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  1. #11
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I know, I was trying to make a joke.

    Then again, I suppose Bugs Bunny wore that one out.
    I'm afraid I don't get it.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #12
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    I'm afraid I don't get it.
    A lot of people don't.

    It was based on the fact that normally, you can repeat a person's words back to them and mean the same thing. But with the words "me" and "you," one has to switch them around them in order to retain the meaning.

    My joke was an example of what would happen if someone didn't do this.

    I was hoping it would amuse the SJs enough to get them to pay attention to the thread... but apparently none of them are interested in functions enough to post here anyway.

  3. #13
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    A lot of people don't.

    It was based on the fact that normally, you can repeat a person's words back to them and mean the same thing. But with the words "me" and "you," one has to switch them around them in order to retain the meaning.

    My joke was an example of what would happen if someone didn't do this.

    I was hoping it would amuse the SJs enough to get them to pay attention to the thread... but apparently none of them are interested in functions enough to post here anyway.
    The thing Ni always seems to miss about jokes is that you have to include some indication that you're joking or it's not funny or meaningful to anyone else.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  4. #14
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    *awaits SJ answers*

    This should have been posted in the SJ forum, it's much less busy than the MBTI discussion forum. But eh whatever.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  5. #15
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Maybe Si means not giving a shit whether Ne doms understand your value system or not.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  6. #16
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Maybe Si means not giving a shit whether Ne doms understand your value system or not.
    Actually, Si isn't a value system. It's a perceiving function, like Ni, Ne, or Se. Their value system is based on Te or Fe.

    Si is actually pretty simple. It just means that once you find something that works for you (and possibly others), you stick with it, possibly even fight to keep it working that way, having seen how well it can work (almost like a past-oriented version of Ni, except we've "seen" how well it can work in our imagination. It also means you'll be slow to notice that it's not as effective anymore due to change, and will likely resist jumping on board with the new way of doing things until the last minute. It basically means your perception is based on overlaying snapshots of the past, seizing the common thread in what made the situations work, and deeming it a "standard" that needs to be used in situations similar to that one.

    Basically, the opposite of Ne, which keeps looking for new approaches even if the current one works well.

    Of course, Te or Fe could be used to change this approach somewhat... if they see that a new approach is more clearly efficient (Te), or considerate (Fe), they'll feel conflicted. ESxJs are likely to bend their Si in favor of their Te or Fe, while ISxJs will need a little more convincing to do the same.

    Still, it would be nice to hear this from an SJs mouth, though.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post

    So for you, how would you describe your inner thoughts, or how you approach the world?
    Thank you. You worded it in such a way i can understand.

    So the answer is .. My inner thoughts are a jumbled mess. Think of a lot of dots bouncing around, some dots become bigger to create a bigger and more productive idea and during this time, it is me trying to attach lines to all these dots to form a grounded idea of something. Only problem being, my ideas are always progessing, my ideas and thoughts are not solid so this is why i feel like i am always being contradictory as something i may of said on here 2 days ago may of changed now as i have been looking at other peoples interpretations and seeing if i can apply them to my thoughts to expand them.

    How i approach the world? Keep an open mind

    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Maybe Si means not giving a shit whether Ne doms understand your value system or not.
    +1
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  8. #18
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Si is my leading function. I use Si in daily life without even realizing it. Basically sometimes, if I see something or hear something, my mind usually automatically thinks of anything related to that sight/sound/taste/etc. in the past. It's involuntary, and works especially strongly for things that are more foreign to me. This can be very useful when studying for tests or working in school or in a job, but not so great in other circumstances, when a recollection of the past is undesired.

    It's almost like an inborn survival mechanism. For example, if... let's say years ago, I had a flu shot, and I still got sick five days after that flu shot. The next time I have to get a flu shot, I will think - ok, last time I got a flu shot, I still got sick five days after it, so what's the point in taking the flu shot this time?

    Another example is let's say I look at a tree. When I see the tree, I automatically think of any past associations I've had with that tree (my brain does this instantly, without me even thinking about it). Basically, it's like a built-in evolutionary instinct to find if I should continue with an activity that I have done in the past, or whether I shouldn't.

    I'm working on an assignment on a job - I first think of whether I've done this before. If the answer is yes, I think of what the performance was like last time I did. If it was good, then it encourages me to continue doing the activity. If it was bad, then it sort of discourages me a little. This is why change can be difficult for me. But when this happens, I usually tend to find the positives of doing the job.

    I rely on the past to perform in the present, but am honestly a little scared of the future. That's why experience is key especially for SJs.

    Another way I use Si is when I see or hear something, it can just stick in my mind, even sometimes for several years. If I force myself, I can capture a mental photograph of something and reproduce the same picture a short while later too. And of course, Si helps me in remembering any kinds of interesting facts or data.

  9. #19
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    That's an understandable and very honest description @ChosenOne, thank you for that . When you first read the Si descriptions, you can think "wow that's the most boring function ever". But you could easily miss the point that this is indeed the most primordial function aswell.

    There is that model, you prolly all know, from "human experience learning study" (ya, my english sucks ) when a kid touches a hot plate and finds out the plate is hot. It will touch the plate, no matter what until it found out the pain connected to touching it. Then it has learned.

    I would postulate that a S dominant would be more prone to actually finding out what it feels like what is called "hot plate that gives you pain" and a N dominant would be more prone to imagining and therefore accepting the fact the plate is hot so dont touch it.

    Both attitudes lead to problems that's for sure: The S dominant can get serious burns throughout life, while the N dominant could never actually experience life or worse be carried away mentally by the means of imagination into a reality that does not really exist.

    In addition to what TCO said:

    I myself had problems grasping the nature of Si and I admit I havent really grasped it so far. Maybe that's because I am waiting for some crucial epiphany to come along with the understanding of the function and totally miss the point that it is just as basic as the description of N is. With the difference that of course, if you are a N you can imagine a whole lotta shit in your N function, ranging from having the ability to predict the future to astral projecting oneself into starting to see the world in only colours, which are either indicators for a "good" person or a "bad" person .

    But and now comes my point, I generalized the whole thing a bit. I thought, according to mbti model the whole world can be divided into Si-Ne and Se-Ni types (not counting function order now, it's only a generalisation).

    Under that premisse I started to watch my surroundings to see what people do differently. And I found a 1st very intresting difference: there are 3 persons involved, me (entp), my girl (infj) and my mom (isfj).

    My mom has the unbeaten knack to know where every little item that ever went into our house is. She is like an archivist. She doesnt conciously remember it, like having a list in her head, when I asked her to find me something, she has hunches on where it could be and if you then wait around 10 minutes to 7 days she will come up with the item you wanted to find.

    It's a knack really. Now to me: I am not so good at that. But I think I do understand the basics. When I search for something, I remember sensory experience where I saw it the last time. Most of the times this is visual rememberance showing a place in my head where the item was. I am tho not very good to imagine pictures in my head, so this is pretty N influenced in my head and I will start connecting random facts having blurry pictures and ideas, often doing the search based on things I saw that can lay up to 10 years in the past and therefore not making the search successful cause I am mixing up time frames, places and different experience from the past. Even can go so far that I mix other peoples opinions I once heard or other peoples positions into my own and become very weird.

    Well nevertheless, my home and my computer are a mess to an outsider. If someone asks me for something, I will nevertheless find it, somehow, one day. My mom is better at that, but nevertheless I do aproach things the same way.

    Now comes the comparison to my INFJ: she makes lists for everything. She has a full statistical book in which everything one could bring in order is prolly ordered. So if she needs something, she opens her book and there lies the answer. And why is that ? Cause her memory of the past is that ultimately shitty, if you drive with her through a foreign town once and then drop her off at the location, leaving her there, telling her to find home on her own again, you never gonna see her again.

    I am not sure if that special idea does correlate with all Si-Ne and Se-Ni types. But, there is a difference in the approach concerning said things and it may be, may be not have got to do with Perceiving functions.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  10. #20
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Actually, Si isn't a value system. It's a perceiving function, like Ni, Ne, or Se. Their value system is based on Te or Fe.
    Meh. I see what you're saying.

    However, because Si is singular in framework (vs Ni, which is a multiplicity of frameworks of which the one most convenient to will or purpose can be chosen), it actually DOES reflect a value system.

    The imprint is that of the feeling and thinking impressions of an external system that was in itself created by judging functions, and since Si offers a singular viewpoint, it serves as a framework in its own right. Things that conform to the footprint are "right," things that do not are "wrong."

    The moral values here are impressed on the person via the perception rather than evaluated internally and stored inside that way, and also a matter of conformance to the perception rather than some rational process.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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