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  1. #11
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    I'm not sure there's going to be one set of temperaments that is better than any other, whether you choose to frame it in terms of perception, judgement or whatever. They're just arbitrary groupings designed to find commonalities, which can be found in all sorts of lights.

    Not to be dismissive of what you're trying to do, of course. I'll just suggest my own names and be on my way:

    IxxP - The Harmonist
    IxxJ - The Unyielding
    Hello

  2. #12
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by incubustribute View Post
    This post is for anyone who dislikes Kiersey's way of classifying the four temperaments (NF idealist, NT rational, SP artist, SJ guardian). From talking to simulatedworld and by my own experience, I have come up with alternative temperament groupings (that quite possibly have been proposed before). If this is redundant at all or has been previously tried please point it out, but be nice - I'm a beginner

    Instead of grouping via the iNtuitive function dichotomies (NF and NT) and via the Sensing J/P preferences (SJ and SP), I propose a different four groups:

    IxxP - The Idealist
    IxxJ - The Learner
    ExxP - The Explorer
    ExxJ - The Leader
    Let's see.. ISTP as The Idealist... ESFJ as The Leader...

    The crack pipe, sir. Lay it on the ground and slowly back away.
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

  3. #13
    A Benign Tumor PoprocksAndCoke's Avatar
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    Yes, because those INTPs are so very idealistic
    "In order for the light to shine so brightly, the darkness must be present." -Francis Bacon

    "No matter how dark the moment, love and hope are always possible." -George Chakiris

  4. #14
    Senior Member incubustribute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    I'm not sure there's going to be one set of temperaments that is better than any other, whether you choose to frame it in terms of perception, judgement or whatever. They're just arbitrary groupings designed to find commonalities, which can be found in all sorts of lights.

    Not to be dismissive of what you're trying to do, of course. I'll just suggest my own names and be on my way:

    IxxP - The Harmonist
    IxxJ - The Unyielding
    I like those! Seeking harmony is the goal of idealism after all, and "unyielding" is a valid way to look at the IxxJ temperament. The only thing I would bring up is that unyielding sounds more ExxJ to me. What I was going for with IxxJ is leading Pi, which is concerned with taking in and evaluating information; hence, "learning." I guess I was trying to take a more positive approach, but it may have been too vague, idk.
    Thanks for the suggestions

  5. #15
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by incubustribute View Post
    saslou, let's just hire a sitter. Si tells me it's safer than taking your children skydiving
    Lets just practice and not bother having the kids at all ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Let's see.. ISTP as The Idealist... ESFJ as The Leader...

    The crack pipe, sir. Lay it on the ground and slowly back away.
    Ehhh .. Please do not question one's leadership abilities .. I fucking rock .. I keep everyone happy .. Assess and utilize everyones skills and create a happy environment .. Then party with free alcohol i brought on the company's credit card
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  6. #16
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    Ehhh .. Please do not question one's leadership abilities .. I fucking rock .. I keep everyone happy .. Assess and utilize everyones skills and create a happy environment .. Then party with free alcohol i brought on the company's credit card
    ESFJs make great hosts, that's true.
    But I am yet to see an ESFJ who does not waver when rank is pulled on them.
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    ESFJs make great hosts, that's true.
    But I am yet to see an ESFJ who does not waver when rank is pulled on them.
    Please .. Oh i am enjoying this .. Continue insulting me .. I can't host for shit .. There's the kitchen, help yourself ... The workplace is different though ..

    Someone wants to pull rank on me .. *Sharpens Axe in anticipation*

    Lol ..
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  8. #18
    Senior Member incubustribute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Let's see.. ISTP as The Idealist... ESFJ as The Leader...

    The crack pipe, sir. Lay it on the ground and slowly back away.
    I see the issue. Is your problem with the names or is the whole theory garbage? I think perhaps a better name for ExxJ is in order. The other problem seems to be that Ti being an "idealistic" function is not apparently a popular view. I'm sticking to my guns on this one, though. While I don't know many ISTP's personally, I do believe that Ji seems very conducive of idealistic judgments.

    Quote Originally Posted by PoprocksAndCoke View Post
    Yes, because those INTPs are so very idealistic
    I don't know about you, but the INTP's I know kind of are...at least on the basis of logic.

  9. #19
    Senior Member incubustribute's Avatar
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    Again...I'm operating on the principle that internal (introverted) decisions and value systems are inherently idealistic in nature because of their lack of a need for external validation. You can argue with Ti all day long about why its theory doesn't work in real life, but if it's convinced itself the theory is true, it won't change its mind Likewise, you can argue with Fi all day long about why its moral/ethical values are impractical, but it doesn't matter. If the decision is made, your external value system won't change the way Ji feels/thinks about anything.
    Last edited by incubustribute; 11-16-2009 at 06:45 PM. Reason: grammar

  10. #20
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by incubustribute View Post
    I see the issue. Is your problem with the names or is the whole theory garbage? I think perhaps a better name for ExxJ is in order. The other problem seems to be that Ti being an "idealistic" function is not apparently a popular view. I'm sticking to my guns on this one, though. While I don't know many ISTP's personally, I do believe that Ji seems very conducive of idealistic judgments.
    Yeah, I have a problem with more than just names. To put INTJs and ISFJs in one category, and ISTPs and INFPs in another is totally bunk. That's the equavalent of claiming that tigers and zebras are the same species because they both have stripes.

    Anyway, the only ideals or rules that ISTP guys tend to go by is "don't call me a faggot"
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

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