User Tag List

First 1234 Last

Results 11 to 20 of 53

  1. #11
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    TiSe
    Posts
    1,167

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I took it in the generalised sense that we need to discover it for ourselves. Maybe I'm projecting my own nature here, but when I Ti ask (in the definition above), "see for myself" means that I need to see the foundation of it - data, normally. I inherently distrust "Ne" conclusions. I would say that Ne is more like "she might of done it for any number of reasons", which is how I took it in the OP.

    Although, the Se-Ne still doesn't seem to grab the nuanced difference between them.
    I am reminded of Lenore Thompson's statement, "As a right-brain function, extraverted Sensation comes into play when events are changing so rapidly that linear analysis is impossible. We respond immediately, on the basis of visual and tactile information, guided by what we've done before." Based on that and knowing myself, my immediate response may well be, "Whoa... or Oh shit....!" Based on whether I have experienced similar situations, I may just as well respond, "This is awkward." I think that it would be hard to say what the Se function would have us do. I know that ESPs may either make their presence known to the girlfriend, but the ISPs may do a turnabout and get out of site to avoid embarassment. Just my thoughts.

  2. #12
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    4,474

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    I am reminded of Lenore Thompson's statement, "As a right-brain function, extraverted Sensation comes into play when events are changing so rapidly that linear analysis is impossible. We respond immediately, on the basis of visual and tactile information, guided by what we've done before." Based on that and knowing myself, my immediate response may well be, "Whoa... or Oh shit....!" Based on whether I have experienced similar situations, I may just as well respond, "This is awkward." I think that it would be hard to say what the Se function would have us do. I know that ESPs may either make their presence known to the girlfriend, but the ISPs may do a turnabout and get out of site to avoid embarassment. Just my thoughts.
    True, although I don't believe in the right-brain elements. Sensing is more a left brained deducing function, or in slightly more clinical terms, is more serial and defined. That is, the N tends to exist on the "right side" (which would mean "parallel thinking"), in that they are not defining elements in which things can be deduced. It's a holistic view, undefined, and without meaning. The meaning portion is done through the serial processes - Ti.

    That is to say, that in the context of how the mind processes, Ti-Ne is how holistic parts talk to serial parts. That is, Ti-Ne is more about finding a rational framework around the information we have. Ti-Se is more serial, that is the framework we have is more rigid to new information. The "we need to see", to me, translates to "we need solid evidence to add it to our framework". This is a double edged swords, of course. Too holistic and you get the conspiracy outlays, where everything is somehow connected. To rigid, and you don't find meaning (ie: "connections") to anything. Those are the unhealthy sides of it.

    You can kind of see the barrier of entry difference - both of us have much stronger frameworks, while most Ns will say they use MBTI "because it just makes sense". The actual framework can be as robust - for example, I can just as easily connect the research into how the brain works with sensory data as an N - but for me to do so, I need to see a very stringent connection. And even then, I'm skeptical that they are describing the same thing... I would need to see a study done that strongly links them before I would actually build a system out of it.

    This doesn't scale up to all MBTI functions (but that is where the "we all use all functions" disclaimer comes in), but it's how I think of the T portions. F uses too much empathy and the like, making it draw upon more components of the mind, and is hard to generalize.

  3. #13
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    TiSe
    Posts
    1,167

    Default

    Ummm.... okay we will agree to disagree, or maybe I do agree with your thoughts but my point is not the debate of left/right brain. My point in using the quote is that when Se comes into play our response is immediate. The response could vary from being confident in our response based on previous experience in handling such matters to not knowing what to do since I had never experienced this. But it's hard to say what the immediate response would be in the moment since I have never experienced this directly.

  4. #14
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    4,474

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    Ummm.... okay we will agree to disagree, or maybe I do agree with your thoughts but my point is not the debate of left/right brain. My point in using the quote is that when Se comes into play our response is immediate.
    Is it? I suppose it depends on the environment... I'm certainly reactive when I'm, say, skiing... but I'm decided not reactive when I'm writing something like this. But I think that is true for everyone. My INTJ wife is every bit as reactive as I am, and as deliberate when she writes. Same goes for Ne dominants - ENFP is way more reactive than I am, both physically and otherwise.

    I'm not sure I can agree with that distinction... To me, it comes down to how we gather and sort information. A degree of focus - when skiing, to use the same example, the focus is narrower for Se -> just the run, the moment. When writing, it is on the topic. When building the internal framework, it's narrower (less connections, IOW).

  5. #15
    Senior Member "?"'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    TiSe
    Posts
    1,167

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Is it? I suppose it depends on the environment... I'm certainly reactive when I'm, say, skiing... but I'm decided not reactive when I'm writing something like this. But I think that is true for everyone. My INTJ wife is every bit as reactive as I am, and as deliberate when she writes. Same goes for Ne dominants - ENFP is way more reactive than I am, both physically and otherwise.

    I'm not sure I can agree with that distinction... To me, it comes down to how we gather and sort information. A degree of focus - when skiing, to use the same example, the focus is narrower for Se -> just the run, the moment. When writing, it is on the topic. When building the internal framework, it's narrower (less connections, IOW).
    Damn we’re on a tangent here…… the Se example is not given in the same context as the other examples. How lame would it be for someone to see your best friend's girlfriend kissing another guy and respond, “I need to see this for myself.” Duh… you are seeing it for yourself, so that would not be anyone’s response under the circumstances. But then again since I am the only one seeing that the Se example is not in the same context as the other examples, maybe it would be everyone’s response, just not mine.

  6. #16
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,489

    Default

    Fe
    Ti
    Se (in the sense of, is what I'm seeing accurate or are there other factors)
    Te/Ni/Ne
    Si and Fi would never cross my mind

    cool model though. I guess other than Fe it's fairly accurate.
    -end of thread-

  7. #17
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Enneagram
    4 so/sp
    Posts
    6,931

    Default

    Great concept. Very useful way to illustrate the functions - so they're more readily translated into everyday situations rather than just remaining as vague phrases. I think this sort of thing would help people realize what functions they might actually use, and it makes the ordering concept more relevant (although I still don't think order has to be rigid or will be the same for all of the same type).

    For me I'd have Ni/Ne initially, then Fe/Ti, then the other four somewhere later in the analysis of the situation.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

    My Photography and Watercolor Fine Art Prints!!! Cascade Colors Fine Art Prints
    https://docs.google.com/uc?export=do...Gd5N3NZZE52QjQ

  8. #18
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    4,474

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by "?" View Post
    Damn we’re on a tangent here…… the Se example is not given in the same context as the other examples. How lame would it be for someone to see your best friend's girlfriend kissing another guy and respond, “I need to see this for myself.” Duh… you are seeing it for yourself, so that would not be anyone’s response under the circumstances. But then again since I am the only one seeing that the Se example is not in the same context as the other examples, maybe it would be everyone’s response, just not mine.
    Ahhhh! No, I agree with you (that's what I meant when I said the Ne and Se don't seem to line up). I was just interpreting the comment to how I saw it, sorry.

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    InFp
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Socionics
    INFj
    Posts
    322

    Default

    I don't really have a thought when Fi happens, but that Ne is spot on.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Jeremy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    9w1
    Posts
    426

    Default

    I'm not really well-versed in Se (or really Ne for that matter... I often wonder about my N-ness, but at the same time, I've tried to move on lol)

    Let me revise Se and Ne:

    Se: I need to get closer to hear what they're saying!
    Ne: I bet that guy gave her something nice and started screwing her behind Matt's back.

    Again I could be completely off-base, because my understanding of the two is limited. That's usually how I go about things, but also realize that it's not always conscious. Fi for me is an automatic empathizer; I start making excuses for others behavior by putting myself in their "shoes" and trying to understand the possible reasons for their behavior. If I could see myself acting the same way given a situation, I'm more likely to be able to forgive someone for something. In the case of the cheating girlfriend, I would go along these lines (remember, you're in an external situation, so your extroverted function comes first - I forgot that earlier :P)

    I wonder what is making her do this? Did her and Matt have problems lately? I mean, I have noticed Matt start hanging out a lot on his own.. maybe that's why? Or maybe he's just broke and now she's looking for money. I don't know. I mean, if I was in her place I still don't think I could do what she's doing. It's just not right, you need to be honest with people. I mean, now that I think about it, she has started to dress a lot more attractively lately! Maybe she's trying to find someone else before she breaks up with him! Well, whatever it is, that's just not how a relationship works. I will tell Matt the next time I see him.

    Red: Extraverted Intuition
    Green: Introverted Feeling
    Blue: Introverted Sensing
    Orange: Extraverted Thinking

    I'll try another one, a real challenge this time: An ENFJ! If an ENFJ could tell me if I'm right or wrong, lemme know!

    Oh my god, did she just do that? That's so freaking disgusting and mean! I always knew there was something rotten about her, ever since we first met - she just had that vibe of being a complete and utter money grubber. Oh! They're talking again! I've got to get closer and see what's going on! Oh damnit, I can't hear! I wonder if there's a reason why she did this? I guess it doesn't matter, Matt still needs to know about this.. she's going to end up breaking his heart.

    Green: Extraverted Feeling
    Red: Introverted Intuition
    Blue: Extraverted Sensing
    Orange: Introverted Thinking
    "Can you set me free from this dark inner world? Save me now, last beats in the soul.."

    Fonewearl and proud of it!

    I (85%) - N (80%) - F (35%) - P (90%)
    O: 94% C: 18% E: 21% A: 94% N: 38%
    9w1 (SP, SX, SO)
    (9, 5, 4)
    RCUAI (Primary Calm)

Similar Threads

  1. How to figure out your Socionics type
    By sulfit in forum Socionics
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 07-20-2017, 11:34 AM
  2. Help figuring out your type?
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 354
    Last Post: 09-25-2012, 12:12 PM
  3. Can't figure out your type? Consider "The Soul Child"
    By VagrantFarce in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 01-29-2012, 03:59 PM
  4. How did you/do you figure out your stacking?
    By the soulless one in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 05-23-2010, 11:57 PM
  5. A simple way to figure out your Enneagram type
    By evilrobot in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 01-29-2010, 06:50 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO