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Thread: Ne and Ni

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I think you are mistaking senses with materials. Materials (dinosaur bones) exist. How you relate to them is through your senses/intuition. The mere fact that these materials exist is not Si or Se.

    How you remember and relate to the bones is the point. You can either note the texture, smell and shape. You may notice its potential. You may imagine its history or its future. You may note that it looks similar to the things you have in your own body. Se, Si, Ne or Ni are ways to relate to the world, not the world itself.
    What if I dont see a "dinosaur bone"? I see an object and how it interacts with the world. I bring in and note this interaction, not the objects. Thats what I notice. I honestly dont care about the texture, the smell, or what the object is even called. That has nothing to do with how it interacts with the world. I could honestly care less about the details of the world or anything in it unless it relates to how things interact.

    That is why I can take my Ni, and do what I have recently started calling, "flip it and reverse it" and apply it to different situations without even trying. Because I dont remember the detail, but the essence of the interaction itself.
    Im out, its been fun

  2. #42
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    What if I dont see a "dinosaur bone"? I see an object and how it interacts with the world. I bring in and note this interaction, not the objects. Thats what I notice. I honestly dont care about the texture, the smell, etc. That has nothing to do with how it interacts with the world. I could honestly care less about the details of the world or anything in it unless it relates to how things interact.

    That is why I can take my Ni, and do what I have recently started calling, "flip it and reverse it" and apply it to different situations without even trying. Because I dont remember the detail, but the essence of the interaction itself.
    That's exactly what I mean. I gave 4 different examples on how you can relate to this object through different functions and there are many more. You may recognize it as a bone, or you may perceive it as a potential baseball bat. But my point is that the mere fact that this object exists is not the definition of Si.

    How you perceive the object is a mixture of your dominant and auxiliary functions, by preference. But you are in no means limited to just that way of perceiving. We all have all the functions at our disposal, with practice.

  3. #43
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    That's exactly what I mean. I gave 4 different examples on how you can relate to this object through different functions and there are many more. You may recognize it as a bone, or you may perceive it as a potential baseball bat. But my point is that the mere fact that this object exists is not the definition of Si.

    How you perceive the object is a mixture of your dominant and auxiliary functions, by preference. But you are in no means limited to just that way of perceiving. We all have all the functions at our disposal, with practice.
    Along with this, these thoughts don't just arise out of nowhere. NeTi is very expedient and task-oriented. We don't just go throughout life thinking "oh, look at that bone, I could use that as a baseball bat" without reason. However, whenever people want to play baseball, or need to whack the crap out of something, that's when we start scanning the environment, thinking "what could we use to accomplish this task?"

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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    That's exactly what I mean. I gave 4 different examples on how you can relate to this object through different functions and there are many more. You may recognize it as a bone, or you may perceive it as a potential baseball bat. But my point is that the mere fact that this object exists is not the definition of Si.

    How you perceive the object is a mixture of your dominant and auxiliary functions, by preference. But you are in no means limited to just that way of perceiving. We all have all the functions at our disposal, with practice.
    Ok, now if Se is about seeing the interaction and bringin it into Ni, then Ne is about seeing the object itself and bringing it into Si. This is why Si types think that Se is just about noticing the color or texture, because it is there internal perception of what Si turned external is.
    Im out, its been fun

  5. #45
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Along with this, these thoughts don't just arise out of nowhere. NeTi is very expedient and task-oriented. We don't just go throughout life thinking "oh, look at that bone, I could use that as a baseball bat" without reason. However, whenever people want to play baseball, or need to whack the crap out of something, that's when we start scanning the environment, thinking "what could we use to accomplish this task?"
    Yes, that's exactly right. Dom+aux really shapes the way you orient with the world. I don't know how ENFPs use Ne, but mine is very much like you described. Very practical and innovative when a solution or brainstorming is needed.

  6. #46
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    Ok, now if Se is about seeing the interaction and bringin it into Ni, then Ne is about seeing the object itself and bringing it into Si. This is why Si types think that Se is just about noticing the color or texture, because it is there internal perception of what Si turned external is.
    Who ever said that Se is about bringing anything into Ni? I really don't understand your train of thought. What is the basis of your theory?

  7. #47
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Well, you know I disagree conceptually (I don't think information collecting (perceiving) functions are so deterministic)
    How are those descriptions deterministic?
    Hello

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    How are those descriptions deterministic?
    Three of the four say something to the effect of "you have to" or "you need to".

    That's the province of the Judging functions. In fact, that's exactly why they're called "judging".

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Three of the four say something to the effect of "you have to" or "you need to".

    That's the province of the Judging functions. In fact, that's exactly why they're called "judging".
    That's really just a result of treating them as opposing states of mind, rather than toolsets to be utilised by other functions. And the only province of judging functions is decision making, so I'm not really sure how they're treading on other functions' toes.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    Who ever said that Se is about bringing anything into Ni? I really don't understand your train of thought. What is the basis of your theory?
    Because thats what I care about. The way things interact. The way Se interacts with Ni and how they both interact with Ti. That is what I notice. Look at what I do, look at how I argue, look at my responses and you will see that. But to do that you must look at how I interact and not the detail of what I say or do.
    Im out, its been fun

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