quite an over exaggeration and it's also quite sad when some people wholeheartedly take it as truth.

I'm trying to care about this topic. The real answer is when you look into an INTJ's eyes you can sometimes see that anything is possible. Really, anything. Deep down the only real constraint is opportunity and conscience. But what I'm mostly hoping is HAL 9000 was not ISFJ, because that'd ruin the instructional question:

HAL 9000 ISTJ or INTJ? I say clear cut ISTJ. Others say different.

Are ISTJs the nice ones? Have I met ISTJs who are nice? Decent maybe but rarely nice. Honest, loyal yes.

Have I met any evil INTJs? Cold hearted appearance maybe but they are shockingly helpful and polite - the ones I know.

Helpful is a nice word. HAL 9000: Enneagram 6? 6w7 maybe. Or was he a 2?

HAL9000 is neither an ISTJ nor an INTJ, it's an ESTJ.

That's good, that's the first informative post I heard from INTJs about INTJs for aeons.

I didnt really meant that INTJs are bad parents that was just trolling; to be honest with you I dont know not a single INTJ in real life and I dont know Jack about them.

The spare llama drama answers you get from them on the forum aint really helping, but to be fair I really never were intrested in them.

I think you'ld do fine as Dad, especially when you'ld explain the concept "per aspera ad astra" to your kids

Speaking of Ad Astra, I think these provide a good contrast between the ISTJ type and the INTJ type.

Ad Astra - Roy (ISTJ) sees his father (INTJ) again for the first time in decades

Ad Astra - Roy's father (INTJ) does not want to go back to Earth

Ad Astra - Roy's mindset "before" going to space to find his father

Ad Astra - Roy's changed mindset after having had closure with his estranged father

 

[Indigo Rodent]

Probably because there's a tendency to mistype ENTJs as INTJs.

 

[Oaky]

Gee… 12 years ago I was a sensationalist.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Who wants to be a "nice guy" anyway?

 

[FlamingSword]

Three thoughts:

First, the Grant function model is inaccurate. An IJ can only lead with Ji, so it is JiPi. Si is the auxiliary of the ISTJ. Ni is the auxiliary of the INTJ. Both share the common dominant function, which is Ti.

Second, the worst thing is perhaps not being seen as evil or cold-hearted. The worst trait is having no trait. Just mediocre, neglectable, hardly noticeable. In today's society, one can leave an impression for being tough, cold, ruthless, etc., and yet still be remembered. Negative traits at least indicate characteristics. A 'nice guy' however, does not have anything special. They tend to be overlooked and their existence is like thin air. To say somebody 'nice' implies that 1) people don't know much about this person, and/or 2) this person has no noticeable traits. To say "you are nice" simply is yet another way of saying, I don't know much about you, with some politeness.

Third, the Jungian type ISTJ is an empirical and critical thinker, not the average nice guy. The ISTJ being a nice, average Joe is a misconception. Ti implies critical and independent thinking, and the TiSi combination suggests empiricism.

ISTJ - TiSi, empirical critical thinker. INTJ - TiNi, creative critical thinker.

For example, Kant was clearly an ISTJ, TiSi. There was hardly anything intuitive about him. He was strictly logical and rational, and was quite grounded. You can even argue that he had OCPD (a PD common to people with High Conscientiousness). I wonder why people type him into INTP and keep saying he was in a 'loop'. A loop does not exist. In many cases when people have difficulty typing someone, it is because the Grant model does not fit. Using the Jungian model, it becomes immediately clear.