Help! In desperate need of SHADOW info

[Afkan]

Q: I am looking for a book or any reference about MBTI that covers cognitive processes, most importantly the SHADOW processes. Anybody know of where I could find such info?
I want to know more about why and under which cirumstances we switch to the other processes, the shadow.

 

[LostInNerSpace]

This is about the best book around:

Amazon.com: Please Understand Me II: Temperament, Character, Intelligence: David Keirsey: Books

It has been a while since I read it. I don't remember anything specifically about Shadow types. It should go into sufficent depth to help. Character (Software) vs. Temperament (Hardware).

 

[Totenkindly]

Keirsey does not cover Shadow types at all; and technically his system is a variation of MBTI, not "real" MBTI in terms of how he creates his own archetypes. He's more interested in archetypes, per se.

Shadow types have been discussed here a great deal in the past -- use the Search feature to find more.

Linda Berens has done some writing on it as well.
And John Beebe has done some presentations on it.

There's also the notion of shadow types in terms of "the cliche opposites" (INTP vs ESFJ, for example); that's been discussed in this subforum as well...

 

[miss fortune]

Q: I am looking for a book or any reference about MBTI that covers cognitive processes, most importantly the SHADOW processes. Anybody know of where I could find such info?
I want to know more about why and under which cirumstances we switch to the other processes, the shadow.

just out of curiosity, I must ask why?

 

[Afkan]

Keirsey does not cover Shadow types at all; and technically his system is a variation of MBTI, not "real" MBTI in terms of how he creates his own archetypes. He's more interested in archetypes, per se.

Shadow types have been discussed here a great deal in the past -- use the Search feature to find more.

Linda Berens has done some writing on it as well.
And John Beebe has done some presentations on it.

There's also the notion of shadow types in terms of "the cliche opposites" (INTP vs ESFJ, for example); that's been discussed in this subforum as well...

Thank you, Totally Twinky. I have read (obsessively) the Keirsey books I and II. I have also searched the forum about the shadow processes, and while the information is helpful, I was hoping for a book I could read with more "meat." I have search for Linda Berens's books, and am considering buying a couple...I will definitely check her out more. And thank you for John Beebe's name, I will look him up also.

 

[Afkan]

just out of curiosity, I must ask why?

Sure, I welcome you to ask why. You may be dissapointed with my answer, though... intellectual curiosity. May I ask why you ask why?

 

[miss fortune]

curiosity as well.... inquiring minds you know....

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

I read something interesting about the shadow functions last night. It was a line from Jung discussing how the limits of human freedom are conditioned upon the limits of self-acceptance. The shadow represents the part of our personality we don't trust, regard as inferior, and can't accept. The book I read it in was Radical Acceptance, Chapter 4ish.

 

[Eric B]

Shadow dynamics in the eight process model is primarily the brainchild of John Beebe. However, he has not really published much of it, so it is mostly from his lectures. Berens books go into them, as do Haas and Hunziker, whose book on type is available on Berens site. Vicky Jo Varner is also another source for a lot of that theory, on her sites, and also in internet discussions in some places. She even goes into how one person's function "talks to" another with the function in a different position.
But it seems the real meat of the theory would be found in the lectures. I wish they would at least be available in recorded form, but I don't see that anywhere.

 

[mlittrell]

skip the functions and just read keirsey's books. the functions are just the model the system is based on and really dont tell you as much as the temperaments. imho.

 

[Totenkindly]

I read something interesting about the shadow functions last night. It was a line from Jung discussing how the limits of human freedom are conditioned upon the limits of self-acceptance. The shadow represents the part of our personality we don't trust, regard as inferior, and can't accept. The book I read it in was Radical Acceptance, Chapter 4ish.

That sounds like it would be an interesting thread for someone to start.

*nudge nudge*

 

[spirilis]

Lenore Thomson goes into shadow functions a bit in her chapters about each type (book "Personality Type: An Owner's Manual"), and I read a book chiefly dedicated to the personas we portray when "gripped" by the shadow -- "Was That Really Me?" by Naomi Quenk. I'd love to hear Beebe's lectures that Eric B mentioned though.

 

[Afkan]

Thank you for all of the great info. Really appreciate it! This is great!

 

[Nocapszy]

shadow is imaginary, if not incorrect.
ignore it.

 

[Jack Flak]

skip the functions and just read keirsey's books. the functions are just the model the system is based on and really dont tell you as much as the temperaments. imho.

+1

shadow is imaginary, if not incorrect.
ignore it.

+1

 

[Afkan]

I have read so much about each of the four general types and the shadow sounded so intriguing...I agree`that the shadow is not nearly as important as the overall personality types.

Still, I like the theory/concept behind the shadow processes. I think it explains a bit about why some people rub each other the wrong way, for example.

From pure theory the ESTJ and I could do a lot of damage to each other when using Fe and Te in interactions bc these are both our primary and last or eighth process, only opposite of each other. This explains a vicious cycle that I previously found puzzling at work- interactions with an ESTJ that continually feel like we are pushing each others buttons in a very powerful and dangerous way (much more than with other types). This theory describes exactly what has been happening- her Te throws me into disarray, just as my Fe does to her- but usually I can handle Te if its not so dominant a function. I have experienced this same phenomenon with another ESTJ but couldn't figure out why it bothered me so much in these individuals and not in other types (whose Te is not used dominantly).

 

[Eric B]

Wow! All functions clashing (Ni vs Si as well); though both Choleric socially (In Charge)! :footballreferee:

 

[Afkan]

Exactly. Its a cat fight, really painful to watch.