the tertiary function:overdevelopment

[sculpting]

If you are NeTe, that would make you an ENTX. I don't see how you can associate uyourself with ENFP.

If you follow the model proposed by Lennore and others I guess, Te is the tertiary function for an enfp. So when an enfp goes south, they will overrely on Te. "Blaze to amaze" was how zarc put it once.

I like ponies. and flowers. and I like to spoon. I fight it but it sneaks in when I am not looking. It's like a fart-it just slips out now and then.

To the OP, does it seem like Ne and Te work rather well hand in hand?

Together , when in high gear, they can kick ass and inspire devotion/comittment to an ideal in the same swoop as well as convey Ne vision. It can work very well with large groups that need motivation to finish a task. I run rampant and plow through the herds of the stupid, offer to take all responsibility and blame, and then my team follows me to the end as they know I am not there for the glory, but becuase I care about them. Very Joan of Arc/Martyr sort of thing. Must be why enfps can make good cult leaders (hmmm, keep that thought in mind.....)

In low gear, the combo seems to keep Fi sort of suppressed and out of trouble. It offers more emotional stability than Fi, but is not cuddly or nice particularly. It is effective, gets the bills paid, gets work done, but can be bitchy.

However it can be a bit tiring after awhile as it isnt natural. Fi is natural but really wobbly and moody as hell as well as over sensitive. Ne-Te has very clear boundaries about who matters and who doesnt. If you are out of the boundaries, your opinion is irrelevant and of no value, so it doesnt matter. Ne-Te also has no problems standing up to authority figures and explaining why we will not be following thier suggestions after all.

Also flaws-it is bitchy, irritable, prone to snapping at others over imperfection, all which are "mean" thus later initiate an Fi guilt factor that I was mean to someone else.

 

[Eric B]

If you are NeTe, that would make you an ENTX. I don't see how you can associate uyourself with ENFP.

So in Lenorre's book she speaks to the problems that happen when folks overdevelop the tertiary function rather than develop the functions in the natural order.

So to follow the discussion:
1) you have to buy into cognitive functions
2) think they may, mostly come in some sort of specific order, relative to the types

IRL, I tend to use Ne, Te, Fi rather than the conventional Ne, Fi, Te for an enfp. So I guess I overuse Te. There are pluses and minuses here and retrospectively I can see how I have both been helped and hindered by this approach in my life.

So my question-rather than spend lots of time "fixing" Fi to make it stronger-the lenorre solution, why not just build Te even more to make it less infantile and problematic? Why cant we just have an extra 16 personality types for us wierdos who overuse our tertiary functions?

Lenore also mentions Beebe's model in there, and Beebe says that the tertiary is prone to become "inflated", and possibly appear to outdo those with the process in the first two places. But then, it will also deflate, and you'll feel you can't do it right.

It makes me anaytical and driven and gives me some structure, but can also come across as bitchy, dominating, cold and bossy. If I am being logical I also like to be in control. Because it couples with Fi, I can also look moody as I swap between the two. Also the contrast can be irritating and unpredictable to others-am I fluffy puppy or dominant, analyzing puppy?

I've been trying to find out more about this. I have not really heard much about ENFP's having power/control issues. I even asked about it (for NF's as a whole) here:
http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/nf-idyllic/8278-do-nf-s-have-power-control-issues.html, and the answer generally seemed to be "no", unless, perhaps a value is at stake.

Of course, you're attributing this to an inflated Te; which is what drives the more traditionally "dominating" types. My NT'ishness has also been attributed to NeTe (and hence, really NeFiTe) by some (and still having a debate about this somewhere else), but I do not fit the type in many ways, and part of it is that "analyzing/controlling" side of me being so natural. I wonder if many of these "analytical" ENFP's (and any who would describe themselves as "dominating") might really be NTP's, especially since the trend is to push people away from NTP and into NFP. As Evan had pointed out awhile back, Ne+Ti can seem like Te. If you're ENTP, then Fe would be tertiary and "inflate" itself, making you appear F sometimes.

Si doesn't have morals. It is a perceiving function. It does inform the judging functions though, which do make morals.

That's basically what they were saying (though it did sound like the values were coming from Si itself). The Si would inform them with learned values. I'm familar with ISTJ's, and they often do sound very Fe-ish talking about what's "appropriate", "manners", etc. because it's what they've learned. Yet, watch them long enough, you'll see that they at heart really do not believe in that stuff. (not their true value).

 

[garbage]

If you are NeTe, that would make you an ENTX. I don't see how you can associate uyourself with ENFP.

Easily. It just means that the tertiary function is "overdeveloped."

 

[raz]

That's basically what they were saying (though it did sound like the values were coming from Si itself). The Si would inform them with learned values. I'm familar with ISTJ's, and they often do sound very Fe-ish talking about what's "appropriate", "manners", etc. because it's what they've learned. Yet, watch them long enough, you'll see that they at heart really do not believe in that stuff. (not their true value).

I think you've got it. We don't naturally come up with Fe stuff, but we acknowledge it as useful when we learn it, and it more of becomes a lesson rather than a way of properly interacting with people. Teaching myself how to relate to other people is like trying to shoot down a wall with a pistol.

 

[TaylorS]

*High Five*
Ti based FJs FTW.

LOL!!! We tend to be mistyped as INTP a lot, unfortunately.

 

[Asterion]

I've seen the opposite case actually, an INTP mistyped as an INFJ... he's into religion and poetry... but the motives behind it are seemingly different. Hmmm... maybe I'm totally wrong and he's actually INFJ and mistyped himself?