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  1. #11
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank View Post
    I am able to do this too but only to a point. If I don't see any use whatsoever in the knowledge than I intenionally limit my time in those areas. This was an ongoing debate I had with an NTP I know. He had amassed a vast amount of knowledge in an area with absolutely no use. I though he was crazy for spending so much time on something that he could never use, he thought I was dense or shallow for not seeing acquiring the knowledge as a worthwhile end result. Objectively I know that no preferred way is better. I just could never "waste" that much time. Different strokes and all.

    What qualifies as, "something he could never use?"
    Dare I evoke the old saying: "One person's trash, is another person's treasure."

    To me, there's not much knowledge that can't be called: useful.
    However, you won't catch me amassing knowledge of butterflies,
    or the behavior of rabbits.


  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberrylover View Post
    Do you have a clear and detailed image of the person you want to be? How do you arrive at this ideal? Do you use morals, logic, or something else?

    For me, I have a vague idea of the person I want to be and it's just a feeling of adventure and being all around FABULOUS. haha! I don't have conscious ideas of how to get to that place, but I can intuit when I've taken a wrong step. Do you also feel your way through or do you have a carefully scheduled plan via your J to implement your self-growth?
    Yes, I do have a specific image in mind when pursuing personal growth. I think that I arrive at this ideal by using both morals and logic, and intuition is certainly a big part in it, it's not something I can put into words, it's some kind of a strong feeling that I just KNOW.

    I do plan things out and make lists (in my mind) about how to reach the "big" goal. I guess it's like my own version of Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
    I envision that I need to do this, this and this, little goals on the way, in order to achieve a higher level. But I can also renegotiate with myself whenever I fulfill one little goal and start moving towards another little goal. Analyzing whether moving this way or that way would be the best course of action to reach to the next goal. It's sort of like I know what the end result I want to achieve but the road to that point in not linear, not straight from point A to point B but instead it starts from point A but reaches point B through point Z. Sounds weird but it is how it is

  3. #13
    ThatGirl
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    I only grow through understanding. I don't need experience, only to understand. To know of and why.

  4. #14
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    I'm actually trying to shrink as a person, and I've been doing it by improving my eating habits mostly.
    Jeffster Illustrates the Artisan Temperament <---- click here

    "I like the sigs with quotes in them from other forum members." -- Oberon

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  5. #15
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    In Berens' book on temperament, she actually splits the top of the Maslow pyramid into four, with each temperament having (on top of the three "basic" needs on bottom), their own "Self-Esteem" and "self-Actualization" level. Self-esteem is the core need (Freedom and Impact, Responsibility and Stability, Knowledge and Mastery, Self-Realization and Integrity), and the top of the pyramid is the temperament name itself.
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    What qualifies as, "something he could never use?"
    Dare I evoke the old saying: "One person's trash, is another person's treasure."

    To me, there's not much knowledge that can't be called: useful.
    However, you won't catch me amassing knowledge of butterflies,
    or the behavior of rabbits.

    Good point. I guess never intended to use would be more accurate.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    In Berens' book on temperament, she actually splits the top of the Maslow pyramid into four, with each temperament having (on top of the three "basic" needs on bottom), their own "Self-Esteem" and "self-Actualization" level. Self-esteem is the core need (Freedom and Impact, Responsibility and Stability, Knowledge and Mastery, Self-Realization and Integrity), and the top of the pyramid is the temperament name itself.
    Didn't know that, thanks!

    Found the link. Yay Google

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffster View Post
    I'm actually trying to shrink as a person, and I've been doing it by improving my eating habits mostly.
    Duly noted that SPs grow through dieting.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sky is BLUE! View Post
    Yes, I do have a specific image in mind when pursuing personal growth. I think that I arrive at this ideal by using both morals and logic, and intuition is certainly a big part in it, it's not something I can put into words, it's some kind of a strong feeling that I just KNOW.
    Hmm, I'm wondering whether ENFPs and INFJs grow similarly, but just look at it from the opposite directions? Allow me to explain using a somewhat old, somewhat obnoxious movie.

    Remember that feather that floats in the air in the beginning and end of Forest Gump? It sounds like if you were that feather, you'd say, "OK, I'm flying west because I decided to fly west, because the way I'm angled means I'll fly west." Whereas if I were that feather, I'd say, "Hmm, I guess I'm flying west because the wind is blowing me that way. And hey look, I'm angled that way too. What a coincidence!"

    I don't have the self knowledge that you do and my vision of the person I want to become is fuzzy. So Instead, with my Ne, I'm attuned to the odd coincidences and synchronicities that can tell me I'm on the right track.

    (Erg... my first reply to this was so much better but my internet connection lost it. So I hope that made sense.)

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberrylover View Post
    What do you use to self-actualize, to grow as a person?
    I think I use a combination of action and reflection. I do have a lot of trouble deciding on objectives, on where to really drive forward. When I do find a clear objective I have no trouble pushing forward to it but finding that point is a very difficult.

    Because I have trouble deciding on objectives I tend to choose a general direction and use performance goals to measure myself.

    I need experience, hands on experience to feed myself.

  10. #20
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strawberrylover View Post
    Didn't know that, thanks!

    Found the link. Yay Google
    Wow, I didn't know those books were on there!
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

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