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  1. #1
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    Default Confusion between Si and Fi.

    I was thining about this the other day and to me I will stick with the literal definition of Si as internal sensation vs Fi as internal feeling. These would actually be very hard in a romantic sense to distinguish. Because internal sensations can be confused with good feelings.

    I was curious about how ISTJ in particular felt because of there tertiary Fi. Does this make sense in that sometimes feelings get confused with the sensations that cause them? Like hurt and sadness or something that is pleasurable and happy or something like that?

    I get lost between Ti and tertiary Ni and the line between when validated logic starts to cross into abstract theory.

    How do others feel about there confusion between your dominant and tertiary functions?

  2. #2
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Si values are of exogenous origin (cultural indoctrination) while Fi values are of endogenous origin.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Si values are of exogenous origin (cultural indoctrination) while Fi values are of endogenous origin.
    So in some types our brain may be programmed to associate internal sensations with internal feelings? I was using a sinus rinse because of allergies(gross I know), but it brought up thoughts of water going in your noise while swimming. The sensation I dont like but doesnt cause me any feelings. If I had got scared of drowning at one point thought it may have brought up feelings of fear or something and I may avoid the sensation to avoid the feeling tied to that sensation.

    I was just curious how this affects Si dominant types with a tertiary Fi.

  4. #4
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    I was thining about this the other day and to me I will stick with the literal definition of Si as internal sensation vs Fi as internal feeling. These would actually be very hard in a romantic sense to distinguish. Because internal sensations can be confused with good feelings.

    I was curious about how ISTJ in particular felt because of there tertiary Fi. Does this make sense in that sometimes feelings get confused with the sensations that cause them? Like hurt and sadness or something that is pleasurable and happy or something like that?

    I get lost between Ti and tertiary Ni and the line between when validated logic starts to cross into abstract theory.

    How do others feel about there confusion between your dominant and tertiary functions?
    I think you might be taking the terms of introverted Sensing and introverted Feeling too literally (especially Si). Si is really more distinct and objective than subjective. It deals with storing factual information, or remembering sensory input from your past. The great use of Si is memory as well as learning from past experiences to perform better in the present and future.

    As for Fi, I've said before that this is one of the most difficult functions to comprehend. It basically is a scale of what you feel is valuable or a certain set of beliefs which you hold pride in. It's based more on principles than facts, more subjective than objective (unlike Si, which is more objective). Fi can be more hidden or concealed than a function like Fe, which is used more to interact with others.

    Hope that helped.

  5. #5
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Feeling, in the MBTI sense, does not equal emotion. Fi is a rational thought process that is influenced by emotion and is value-oriented. So Fi is not simply a matter of having an emotion come over you, rather its a reasoning process that considers the emotion in it's viewpoint.

    Some good thoughts on Fi here:

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...-thinking.html
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne View Post
    I think you might be taking the terms of introverted Sensing and introverted Feeling too literally (especially Si). Si is really more distinct and objective than subjective. It deals with storing factual information, or remembering sensory input from your past. The great use of Si is memory as well as learning from past experiences.

    As for Fi, I've said before that this is one of the most difficult functions to comprehend. It basically is a scale of what you feel is valuable or a certain set of beliefs which you hold pride in. It's based more on principles than facts, more subjective than objective (unlike Si, which is more objective than subjective). Fi can be more hidden or concealed than a function like Fe, which is used more to interact with others.

    Hope that helped.
    Yes, what you said supports what I said in that you remember sensory data and with memory comes better recollection of past events and the sensory tied to that. How does facts have to do with sensory? Logically facts seems like it would support Te more than Si.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Feeling, in the MBTI sense, does not equal emotion. Fi is a rational thought process that is influenced by emotion and is value-oriented. So Fi is not simply a matter of having an emotion come over you, rather its a reasoning process that considers the emotion in it's viewpoint.

    Some good thoughts on Fi here:

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...-thinking.html
    I am trying to get behind MBTI because there seems to be alot of overlap between functions even in the definitions of them.

  7. #7
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    Yes, what you said supports what I said in that you remember sensory data and with memory comes better recollection of past events and the sensory tied to that. How does facts have to do with sensory? Logically facts seems like it would support Te more than Si.
    Well, when I say 'facts', I mean to differentiate them from 'ideas'. Maybe instead of facts, think data. Basically, Si is the storage of data and sensory input. Te is more about the use of organizational tactics to run systems or people. And yeah, Te utilizes facts and logic.

  8. #8
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    I do have trouble distinguishing where Si ends and Fi begins sometimes, yeah, especially when considering emotional things or things of value to me. Using Si to perceive most of life's events, and then using Fi to judge what I value about those events and how I want things to be (my desires). Life's events are first detected by Si, but the end goal and structure is Fi (or Te, but we're talking about Fi).

    Now when I first detect an experience with Si, I may "feel" whether I like it or not...that's where it's hard to draw the line as to whether I'm perceiving or judging.

    I think it's Fi quickly reacting to Si input. Can Si by itself make a judgment as to whether something "feels good?" It just experiences it, so I think it's probably a fast two-step process.

    Si is weird because the facts collected about the world are personalized, I think that's the best way I've heard it said. I have an idea in my mind about how my house looks--regardless of whether my house actually looks that way. I'm used to that idea of my house. When asked about where my other computer is, I will often answer that it's in that room between the living room and the kitchen. I've forgotten that we've gotten rid of that computer years ago and rearranged that room quite a bit. In my head, it's still "the room with the main computer."

    So in that sense, maybe, memories are more real to Si users than the actual present world. But also see (back to the thread topic) that there are no inherent values attached to that memory, it's just an automatic recall in my head. There definitely can be, but I don't think Si alone can do it.
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  9. #9

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    yeh, I'd say the major difference is one is a perceiving function, and the other is a judging function. Si types think, see, feel, experience an internal world. Fi types just use it as a factor in decision making. It's how they judge things.

    So I guess an Si knows when they are hungry and should eat. They know why they are feeling under the weather on a certain day, they know why a memory is important. Whereas an Fi type just knows what judgment they make on human impact and the personal. It's a conviction about it, or a feeling that a certain answer is right, a knowing that something is a certain way, etc.

    ie. experiential vs judgmental.

    As an ENFP, Fi serves as a slave to Ne. It helps me experience the other's experience more than anything. In terms of knowing where I am at and everything about my emotions, etc., my introverted perceiving is a long way down the list. I normally know far better for others because they are in the Ne domain, so I can intuit about what I see, and judge by Fi. It can come out pretty clearly when watching movies. You see a character in trouble, and just feel you know everything they are going through, you feel like you've been there, even though you've never experienced anything like what they have, and have lived some rather comfy middle-class life instead. In a way, you end up learning a lot from other's experience, and connecting their thoughts and consequences. And you spend most of the time working from inside out rather than outside in. You get a feeling about their situation, and you use the world and conversation to clarify it, rather than seeing emotions then digging to find where they are at.
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