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  1. #61
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    I wouldn't kill him, but I would ask him which his dominant leg and arm were.

    I would then take that knowledge, and use my BJJ skills to force him to learn to use his opposite leg and arm...

  2. #62
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I wouldn't kill him, but I would ask him which his dominant leg and arm were.

    I would then take that knowledge, and use my BJJ skills to force him to learn to use his opposite leg and arm...
    If you could also make the remaining arm numb, things would be perfect.
    Then doing "the stranger" in his wheelchair would be a recurring favorite.

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    If you could also make the remaining arm numb, things would be perfect.
    Then doing "the stranger" in his wheelchair would be a recurring favorite.
    You're just full of fun ideas.

  4. #64
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    You're just full of fun ideas.
    I live to serve

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  5. #65
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    this sounds like the plot of OldBoy haha

  6. #66
    Senior Member Timmy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
    You're either talking about either premeditated vengeance or premeditating killing someone you believe is a threat to society.

    If it's vengeance then it would not be a rational decision, my personal values do not agree with taking another's life except in self defence, therefore if I purposely went to kill someone I would literally have to be out of my mind. After years of torture, this may be the case, for the torture to be most effective it would have to be psychological not just physical.
    Would not killing such a torturer be self-defense...so that she or he could never do it to anyone else, ever again?

    If not, then I opine the "battered wife syndrome" is no longer a defense.


    Which I do not believe.

    As a good friends from the South likes to opine now and again, "There are some people who just need killin'."

  7. #67
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
    Would not killing such a torturer be self-defense...so that she or he could never do it to anyone else, ever again?

    If not, then I opine the "battered wife syndrome" is no longer a defense.
    A few problems with that:

    Self defence is not a free pass.

    Self defence is applicable only when someone believes their life is in imminent danger, or they are in danger of being seriously injured.

    And excessive force cannot be used.

    Therefore, hunting down and attacking someone who is no longer a threat is not self defence.

    What's more, if you do that, they have a case for self defence if they harm you.

    Battered wife syndrome is not a free pass either, it's a case for diminished responsibility.

    But... Seeing as the torturer is not a spouse in the scenario, battered wife syndrome is not relevant here.


    The rest of my initial post already dealt with the idea of self defence though:

    If it's done because the person is a danger to society and yet the legal system would not hold them accountable because torture has been sanctioned then I see more grey area. If others were in imminent danger, potentially. If other people that I cared about were in imminent danger, it's probable.

    In the moment of being tortured though, yes.
    At the end of the day the law states quite clearly that no one has the right to take another life, if you make a rational decision to do so you will be held accountable and rightly so.

  8. #68
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
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    In the state of mind that we are all likely to have now (ie. we go to work/study, go to the beach, sleep, work some more...) I think most of us would hesitate. If you were a police officer and had been through a lot, you'd be better able to handle such mental decisions, because you know the consequences. While being tortured, you're not adjusting to becoming a malicious killing machine, you're adjusting to getting tortured, if you fought back frequently, you might adjust to the idea, and you might pull it off. Everyone's different though, there's so many different ways it could go...

    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    yes, I'm sorry but this bullshit of oh i'll never kill anyone I'm too good of a person is bullshit. I'm not likely to kill someone, but I know their's that glimmer of a chance that everyone has and stop lying about ooh i'd never kill anyone. and if they're fucking torturing me damn straight I would.
    Have you ever seen death? It's not about good or bad, or how much guts you've got, though maybe it is for a feeler... hmmmmm
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  9. #69
    Senior Member Timmy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
    But... Seeing as the torturer is not a spouse in the scenario, battered wife syndrome is not relevant here.
    My point with the BWS is that it's a similar model...killing someone (in this case, a spouse) based on what the person has done to you in the past, and what they MIGHT do in the future.

    In the OP's hypothetical scenario, the person has "done" stuff to you for 16 years. There's no guarantee that this person won't come after you again....and there are 16 years of history of abuse/torture. Same with a battered wife...how many years have they endured the beatings, etc?

    Thus, I think they're nearly identical...just that one torturer is a spouse and one is not.

    Killing a spouse while the spouse is in actual commission of an offense is, IMO, a "self-defense" case in the classic sense.

  10. #70
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    who has tortured you?

    Imagine you live in a police state. You have been "in" for 16 years.
    Now you are free. You know where he lives.
    You will not get caught.

    You will kill him.
    You will not kill him.
    You do not know.
    I can't project for certain, but do know that the greatest submission to cruelty is to internalize it to a point that one reflects it back into the world. My torturer is an individual living in a police state that is oppressive and shapes its members into cruel oppressors. I wouldn't want to become him. I suspect I would not kill him for the sole purpose of punishment for what was done to me. If he placed a direct threat in the world presently, then it would be a different scenario in which non-action could become complicit form of aggression towards another.

    My hope would be to fight the contagion of cruelty by becoming immune to its influence and instead finding it within myself to become its opposite.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

    I want to be just like my mother, even if she is bat-shit crazy.

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