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Thread: J Vs P

  1. #11
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    xxxJ is someone who extroverts the Judging function (Te or Fe) and introverts the Perceiving function (Si or Ni.)

    xxxP is someone who extroverts the Perceiving function (Se or Ne) and introverts the Judging function (Ti or Fi.)

    So being "borderline P/J" doesn't really make sense because it implies two completely different value systems. MBTI leads people to this conclusion because it oversimplifies Js as "organized" and Ps as "disorganized" when this is only half the story.

    Js value rigid external organization of the environment but maintain a more flexible private perspective.

    Ps value rigid internal organization of the self but maintain a more flexible external approach.

    J method = "Have a plan to get your life in order and under control first, and then personal happiness and internal contentment will follow."

    P method = "Get your personal principles worked out first, and then you'll be able to adapt to and figure out how deal with anything that happens in the external world in real time."
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    xxxJ is someone who extroverts the Judging function (Te or Fe) and introverts the Perceiving function (Si or Ni.)

    xxxP is someone who extroverts the Perceiving function (Se or Ne) and introverts the Judging function (Ti or Fi.)

    So being "borderline P/J" doesn't really make sense because it implies two completely different value systems. MBTI leads people to this conclusion because it oversimplifies Js as "organized" and Ps as "disorganized" when this is only half the story.

    Js value rigid external organization of the environment but maintain a more flexible private perspective.

    Ps value rigid internal organization of the self but maintain a more flexible external approach.

    J method = "Have a plan to get your life in order and under control first, and then personal happiness and internal contentment will follow."

    P method = "Get your personal principles worked out first, and then you'll be able to adapt to and figure out how deal with anything that happens in the external world in real time."
    This is a good way to look at it. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by evilrobot View Post
    Right. IJs sometimes get lost in information gathering mode and don't use their supporting EJ function properly to structure, reach conclusions and limit options, and thus wind up looking like Ps.

    Overall the J (organized and decisive) and P (disorganized and indecisive) stereotypes are not always a reliable indicator.

    I think the above is very true! I often tend to get lost in all the connections and excitement for the information. I've also found that I sometimes need to start a new project or take a break to figure out how to organize it which people sometimes see as procrastination.

    Ultimately I agree with INTJMom. I realized I was more J when I realized that I can't stand lose ends! I like things planned out in advance and decisions made.

  3. #13

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    Here's my outlook on J/P from a totally subjective point of view:

    I'm an INFP, of which I have almost no doubt (thought I wouldn't be INFP if I didn't constantly question my type a bit, right?), but I am also very strict with myself about meeting people exactly on time (as in, if I'm five minutes early or late I'm disappointed in myself). Yet, I do this using a considerable amount of energy. I recently realized that my desire to be punctual and reliable comes more from a desire to not let people down than it does from a desire for doing it just because that's that way of things. Also, I was raised by SJs, so I'm sure that has something to do with it too!

    So really, it's not a comfortable process for me, to "act" like a J. It's a learned one. If I had my way (and basically, if modern society didn't exist), timelines and schedules would be fluid and flexible.

    I have an ENFP best friend (of 15 years) who was notoriously flaky and absent-minded for a good amount of those 15 years, but recently has learned to be more punctual and reliable. I recently showed up to a meeting expecting him, and he was there before me, which blew my mind!

    It IS absolutely possible to be a P with a tendency towards organization and punctuality!

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by letsplaytwister View Post
    Here's my outlook on J/P from a totally subjective point of view:

    I'm an INFP, of which I have almost no doubt (thought I wouldn't be INFP if I didn't constantly question my type a bit, right?), but I am also very strict with myself about meeting people exactly on time (as in, if I'm five minutes early or late I'm disappointed in myself). Yet, I do this using a considerable amount of energy. I recently realized that my desire to be punctual and reliable comes more from a desire to not let people down than it does from a desire for doing it just because that's that way of things. Also, I was raised by SJs, so I'm sure that has something to do with it too!

    So really, it's not a comfortable process for me, to "act" like a J. It's a learned one. If I had my way (and basically, if modern society didn't exist), timelines and schedules would be fluid and flexible.

    I have an ENFP best friend (of 15 years) who was notoriously flaky and absent-minded for a good amount of those 15 years, but recently has learned to be more punctual and reliable. I recently showed up to a meeting expecting him, and he was there before me, which blew my mind!

    It IS absolutely possible to be a P with a tendency towards organization and punctuality!
    I agree. That is why we have to be careful not to jump to conclusions based on someone's outward appearance. Often our parent's values can heavily influence us when they are very different from ours. Had you been raised by FPs the idea of being on time might never have occured to you.

    I also think, the MBTI test can be misleading. Many people don't realize what motivates their behavior in a certain way until they have thought about it for a while. So often we answer the questions in what we think should be important to us or how other people see us based on misconceptions about ourselves.

    For example my mom always called me a procrastinator because I didn't wake up every am and write out a to do list like she did (ESTP). Also for papers in school I would read all the books the teachers recommended and then take two weeks off to process the information before I actually started the writing process. It drove my mom nuts that he due date was getting closer and she couldn't "see" me doing what I was supposed to, not realizing that I needed to focus on something different to process the information and develop my thesis. If I started writing and trying to develop a thesis with out significant Ni time, it was more of a chore for me. After I got my Aha! moment and knew exactly what everything meant and what I wanted to say, I could sit down at the computer and type an almost perfect paper without all the diagrams and charts. I wasn't procrastinating . . . I was processing. But I've always beaten myself up for being a procrastinator even though I really am not, which is why I first tested as an ENTP.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlFromMars View Post
    J Vs P?
    Five year framework vs. Six case scenario.

  6. #16
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Provoker View Post
    Five year framework vs. Six case scenario.
    Hello

  7. #17
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    I think J's are able to get closure on their impressions of people things and ideas very quickly. They make hard desicions and stick to them by nature.

    P's don't ever really get closure on any ideas. Everything is left open, their impressions on people, their feelings about people, their ideas. They make desicions by looking at alllll the options and theyre not even sure if they made the right choice after.

  8. #18
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    Judging: One stitch in time saves nine. They make plans and carry them out. They decide quickly to get things out of the way.

    Perceiving: Van uitstel komt afstel. (<- this is Dutch) I don't know a similar saying in English, so I'll explain a bit. It means something like "If you postpone things, eventually they won't get done" This is true for both work and play. The things you aren't interested in at the moment get postponed - why study now if, maybe, the teacher says later you don't have to know that part? The things you are interested in get done immediately - for fear of missing the chance.
    Perceivers decide at the last possible moment because new information could mean a better deal.

    Most people are a mixture Being a P doesn't keep me from preparing my lessons.
    Got questions? Ask an ENTP!
    I'm female. I just can't draw women

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