User Tag List

First 12345 Last

Results 21 to 30 of 50

  1. #21
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    5,350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    ...
    Oh yeah..

    "Excuse me, you're irrelevant. Please take me to your leader and be quiet about it."

    Okay, so it's not just my imagination then.



    Only you...

    Was he like "Who's this derranged person phoning me up? Didn't I write a book of instructions?" ?

    Actually, he was quite nice and polite.
    And we figured out the missing piece of the puzzle.

  2. #22
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Socionics
    INTj
    Posts
    4,463

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    Actually, he was quite nice and polite.
    And we figured out the missing piece of the puzzle.
    First off, congrats on having the 500,000 post! (Just noticed )

    Did the conversation go "No Ms Mom, explaining the logical process and ramifications doesn't tend to work on children of that age" ?

    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  3. #23
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    5,350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    First off, congrats on having the 500,000 post! (Just noticed )
    Ha! Cool.

    Did the conversation go "No Ms Mom, explaining the logical process and ramifications doesn't tend to work on children of that age" ?

    Do you really want to know?
    I mean it's your thread. I guess you can derail it if you want to.
    I actually learned a very important principle from that conversation,
    one which I have never forgotten, and one which is useful to many people,
    and so because of its usefulness I will share it:
    You cannot teach a child who will not obey.

    This explains why the school systems are in the mess they're in,
    not just why my daughter was not learning how to toilet herself.

    Anyway, the author of the book told me that my daughter was not obeying me.
    First I had to get my daughter to do what I said,
    and then I could teach her to toilet herself.
    He was right.
    I did.
    And she did.

    And I remembered that principle throughout my mothering years.
    It worked in many other applications through the years.

    I wouldn't be surprised if it worked with dogs, too.


    btw: she was 3 years old at the time

  4. #24
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    1w9 sp/sx
    Posts
    2,128

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Theory of extraverted judgment functions and their relevance.

    Is it true that Te indicates thinking which desires resolution? in other words would say an ENTJ desire their thinking to be resolved but not necessarily their feelings?

    -------------

    Another thought, my father once referred to a girl as being an ISFJ with an "internalised F". Now upon pursuing the concept he explained that this was where the usual care paid to other's wants and desires is focused more on her own wants and desires and so unlike most of her type she is selfish and seemingly unaware of any importance to what others want to do.

    I'm theorising that this is an issue that would affect any extraverted judgment function. Ergo a Te predominant person may end up acting with internalised T which would lead to a well organised internal world with strict definitions even if their externalised behaviour is seemingly flexible.
    ENTJ here. and yes, i do that a lot. i actaully spent a good part of winter break hashing out my "world view" (ie morality, free will, what there is and isnt, defining hard to define things like love, emotion, beauty, my vision/purpose, etc) because i like things like that clearly defined.

    in the past year or so i've also began to organize the physical world much more (tertiary Se maybe?), but i've always been seeking organization in "my head"...at least, as organized as a Ni person can be

  5. #25
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    5,350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Theory of extraverted judgment functions and their relevance.

    Is it true that Te indicates thinking which desires resolution? in other words would say an ENTJ desire their thinking to be resolved but not necessarily their feelings?
    According to this page:
    The 16 Type Patterns
    The two types with Te in the 1st position are ENTJ and ESTJ.
    Since closure is a function of J and both of those types are J, I would say yes...
    Te desires resolution, at least in those two types who are primary Te users.

    Those types with Te in 2nd position are ISTJ and INTJ, so that principle would hold true for them also.

    -------------

    Another thought, my father once referred to a girl as being an ISFJ with an "internalised F". Now upon pursuing the concept he explained that this was where the usual care paid to other's wants and desires is focused more on her own wants and desires and so unlike most of her type she is selfish and seemingly unaware of any importance to what others want to do.
    I know your dad is quite trustworthy with determining people's types, so I won't argue that point, but it seems to me that once we see a person who is acting so far outside of the scope of the norm for her type, I don't think type alone can explain things. A selfish ISFJ is an anomaly. It's not even typical behavior when they're in their shadow. Something seems wrong here. Either she's not really an ISFJ, or she's not really being entirely as selfish as your dad perceived her to be. There has to be external factors somewhere that are not being taken into account.

    Maybe the ISFJ with the inward-turned F was actually a shadow of her actual type?
    It's confounding.

    We're missing part of the picture. Did your dad observe this selfish behavior or did she come to him complaining of it herself? In what way was it selfish?
    Was she being stubbornly immovable and it LOOKED like selfishness?
    Now we're getting somewhere because that IS typical shadow behavior for the ISFJ.




    I'm theorising that this is an issue that would affect any extraverted judgment function. Ergo a Te predominant person may end up acting with internalised T which would lead to a well organised internal world with strict definitions even if their externalised behaviour is seemingly flexible.
    Not so fast, Kimosabee.

    You know I just started reading Jung, so I only know enough to be dangerous, as they say, but this is what I keep thinking about that:
    Jung said:

    "... because in every pronounced type there is a special tendency to compensate the one-sidedness of that type, a tendency which is biologically purposive since it strives constantly to maintain the psychic equilibrium." Psychological Type, C.G. Jung, paragraph 3.

    And now that I see it in writing, I have no idea why that kept bothering me...

    Ah. I remember.
    As in the case with your ISFJ, if she was going through her life being Fe instead of Fi, then there's no way her psyche would be balanced. It's unnatural. It can't happen.

    Jung dealt with emotionally unhealthy people for over 30 years, and even they strive for "psychic equilibrium".

    For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction... even in the personality.

    There. That's my current stance.

  6. #26
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Socionics
    INTj
    Posts
    4,463

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    You cannot teach a child who will not obey.
    Simple and yet so true.

    There's none so blind as those who don't wish to see. It's as true when you're 3 as when you're 103.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  7. #27
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Socionics
    INTj
    Posts
    4,463

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Babylon Candle View Post
    ENTJ here. and yes, i do that a lot. i actaully spent a good part of winter break hashing out my "world view" (ie morality, free will, what there is and isnt, defining hard to define things like love, emotion, beauty, my vision/purpose, etc) because i like things like that clearly defined.

    in the past year or so i've also began to organize the physical world much more (tertiary Se maybe?), but i've always been seeking organization in "my head"...at least, as organized as a Ni person can be
    Is this because you cannot control what you wish to though or because you've got too much time on your hands?

    It seems like instead of organising people and things (extraverted) you're organising yourself which I'd say is quite introverted.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  8. #28
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Socionics
    INTj
    Posts
    4,463

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    I know your dad is quite trustworthy with determining people's types, so I won't argue that point, but it seems to me that once we see a person who is acting so far outside of the scope of the norm for her type, I don't think type alone can explain things. A selfish ISFJ is an anomaly. It's not even typical behavior when they're in their shadow. Something seems wrong here. Either she's not really an ISFJ, or she's not really being entirely as selfish as your dad perceived her to be. There has to be external factors somewhere that are not being taken into account.

    Maybe the ISFJ with the inward-turned F was actually a shadow of her actual type?
    It's confounding.
    If we display the capacity to operate in this "shadow" mode then what is confusing about operating contrary to one's type more often? This particular subject was spoilt from day 1 and lacked a father figure. All she knows is that tantrums will get her way in the end so that is all she does.

    It would be more contrary to do otherwise in my opinion (from the standpoint of evolution of behaviour).
    We're missing part of the picture. Did your dad observe this selfish behavior or did she come to him complaining of it herself? In what way was it selfish?
    Was she being stubbornly immovable and it LOOKED like selfishness?
    Now we're getting somewhere because that IS typical shadow behavior for the ISFJ.
    It was a further evaluation having previously analysed her type whilst she was relaxed and in a good mood. The additional information was fed to him by myself and that was his prognosis. I'm simply extrapolating as he evades doing so himself.
    Not so fast, Kimosabee.

    You know I just started reading Jung, so I only know enough to be dangerous, as they say, but this is what I keep thinking about that:
    Jung said:

    "... because in every pronounced type there is a special tendency to compensate the one-sidedness of that type, a tendency which is biologically purposive since it strives constantly to maintain the psychic equilibrium." Psychological Type, C.G. Jung, paragraph 3.
    Me thinks he should have put the weed down for a little longer before writing that...
    And now that I see it in writing, I have no idea why that kept bothering me...

    Ah. I remember.
    As in the case with your ISFJ, if she was going through her life being Fe instead of Fi, then there's no way her psyche would be balanced. It's unnatural. It can't happen.
    Err... she is Fe. Sure she has Fi times but by and large she appears to prefer Fe.. hence she's an FJ (or the other way around if you prefer).
    Jung dealt with emotionally unhealthy people for over 30 years, and even they strive for "psychic equilibrium".

    For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction... even in the personality.

    There. That's my current stance.
    'Strive for' does not equal 'move toward'.

    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  9. #29
    Senior Member Chris_in_Orbit's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Posts
    504

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lemons View Post
    I don't get the whole mid-life crisis thing. When my cousin was 5, he was happier than ever.
    Either this was completely morbid or I misunderstood it.

  10. #30
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    5,350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris_in_Orbit View Post
    Either this was completely morbid or I misunderstood it.
    I thought it was a mis-type.
    I thought it was supposed to read "50".
    It makes more sense that way, anyway.

Similar Threads

  1. Thoughts On the Validity of MBTI
    By Savage Idealist in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 02-10-2011, 06:41 PM
  2. enneagram mbti and thoughts on compatability
    By briochick in forum Enneagram
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 11-06-2010, 10:12 PM
  3. A few thoughts about past and present experiences from MBTI forums
    By Valiant in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 56
    Last Post: 05-18-2009, 09:18 AM
  4. Thoughts on Hybrid MBTI/Keirsey Types?
    By Usehername in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-09-2007, 03:52 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO