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Thread: Is Keirsey Right?

  1. #11
    Welcome to Sunnyside Array Mondo's Avatar
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    Mar 2008


    According to Keirsey, many of the 'artsy types' are actually Sensors.
    For instance, I know he considers John Lennon to be an SP rather than an NF.

    I think people here tend to overestimate who is iNtuitive or not.
    Is it that people want their idols to be like them?

    Jack Bauer is my idol but I'm pretty sure he is an ISTP, same with Chuck Norris.
    MBTI Type: iNTj
    Enneagram Type: 3w4 sp/sx

  2. #12
    Senior Member Array edcoaching's Avatar
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    Jun 2008


    Kiersey is a great guy, has been involved with type since the very first Association for Psychological Type International conference in 1979, but didn't validate his own Kiersey Temperament Sorter until a few years ago. Until then the questions were based on his own thinking. He doesn't use the official MBTI form at all.

    There are a lot of scholars who have delved far deeper into type theory and applications and done far more complex research. There are over 10,000 entries in the Isabel Myers Memorial Library bibliography at CAPT: Training, Books, Research for MBTI, Archetypes, Leadership, Psychological Type. if you want to get a sampling...

    As to his population samples, I'd say our most reliable samples are from 7-12 grade schools where the students are taught extensively about type, work with it in various ways for a couple months, and then validate their own types. I do find 25-30% of the students prefer Intuition and demonstrate it in their information-gathering styles. For example in math research on 101 students, only 1 of the students who had determined Sensing as a preference used numbers to solve a fractions problem. They used trial and error with color tiles, guess and check, all kinds of different high-level thinking techniques, but no numbers. Intuitives, no matter their understanding, started writing equations and fiddling wiht numbers rather than tiles. If they used tiles, they first figured out how many they needed, doign the math in their heads.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Array NewEra's Avatar
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    Dec 2008


    I disagree that Intuitives make up only 10% of the population. As far as the people I know, it's about 60% S, 40% N. And also, this forum has 85% N, 15% S.

  4. #14
    heart on fire Array
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    May 2007


    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    What do you guys think about this?
    I feel like I know a lot more than 10% iNtuitives. (More like 25%)
    I handed out a survey to a large random sample of students at my college and there was a 75/25 S/N ratio.
    In the course of my life I feel I run into N very rarely and NF extremely rare.

    Of the people in my life whom I got to take the test in any form, only two came out N. The rest were S and felt very at ease with the description of S.

    Only a certain percentage of the population goes to university. I forget what percentage, it depends on what city one lives in.

  5. #15


    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Well often time the famous people that are being typed are entertainment celebrities, and it could be argued that "artsy stuff" attracts a disproportionate amount of iNtuitives.
    But aren't sensors just as likely to be attracted to different aspects of it? Which would still lead to more celebs being sensors, if most people are sensors.
    Maybe some of us just suck at typing
    I don't wanna!

  6. #16
    In Full Flight Array Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Aug 2008
    4 sx/sp


    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne View Post
    I disagree that Intuitives make up only 10% of the population. As far as the people I know, it's about 60% S, 40% N. And also, this forum has 85% N, 15% S.
    Well, the topic of this forum and the internet itself would attract intuitives more than sensors. Intuitives are well overrepresented on the internet.

    I think the split is close to 70/30 or 75/25. In my immediate family of five, there are four intuitives, all tested multiple times. And the majority of my friends are intuitives, but I'll concede that it may just be the people I attract. Also, there are differing degrees of "intuition," so someone may be only slightly intuitive and thus be classified as sensing because their intuition is not as apparent.
    ~Life in a cappella~

  7. #17
    Intriguing.... Array Quinlan's Avatar
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    Apr 2008


    I think that often if a sensor shows the slightest bit of intuition they are classed as intuitives, yet everyone uses both. This goes for type guesses online, typing people you know and even the tests are set up this way.

    What peole often associate with NF are actually just F traits, and a lot of the association between NFs and art/creativity comes from mistyped SPs. SPs love the idea of many possibilties but this is wrongly seen as exclusive to N.

  8. #18
    Plumage and Moult Array proteanmix's Avatar
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    Apr 2007


    The things people often use as examples differentiating sensing and intuiting seems to me to come down to education, experience, and exposure.

    What I notice on the forum is if anyone can talk about politics, science, current events, and their feelings, with any intelligence they're an N. I'm from DC so any Joe or Jane Blow on the streets of downtown DC can talk politics and current events and I can go to the theater or a make-up counter to hear people talking about their feelings.

    These are my opinions of why people think intuitives are so rare:

    Location: People from smaller population centers tend to be more like-minded than those from larger metropolitan areas. That like-mindedness is often thought of as being "sensing" which it isn't necessarily. Your immediate culture impacts how you conceive of things, which brings me to the second reason:

    Culture: I'm a racial minority and I find it hard to scrape off the thick patina of Fe, Si, and Se from most of the black people I try to type. I know two black INTJs that are more Fe than me! And frankly the way my Fe manifests itself feels different than the way the other Fe-dominants on the forum manifests itself so I've basically given up trying to find people who I typologically identify with on the forum.

    Exposure: You can be the strongest ISxJ ever and if you've been exposed to many different types of people, foods, ideas, languages, whatever I completely think you'll be more open to experience than an ENxP who's been in one place their whole life. In fact, the larger vat of knowledge Si has to pull from it begins to look like an encyclopedia of knowing virtually anything.

    Education: This ties to exposure as well, but you can be taught things like critical thinking skills, argumentation, metaphor use. A lot of what people consider being intuitive comes down to being culturally literate, i.e. "Did you get my [obscure] reference?" Yes: N. No: S. Being culturally literate is dependent upon how much you're plugged into the dominant culture. If you're not, a lot of metaphor use will go over your head. Or you'll use metaphor that is within your domain of knowledge but doesn't necessarily map to the dominant culture.

    And these gawd-awful typing threads!!!:steam: Think about this: if you have an incredibly popular movie or fictional character that everyone seems to relate to and enjoy they're probably a sensor or close enough to the S/N line for people to see a bit of everyman in that character. Ye average sensor, will not identify with a hardcore N and vice versa. When I researched correlations between MBTI and the Big Five I found studies that most people hover around the middle of the Openness factor, which roughly relates to what MBTI considers "sensing" and "intuiting." The Openness factor as has subfactors:

    1. Fantasy - the tendency toward a vivid imagination and fantasy life.
    2. Aesthetics - the tendency to appreciate art, music, and poetry.
    3. Feelings - being receptive to inner emotional states and valuing emotional experience.
    4. Actions - the inclination to try new activities, visit new places, and try new foods.
    5. Ideas - the tendency to be intellectually curious and open to new ideas.
    6. Values - the readiness to re-examine traditional social, religious, and political values.

    If I had to guess, I think the ONLY factors that indicate a preference for intuiting are Ideas and Values. Fantasy, Aethetics, Feelings, and Actions, are anyone's game. And guess what? You can score highly on those subtraits and still get a high Openness score without having high Ideas and Values scores. Conversely, you can score high on the Ideas and Values subtraits and still have a low Openness score. I personally think a truly open person would score highly on all subtraits not just a few, or rather the most important ones.

    Based on my experience I think the population of S/N is around 60/40 rather than 75/25 or that impossible 90/10.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  9. #19
    heart on fire Array
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    May 2007


    I found the statistics on what percentage of people go to college:

    What Percent of People Have a College Degree?

    Approximately 34% of Americans 18 years of age and older hold college degrees according to the United States Census Bureau report of 2007. More women than men hold college degrees of all types combined. About 33.8% of American men have a college degree, as compared to about 34.8% of American women. The differences between the sexes when it comes to the type of degree attained are very small, and in most cases are under half of a percentage point.

    Nineteen percent of Americans have attended college but have no degree.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Array
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    Jun 2008







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