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Thread: About Intuition

  1. #81
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    There is most definitely a difference between Ne and Se, though they share some similar properties.

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    WTF is this dude saying? A Schnitzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I'm beginning to think this whole separation between Ne and Se is a bunch shim-sham flim-flammery.
    So a distinction between two terms that others made up is a term that you just made up? How is one even supposed to respond to that?
    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    sheesh humans! for realz

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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    That's so NeFi it's ridiculous.
    That doesn't make it any less true.

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    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    By the way, I've only tested ISFP on one on line test out of let's say, fifty. But I think the description fits me better than that of INFP, aside from the "ISFPs are more likely to not graduate college" bit.
    That's even more FiNe. Not following a type because you don't like the aspersions of elitism attached to it - yup, you're an xNFP. It's a good thing.

    Just remember, in the eyes of society, most intuitives end up as "failures". Most of the perceived elitism is either NTs being our usual socially retarded selves or NFs defense mechanisms against being the "weird" kids growing up.

    And finally - don't worry. None of this is real anyway, it's just an attempt to categorize a very complicated topic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A Schnitzel View Post
    So a distinction between two terms that others made up is a term that you just made up? How is one even supposed to respond to that?
    I just think it gets silly, that's all. And I know intuitives get high and mighty about it. It's like this 'F-you, jock. So you made fun of me in high school but now I own you' mentality.

    And it seems to me that ISFPs, ISTPs, INFPs and INTPs really aren't all that different from each other, so I will extrapolate that the same goes for other groups as well. I've had intellectual, philosophical, enlightening conversations with the lot of them. So to talk about 'magical Ne' as if it does something that Sensing doesn't seems like serious hokum to me. I just think the distinctions aren't as cut and dried as people like to think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I just think it gets silly, that's all. And I know intuitives get high and mighty about it. It's like this 'F-you, jock. So you made fun of me in high school but now I own you' mentality.
    What the hell are you talking about? No, really. What you're saying here is just a load of crap.

    And it seems to me that ISFPs, ISTPs, INFPs and INTPs really aren't all that different from each other,
    In my personal observations, I am strongly inclined to disagree.

    so I will extrapolate that the same goes for other groups as well. I've had intellectual, philosophical, enlightening conversations with the lot of them. So to talk about 'magical Ne' as if it does something that Sensing doesn't seems like serious hokum to me. I just think the distinctions aren't as cut and dried as people like to think.
    You don't think it's cut and dried...because you're an N.

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    WTF is this dude saying? A Schnitzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I just think it gets silly, that's all. And I know intuitives get high and mighty about it. It's like this 'F-you, jock. So you made fun of me in high school but now I own you' mentality.

    And it seems to me that ISFPs, ISTPs, INFPs and INTPs really aren't all that different from each other, so I will extrapolate that the same goes for other groups as well. I've had intellectual, philosophical, enlightening conversations with the lot of them. So to talk about 'magical Ne' as if it does something that Sensing doesn't seems like serious hokum to me. I just think the distinctions aren't as cut and dried as people like to think.
    They are different ways of processing things. That's all. Not abilities.

    Introverted perceivers will have different dispositions so that's the similarity you see. Calling Jung's work and the subsequent versions of it a method for nerds to get at back at jocks from high school is pretty short sighted.
    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    sheesh humans! for realz

  8. #88
    Nickle Iron Silicone Charmed Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I just think it gets silly, that's all. And I know intuitives get high and mighty about it. It's like this 'F-you, jock. So you made fun of me in high school but now I own you' mentality.

    And it seems to me that ISFPs, ISTPs, INFPs and INTPs really aren't all that different from each other, so I will extrapolate that the same goes for other groups as well. I've had intellectual, philosophical, enlightening conversations with the lot of them. So to talk about 'magical Ne' as if it does something that Sensing doesn't seems like serious hokum to me. I just think the distinctions aren't as cut and dried as people like to think.
    In the Socinoics camp, some would agree with you:

    There is a slight bias towards intuition in socionics, with many dichotomy descriptions exhibiting an oversimplified view of sensing and an exaggerated view of intuition. This is due to the theoretical nature of socionics (created by Augusta, who was an ILE) and the dominant role of intuiters in the field. It is not uncommon to read that extraverted intuition (extraverted intuition) is "penetration into the essence of things," while its dual function introverted sensing (introverted sensing) is "the ability to create comfort." In a society that values intellectual production and mental powers over aesthetic and physical harmony, most people would see extraverted intuition as a more desirable quality than introverted sensing (if described in the way shown above). This skews self-testing results, especially in the case of sensers who think of themselves as intellectuals.
    This made sense to me though:
    Intuiters are "mental" in the sense of identifying readily with things that they cannot see or experience physically, but "see in their minds." Sensers are also able to envision things in their minds, but they identify with them less and eventually lose interest in things that cannot be turned into reality.

    Sensers
    are "physical" in the sense of identifying more with physical reality and less with things that they see in their minds but cannot materialize. Sensers also make generalizations, have philosophical insights, and are interested in overarching "invisible" principles. However, they are willing to take seriously only those abstract principles that are closely tied to reality. Intuiters are often prone to make "abstractions on abstractions" and accept them for reality itself.
    Socionics :: Intuition / Sensing
    There is a thinking stuff from which all things are made, and which, in its original state, permeates, penetrates, and fills the interspaces of the universe.

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    Senior Member compulsiverambler's Avatar
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    Aren't Se and Ne supposed to be conscious and Si and Ni supposed to be unconscious? Not that I understand what that's supposed to mean, because I feel like I'm conscious of all four, but that's the conventional wisdom.

    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Something I'm noticing: It seems that it's typically the people who categorize themselves as 'N's who see things as more black and white; by this I mean, "I use intuition and don't sense; those who sense don't use intuition."
    Unless I'm misinterpreting her points (a distinct possibility) surely the only person doing that here is Ruthie? She seems to be insisting 'that can't be N, because everybody does it'.

    Sorry if I've misunderstood.

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    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Ooo I've been struggling with intuition recently. To me it's important that I understand my own mind and yet when I pluck the right answer out of the air I don't always understand how... and that's irritating. I mean how to I approach the bunch of ESTJs at work and explain that this is the right answer "cause it is" with no rationale?

    Anyhow to go with the cloud analogy, personally I feel my intuition works differently to sensing in that sensors pick out the objects (hazy or not though they may be) and can see the cloud only when they make the effort to link it all together where as I store the cloud in total and can only pick out the objects with effort.

    As to my internal filing of information... well that's more like a database but instead of strict relationships defined it's more like fuzzy logic. Some things are linked because that's how I found them and others get linked because their pattern or structure seem similar. For example I have paper stored next to Russ Abbot purely because of the character Basildon Bond which is also a paper manufacturer. Now I recall them as posh paper and Bond (as in 007) being posh.

    Then again, filing was never a strong suit of mine...
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

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