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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Of course I asked the wrong question (if you go by the book).
    This is why I call this experimenting.
    But your also pushing it in a direction, so its more like you are looking for something or steering it. Which can confuse people, especially if they dont see this. Perception is about noticing the world, whether you are N or S you still must use your senses to percieve something. People use sensors to throw up red flags saying something is not right, it detects changes that dont jive with what is expected. I am a sensor and my Se is throwing off alarms everywhere saying something is fishy with this thread and I gotta get to the bottom of it.

    This is Se in action. You cant see it, but my response is the action of it.

  2. #82
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    One observation about the misunderstandings in communication between S and N in the real life.

    S mean what they say and say it aloud.
    N try to see what's behind what S said.
    S doesn't mean anything else that is said. Literally.
    N still thinks there is something behind it all, something that is not said.

    N says something but actually the information is to be intrepreted.
    S hears what is said (the words) and does not read between the lines.
    S responds to what is actually said aloud.
    N is confused because s/he was expecting S to understand the hidden message.

    In both cases S - N communcaton is not successfull.
    I have personally experienced this.
    Last edited by alcea rosea; 08-04-2009 at 04:26 AM. Reason: Typo

  3. #83
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alcea rosea View Post
    One observation about the misunderstandings in communication between S and N in the real life.

    S mean what they say and say it aloud.
    N try to see what's behind what S said.
    S doesn't mean anything else that is said. Literally.
    N still thinks there is something behind it all, something that is not said.

    N says something but actually the information is to be intrepreted.
    S hears what is said (the words) and does not read between the lines.
    S responses to what is actually said aloud.
    N is confused because s/he was expecting S to understand the hidden message.

    In both cases S - N communcaton is not successfull.
    I have personally experienced this.
    I agree with this.
    S conversation style is often too concrete and to the point to grasp what is actually said . The only thing that saves me here is my strong Te. What means that I can swich to their style of communication if it is needed.

  4. #84
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I agree with this.
    S conversation style is often too concrete and to the point to grasp what is actually said . The only thing that saves me here is my strong Te. What means that I can swich to their style of communication if it is needed.
    Te can really do that. I have learned to use Te in my written communications and I'm not that good in interpreting hidden meanings from written text. It's harder I think, maybe that's harder only for extroverted people? I don' know.

    But when speaking, I'm very poor in Te. And thus, the misunderstandings between my spoken communicaiton style and S communication style will occur.

  5. #85
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I am wondering how often does this happen to other Ns.

    The scenario/task is that you have to walk through a city from point A to B and you will need about 20 minutes for that.
    But as you are walking you maintain only a small sensory imput which only tells you that you are walking on a sidewalk and you notice a street lights. But you don't notice any details like details on buildings ,trees and if you another person is coming you only register that a person is coming your way and that you should do something about it.
    The gender , clothing and colors are not registered in most cases.

    Which means that you in a way "fall a sleep" while you are walking throught out the streets to get to the point B. So when you get there you wake up and you can't recall most of your "trip". Which is because your brain was busy playing with concepts and ideas. Or you can simply wake up on the half of the way and you say to yourself "Cool, I am already here." .

    I am not talking about cases when you are listening to music along the way.

    i have similar expiriences and thats -i dont notice anything, and i cant think. i feel awful when i need to walk. and i feel a bit dead.. un-alive for sure.

  6. #86
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alcea rosea View Post
    Te can really do that. I have learned to use Te in my written communications and I'm not that good in interpreting hidden meanings from written text. It's harder I think, maybe that's harder only for extroverted people? I don' know.

    But when speaking, I'm very poor in Te. And thus, the misunderstandings between my spoken communicaiton style and S communication style will occur.
    Well I have misunderstandings with sensors all the time. But because of very well developed Te I can channel my thoughts and ideas so that a sensor can pick what I am saying without too much problems.
    But if we are talking about feelings and very abstract things then misunderstandings are inevitable.

  7. #87
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alcea rosea View Post
    N is confused because s/he was expecting S to understand the hidden message.
    Yes... well I don't purposely make hidden messages, to me what I say and what's meant by it's as plain as the nose on your face - to not assume the other person would get it would feel, to me, like patronizing them, like I was assuming they were stupid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post

    Which means that you in a way "fall a sleep" while you are walking throught out the streets to get to the point B. So when you get there you wake up and you can't recall most of your "trip". Which is because your brain was busy playing with concepts and ideas. Or you can simply wake up on the half of the way and you say to yourself "Cool, I am already here." .

    I am not talking about cases when you are listening to music along the way.
    Totally, all the time. ALL the time. My senses are barely switched on almost all the time. Hence all the Sensotard moments...

    Curiously though (perhaps), is that I never do listen to music when I'm out, except sometimes in the car. Why? Because I want to stay plugged into the world around me, and don't want to block it out. If someone gives me headphones even for a minute, I find it REALLY irritating and have to pull them out, it's like I've just been disabled or something. If asked what it is I'm actually noticing then, in that case, since it's rarely anything Sensory, I'm afraid I couldn't answer you in words, except to say "mostly intangible stuff"!
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  8. #88
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Yes... well I don't purposely make hidden messages,
    I don't either. I don't like to mislead anybody and if somebody doesn't understand my meanings, I dont' certainly think they are stupid, I just think that my communicaiton sucks. As it many times does.

    Me not doing it on purpose but doing it as it's natural for me might even make it a bigger problem. That's because it's hard for me not to do it.

  9. #89
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Yes... well I don't purposely make hidden messages, to me what I say and what's meant by it's as plain as the nose on your face - to not assume the other person would get it would feel, to me, like patronizing them, like I was assuming they were stupid.



    Totally, all the time. ALL the time. My senses are barely switched on almost all the time. Hence all the Sensotard moments...

    Curiously though (perhaps), is that I never do listen to music when I'm out, except sometimes in the car. Why? Because I want to stay plugged into the world around me, and don't want to block it out. If someone gives me headphones even for a minute, I find it REALLY irritating and have to pull them out, it's like I've just been disabled or something. If asked what it is I'm actually noticing then, in that case, since it's rarely anything Sensory, I'm afraid I couldn't answer you in words, except to say "mostly intangible stuff"!
    1. Well that is why I asked. Since I wanted to get a reply from a Ne user.


    2. The main reason why I like to take walks (alone) is exactly because then I can be alone with myself and I know that I will not be interrupted unless I run into someone. (what is quite unlikely)
    Plus stuff like sidewalks and streetlights keep my senses distracted so nothing can interrupt my inner process. Plus it is good from health.

    There is a number of people that are wondering quite a bit why I am walking around for at least 1 hour every day without any real/obvious reason.

  10. #90
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alcea rosea View Post
    One observation about the misunderstandings in communication between S and N in the real life.

    S mean what they say and say it aloud.
    N try to see what's behind what S said.
    S doesn't mean anything else that is said. Literally.
    N still thinks there is something behind it all, something that is not said.

    N says something but actually the information is to be intrepreted.
    S hears what is said (the words) and does not read between the lines.
    S responds to what is actually said aloud.
    N is confused because s/he was expecting S to understand the hidden message.

    In both cases S - N communcaton is not successfull.
    I have personally experienced this.

    Yes, I have experienced this quite a bit now. Since I have become aware of this divide, I have tried to be more understanding and diffuse conflict that I see arising because of it, and I think sometimes I have been successful, but it isn't always easy, and sometimes it seems I am at a loss for how to respond when the "N" person is so frustrated with me for not understanding their meaning and focusing on their words. The truth is I don't know what else to do. What you present to me is all I have to go on. I am not a mind-reader. And I also think sometimes when Ns try to read minds, they are not as accurate as they think they are.
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