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  1. #21
    Senior Member run's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wren View Post
    What does logic have to do with values? Serious question.
    Well it sometimes has a connection. But when its not logic, what is it? That's my question.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Eagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wren View Post
    What does logic have to do with values? Serious question.
    Quite a bit in some ways. Values make us who we are. It seems that things that define us as individuals mix a lot like that. Values are logical, but they are also something that is meant to be felt and lived. They exist fully on both sides of the spectrum.
    - Caleb

    "I am what I need to be..."

    "Nemo me impune lacessit - No one provokes me with impunity."

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I think objective morality is "my rights end where yours begin." That's why things like lying, stealing, cheating, rape, and murder are wrong: they interfere with the instrinsic right of other human beings. Overstepping the bounds, as one might say.

    One might then say,"well it's in my rational self interest to (lie or cheat or steal)" but that really isn't rational. It isn't really rational to hurt others unless it's in self-defense. People are social animals, and interdependence tends to be what works best for us. It's in our rational self-interest to extend to others the same behavior with which we would like to be treated. It makes everything easier for everybody.

    Morality can be very logical. But it isn't always.

    Just to chime in with my difference of opinion, I don't always think things like lying or stealing are morally wrong. I avoid them, because trust is important and taking advantage of people does not help the world become a better place. But, for instance, if I was hiding people in my house to save them from someone who wanted to hurt them, I'd lie to protect them. To me, that's the more moral choice.

    Similar to what you mentioned, I think my one main "rule" is to live your life however you like, as long as you're not causing harm to others and infringing on their personal rights.
    I-71%, N-80%, F-74%, P-96%

  4. #24
    Senior Member run's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eagle View Post
    Values are logical, but they are also something that is meant to be felt and lived. They exist fully on both sides of the spectrum.
    Vital information for your everyday life.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
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    Morals are subjective and dependant on the basic values that you believe in.

    Foundation one:
    It's not good to feel pain - I want to reduce pain in the world.

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