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  1. #11
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    Fi =/= beliefs. Not sure where that came from, or how someone's personality could be dominated purely by beliefs (Fi dom).
    May well be coming from places like infporinfj.com, and the whole Berens circle in general, and their interpretations of Beebe. Like they will say "knowing what you want for yourself" (cognitive process test question), or describe these "personal values" in such terms as "I want", "I don't want", "I like" "I don't like". (Berens, Jung's Cognitive Proceses).

    I grappled with that for over a year, and it is highly confusing. Contrasts with the notion of TP's being so "detached", you would think they had no wants, likes or beliefs at all; (except for shadowy "archetypes").
    That's where Lenore Thomson came in very handy, beause she pointed out that the ego has an emotional investment in its dominant function; whatever it is, and that Feeling can remain undifferentiated for a T, and thus does not have to be "used".

    Basically, "beliefs" when associated with Fi should be understood as primarily ethical beliefs, and inasmuch as it goes beyond ethics; it is about making decisions based on "what's nice" or not (based on an internal standard).
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

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  2. #12
    AKA Nunki Polaris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat
    FPs- How does Fe manifest in you (or it's lack thereof)? How does it clash with Fi? Explain, how do you disvalue it? What about Ti?
    I wouldn't say I devalue Fe. Fe allows me to connect with people through shared values and formalities, and the fact that these things exist on a social level brings them an element of security. All you have to do is stick to the rules of conduct, and you can get by without offending anyone and causing yourself stress. Of course, it's not always easy to know what kind of behavior will work in a given context, but so long as you obey some set of rules, you at least know that you acted properly by a standard, if not their standard. Which brings me to the other positive side of Fe: that it gives me a much-needed dose of superiority. Using Fe, I can put myself on a level of conduct that goes above that of many people I meet. Sometimes this can lead to condescending behavior, but usually it only makes me generous.

    The negative side of Fe, and this is where I bring in Fi, is that when I see a person who wants nothing except to win approval and who never does anything against society's rulebook, I see someone whom I can only think of as fake. Such a person has no originality; he lives off of other people like a parasite. And this is something I dread in myself. I don't want to lose touch with the things that make me unique; if I did, my life would have no point; I would be worthless.

    So I often experience a tension between Fe and Fi. I step away from a social experience, and I criticize myself for playing too much or too little by the rules. Or someone says something offensive, and just as I'm about to speak up, I bite my tongue because I know everyone agrees. Or I want to do something original like change my hairstyle, and I can't muster the courage because I know everyone will wonder at me. In short, I don't want to care what other people think and yet I care very much.

    Regarding Ti, it's a constant companion but not one I use on the same level as ITPs.
    [ Ni > Ti > Fe > Fi > Ne > Te > Si > Se ][ 4w5 sp/sx ][ RLOAI ][ IEI-Ni ]

  3. #13
    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Great thread topic, Black Cat!


    Extraverted Feeling: Connecting; considering others and the grouporganizing to meet their needs and honor their values and feelings; maintaining societal, organizational, or group values; adjusting to and accommodating others; deciding if something is appropriate or acceptable to others. Considering what would be appropriate for the situation: One should or shouldnt wear or People will think
    I don't know how much I use this, but I doubt I use it much.

    I don't give a rat's ass about societal, organizational, or group values, for the most part.

    I connect with, consider the needs of, and accomodate others, but I suspect that's a reflection of Ne+Fi.

    Extraverted iNtuiting: Interpreting situations and relationships; picking up meanings and interconnections; being drawn to change what is for what could possibly be; noticing what is not said and threads of meaning emerging across multiple contexts. Noticing the possible meanings of what you might wear: Wearing this might communicate
    Introverted Feeling: Valuing; considering importance and worth; reviewing for incongruity; evaluating something based on the truths on which it is based; clarifying values to achieve accord; deciding if something is of significance and worth standing up for. Evaluating whether you like an outfit or not: This outfit suits me and feels right.
    I think these two things together enable me to get along socially while maintaining personal authenticity.

    If I used Fe more effectively, I might have less conflict with others, but it just wouldn't be me, so I don't want to use it anyway.

    I admire Fe in those who use it effectively, but if I used it, I'd feel like a phony in drag.



    Introverted Thinking: Analyzing; categorizing; evaluating according to principles and whether something fits the framework or model; figuring out the principles on which something works; checking for inconsistencies; clarifying definitions to get more precision. Analyzing your options using principles like comfort or Red is a power color.
    I probably don't use Ti much, either.

    I'm sure I would NEVER apply it to interpersonal situations.

    It seems that Fi and Ti serve a very similar purpose, but I definitely use Fi most of the time.
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  4. #14
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wonkavision View Post
    Great thread topic, Black Cat!

    I connect with, consider the needs of, and accomodate others, but I suspect that's a reflection of Ne+Fi.
    Thanks.

    And this is what I was getting at, when I actually do care about and accommodate another person, it's because they're on my mental "list" you could say of people I respect.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  5. #15
    Ginkgo
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    Most of the time my Fi blots out Fe.

    However, when I am in a foreign situation like visiting another country, I aspire to treat people with respect according to their values. Sometimes it is hard to distinguish between the two functions because I believe that Fe can be somewhat ingrained into Fi.

    Other than that, my Fe is extremely weak. For instance, I am often reclusive and sometimes cold. Furthermore, I find many social situations to be awkward or needless. Most people have an incredibly hard time reading me, and will either think of me as an angel or a demon.

  6. #16
    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Damn you, Black Cat, for quoting me before I caught my mistakes!!!

    I've got to edit myself more before making a post.
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  7. #17
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wonkavision View Post
    Damn you, Black Cat, for quoting me before I caught my mistakes!!!
    Lol I don't know what you're talking about. (look at the quote again) You just said that your Ti sucks anyway.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wonkavision View Post
    Ne+Fi
    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic Tater View Post
    However, when I am in a foreign situation like visiting another country, I aspire to treat people with respect according to their values. Sometimes it is hard to distinguish between the two functions because I believe that Fe can be somewhat ingrained into Fi.
    If Fi dictates that I respect someone, or a group or situation, then I generally must meet their expectations for the interaction or event.

    interesting to think about two Fi-users both obeying a 'Fe rule' in order to respect each other.

  9. #19
    Glycerine
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    After putting other people first for an extended time, I will go into periods of extreme selfishness, I have noticed this with my ESFJ dad also. I guess that's the point where Fe users can lose themselves, can overcompensate and then they go into periods of selfishness. That's how I have seen Fi manifest in myself and my dad. I have seen the opposite with some INFPs. When they lose themselves, they can go overboard in helping people.

  10. #20
    That chalkboard guy Matthew_Z's Avatar
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    I always imagined Te was the function for those who could only be happy if everything was as efficient as possible. What do I think of those people? Suckers. Is there no higher purpose than to have everything organized? If you rule the world, then what? </hardly-MBTI-related-rant> (also, the answer "conquer the next world" is not acceptable)

    For me, Te generally only comes out under stress, that is, when something NEEDS to be done. It seems to naturally block off avenues I would much prefer left open.

    To be frank, my knowledge of the F functions is relatively weak. However, based on the profiles of both that I've read, I think it's safe to say that my Fi is stronger than my Fe. In my experience, Fi is the function of self discovery. It can be a little helpful in orienting the direction of life. Why do I go to school? Why do I prefer being alone? Why aren't I a hermit living on some farm on the fringes of civilization? Why do I make friends? Questions such as those are ones I generally would use an Fi answer for.
    If a deaf INFP falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?

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