iNtuitors thinking they are Sensors

[Matthew_Z]

I knew an INTP on this forum who once thought he was an ISTJ, anyone remember his name?

My hypothesis behind any N thinking that they are an S is largely due to a misconception about the meaning of S and N. N does not imply S-tard. (And, conversely, S does not imply N-tard.) Simply because one is not literally blind does not at all indicate an S preference. Ns are humans. Humans use senses. (barring rare conditions and afflictions) Therefore, Ns use senses. It's more than reasonable to expect that an N can mistake themselves for an S due to a misunderstanding of N. (and perhaps S as well)

 

[Laurie]

And around this here forum there is a feeling that N's are wonderful and more awesomer than S's. I'm guessing many N's don't actually feel that way, so that can be confusing. I'm not awesomer enough to be an N.

 

[briochick]

And around this here forum there is a feeling that N's are wonderful and more awesomer than S's. I'm guessing many N's don't actually feel that way, so that can be confusing. I'm not awesomer enough to be an N.

+1
I'm not sure you could have said that better.

 

[Ozz]

And around this here forum there is a feeling that N's are wonderful and more awesomer than S's. I'm guessing many N's don't actually feel that way, so that can be confusing. I'm not awesomer enough to be an N.

Good to know.

 

[violet_crown]

I'm trying to get enough tickets to get "ESFP go-go girl" at the samsara prize booth.

 

[INTJ123]

Reserved, often guarded about their feelings, with a strong tendency to internalize feedback, introverted intuitives are often at a loss to explain how and why they are misunderstood. As there is relatively little information about statistical minority to which they belong, introverted intuitives lack information to confirm what they have felt throughout their lives: that they have experienced prejudice which is as strong as any form of racism, sexism, or religious intolerance. This, in turn, reinforces a sense of aloneness that has been analyzed extensively by Colin Wilson who in The Outsider,
writes, “At first sight, the Outsider is a social problem. He is a hole-in-corner man.” Wilson goes on to quote French author Henri Barbusse, whose protagonist in the novel L’Enfer describes himself: “Again, I am on the pavement, and I am not at peace as I had hoped. An immense confusion bewilders me. It is as if I could not see things as they
were. I see too deep and too much.”
It is this quality, this seeing “too deeply and too much” which is both the blessing and curse of the IN personality. Without this enhanced quality of perception, an introverted intuitive would have a different character and identity, perhaps a different genetic code. The ability to see deeply and greatly brings depth to one’s vision, passion to one’s heart, and strengthens one’s connection to that unique place inside each of us which connects us to something greater than ourselves, the soul. To be an introverted intuitive is to know beyond and rational sense that these inner realities are at least as important, and sometimes more important, than the than the external world, even though there may be little or no sensory data to support that belief.


To sum it all up quite simply, intuitives don't confuse themselves with S because they already have S capabilities and know that intuition is something on a whole different level.

S types on the other hand rarely experience intuition but often see the fruits of it that we bring, they probably secretly admire and wish to be like this themselves(at least sometimes) yet cannot seem to access this part of themselves (the right side of the neocortex)

In my honest opinion I do not think S and N are "opposites". We can't just flip our personality and use intuition as easily as the other functions.

 

[BlueScreen]

And around this here forum there is a feeling that N's are wonderful and more awesomer than S's. I'm guessing many N's don't actually feel that way, so that can be confusing. I'm not awesomer enough to be an N.

+1

Me neither. I thought Jeffster owned the awesomeness anyway.

 

[garbage]

Reserved, often guarded about their feelings, with a strong tendency to internalize feedback, introverted intuitives are often at a loss to explain how and why they are misunderstood. As there is relatively little information about statistical minority to which they belong, introverted intuitives lack information to confirm what they have felt throughout their lives: that they have experienced prejudice which is as strong as any form of racism, sexism, or religious intolerance.
...
To sum it all up quite simply, intuitives don't confuse themselves with S because they already have S capabilities and know that intuition is something on a whole different level.

S types on the other hand rarely experience intuition but often see the fruits of it that we bring, they probably secretly admire and wish to be like this themselves(at least sometimes) yet cannot seem to access this part of themselves (the right side of the neocortex)

In my honest opinion I do not think S and N are "opposites". We can't just flip our personality and use intuition as easily as the other functions.

If sensing is on a lower level than the one on which you operate, and if you have access to it, how can you possibly be misunderstood? You could just simply communicate on their level.

And if that isn't possible, isn't it likely that there's something that they're grasping that you cannot?

You make your "problem" sound so burdensome and yet so simple at the same time.

 

[onemoretime]

I think it's strange to somehow consider intuition to be some "higher" plane that's completely unattainable to most of the population. Sure, it ends up being very beneficial in our highly information-oriented society, but then again, intuitives would never get anything done without those sensors who keep things running smoothly.

 

[INTJ123]

If sensing is on a lower level than the one on which you operate, and if you have access to it, how can you possibly be misunderstood? You could just simply communicate on their level.

And if that isn't possible, isn't it likely that there's something that they're grasping that you cannot?

You make your "problem" sound so burdensome and yet so simple at the same time.

intuitives are forced everyday to compromise their style of communication to function in this sensor dominated population. Sensors have no need or desire to use intuition since using the sensing function is "normal".

This in itself shows that intuitives actually practice using the other function more than sensors.

 

[garbage]

intuitives are forced everyday to compromise their style of communication to function in this sensor dominated population. Sensors have no need or desire to use intuition since using the sensing function is "normal".

This in itself shows that intuitives actually practice using the other function more than sensors.

This doesn't really answer any of the questions that I posed, nor does your text actually follow from what the article shows. All the article states is that those of similar preferences are drawn to similar professions and that different preferences arise from different portions of the brain.

Are you claiming that sensors don't use intuition? As the function of forecasting and of association between disparate ideas, it's absolutely necessary to have a level of intuition in order to even function.

 

[Cimarron]

intuitives are forced everyday to compromise their style of communication to function in this sensor dominated population. Sensors have no need or desire to use intuition since using the sensing function is "normal".

This in itself shows that intuitives actually practice using the other function more than sensors.

That makes sense to me. I don't see INTJ123 claiming here that Sensors don't use Intuition. I see a claim that Intuitives have to "overexert themselves" farther into the S domain if they should want to communicate with most of society than Sensors have to exert themselves into the N domain--purely because of less necessity for the Sensors to do so. (Though it's hard to quantify "how much more N/S a person is using in contrast to other people.")

Why would a German-speaking person living in China have to use more Chinese language skills than the Chinese-native people around him? Because he's in the clear minority. He has to learn Chinese to survive, but they don't have to learn German to survive.

 

[nightning]

I am curious as to where you get that information from INTJ123... That's the first time I've seen somebody try to link the triune brain with cognitive functions. (I'm also not sure if I buy into that)

 

[garbage]

That makes sense to me. I don't see INTJ123 claiming here that Sensors don't use Intuition. I see a claim that Intuitives have to "overexert themselves" farther into the S domain if they should want to communicate with most of society than Sensors have to exert themselves into the N domain--purely because of less necessity for the Sensors to do so. (Though it's hard to quantify "how much more N/S a person is using in contrast to other people.")

Why would a German-speaking person living in China have to use more Chinese language skills than the Chinese-native people around him? Because he's in the clear minority. He has to learn Chinese to survive, but they don't have to learn German to survive.

I sort of agree with your analogy, but I don't think that's the claim being made here. It would be that claim if German and Chinese were seen as equal but different languages. Instead, the two "languages" here are seen as being on two unequal planes, with those who can access the higher of the two also having the capacity to access the lower.

I refer to this post, which is the starting point for the fundamental argument that's being made.

 

[INTJ123]

That makes sense to me. I don't see INTJ123 claiming here that Sensors don't use Intuition. I see a claim that Intuitives have to "overexert themselves" farther into the S domain if they should want to communicate with most of society than Sensors have to exert themselves into the N domain--purely because of less necessity for the Sensors to do so. (Though it's hard to quantify "how much more N/S a person is using in contrast to other people.")

Why would a German-speaking person living in China have to use more Chinese language skills than the Chinese-native people around him? Because he's in the clear minority. He has to learn Chinese to survive, but they don't have to learn German to survive.

that is exactly my point. Good analogy.

 

[Xander]

Good question nnnnninnng..

Only just saw it but still...

Ever think that N is made into the hero too much? I mean it seems like every detective is an N and their ever loved sidekicks are Ss. Who wants to be a sidekick?

There does seem to be some disparity where there's a lot of intense S style thinking around the subject too. Almost like the differences are highlighted and so they think they're a different type where as in fact they are just more moderate than their peers.

Of course a huge problem is that people want to be mysterious and they think that Ns are mysterious where as we're mostly just confused...

Personally though I don't think I want to be an S. I don't really want to be any other type than my own though I do wish some would not be my type and increase it's prestige

 

[Snow Turtle]

So... The title and the question in the OP are different topics. We've only had a few cases of Ns typing themselves as S. There's an obvious huge difference between S's believing they are Ns and the reverse. I simply chalk it down to N being in the minority.

When people read the N descriptions, one thing that constantly stands out is that the thinking style is of the minority. There's a special factor to it, and thus sensors who don't identify with the majority will mislabel themselves as sensors even if their thinking style isn't necessarily representive.

Sensor descriptions on the other hand. People that do identify themselves as that usually think: Ohhh that's me! But realise that it's quite a normal way of thinking, there are many people who are like me. That's pretty true.

So basically I'm just saying that the descriptions of S despite describing individuals, tend to give off a this is the normal way of thinking vibe. Where as N descriptions are more of the "You're different" but it's been a while since I read profiles properly.

I suspect that most Ns feel that they are different even before they discovered MBTI, but if there are Ns here that don't. Speak up please! I'd be interested in hearing the story.

 

[Xander]

Thinking about it I wonder if the mistyping of Ss is due to the S culture. In other words, the most common literature and discussed thinking about how we as people work would, if the averages are to be believed, are written by sensors for sensors so when the MBTI appears in their purview promising new revelations then perhaps they type themselves as different because the S types seem too "simple" an answer.

It'd be kind of like finding out there is 16 types of human biology and when tested yours came back originally as "human" but you're sure that your rage levels mean you're actually nine tenths klingon or something...

 

[nightning]

Ever think that N is made into the hero too much? I mean it seems like every detective is an N and their ever loved sidekicks are Ss. Who wants to be a sidekick?

Well there's certainly that sort of attitude and thinking style here on the forum. (N >> S mentality :rolli I'm not sure how true this might be out in the "real world". I guess maybe it still applies.

Of course a huge problem is that people want to be mysterious and they think that Ns are mysterious where as we're mostly just confused...

See I never see N as being mysterious, confused... oh yes very very true. That (wanting to seem mysterious) could be a lure for S thinking they're N where as Ns wouldn't do the reverse in thinking they're S. Could be one possibility for sure.

Personally though I don't think I want to be an S. I don't really want to be any other type than my own though I do wish some would not be my type and increase it's prestige

For me, it's not about wanting to be one type or the other... it's rather I simply am a complete space cadet N such that there's no way anybody will believe that I'm an S.

Prestige... I would have thought the INTJs will be more interested in prestige then the INTPs...

So... The title and the question in the OP are different topics. We've only had a few cases of Ns typing themselves as S. There's an obvious huge difference between S's believing they are Ns and the reverse. I simply chalk it down to N being in the minority.

Oh I didn't realize the question asked should directly follow the title. I thought to just to use this title to reflect parallelism to the sensor thread. My apologies for the confusion. I just found it interesting this discrepancy with incidents of mistyping and made this thread.

Sensor descriptions on the other hand. People that do identify themselves as that usually think: Ohhh that's me! But realise that it's quite a normal way of thinking, there are many people who are like me. That's pretty true.

I think you hit right on with my main question. Is this so much that Ns are more likely to accurately type themselves as Ns compared to Ss or is it that the S behaviour are considered to be so "normal" that nobody thought to comment on how they are "S-like"?

I suspect that most Ns feel that they are different even before they discovered MBTI, but if there are Ns here that don't. Speak up please! I'd be interested in hearing the story.

This certainly is true for me. I never seem to fit in to groups and such... then when I stumbled upon MBTI type profiles.... suddenly you go "ah ha!" this sounds like me!

 

[simulatedworld]

Did anybody ever consider the idea that the "N bias" on something like an internet forum might have something to do with the fact that iNtuition actually is more useful in an abstract environment like an internet forum?

Sensors have the upper hand when it comes to most things in the real world, but a forum like this is inherently abstract and impersonal enough that it's no wonder it attracts so many Ns.

Granted, a lot of Ns are dicks to Ss for no good reason, but when it comes to discussing all the implications of topics that do not translate directly into tangible real-world experience, iNtuition actually is a more effective approach.