Birth Order - Cliff Isaacson

[Erudur]

I'm an ESTJ and I'm an only child.

I was actually kind of offended by the whole "imaginary friend" thing. Being an only child is not so miserable as to require THAT! (unless the parent-kid relationship is bad... that would suck!) I was never lonely. It was probably my MBTI type that helped me with that, actually - I'm excellent at finding things to do, and I have been since I was very little. (My parents don't remember me being bored EVER until maybe middle school!) I'm positive, though, that my lack of siblings is the reason why I score so low on E. I was so self-reliant that I often forgot the concept of "hanging out with friends". And I wasn't so sad about it, either! Not that I disliked being with friends - it was fun... well, hopefully other only children know what I'm talking about.

I do express my emotions very easily, but that certainly doesn't come from prior success with tantrums. My parents had no tolerance for that - I was not a spoiled kid.

The tantrum thing would indeed be variable based on parenting styles. But what would be common is having the undivided (or less divided) attention of the parents and probably having your feelings acknowledged (either positively or negatively).

I am guessing that N Onlies would be much more likely to have imaginary friends than S Onlies.

I didn't have imaginary friends, but my brother and I (both Onlys), when we did play together would often create imaginary worlds for our stuffed animals to have adventures in. Its almost like we were playing alone with each other.

 

[Scott]

I'm an INTP first born. I suppose his description of what happens with first borns was possibly the case for me... I wouldn't remember though. I did become the 'good kid', and may have somewhat tried to perform. I actually fulfill the second-born description better - maybe because my brother was just a more natural performer than me, regardless of the 2 years I had on him. I'd say I'm mostly a mixture of his first- and second-born descriptions.

These descriptions are particularly interesting for me because I come from a family of four. While the first two were, I think, thrown off by my strong INTP-ness, the third- and fourth-born descriptions are right on the money for my little brother and sister. I don't know the type of the middle two kids, but I know my fourth-born sister is an ISxJ, so she can contribute a fourth-born statistic.

Also, both of my parents were first-borns and they are an ENTJ and an ISFx.

 

[Anja]

I think the thing about family patterns also is that they are more easily viewed in retrospect by the insiders. When you're "in it" it's much more difficult to get the picture.

 

[Ardea]

I'm an only and an ENFP. I can identify with the feeling of being lonley through out childhood and had many imaginary 'siblings'.

Interesting. I never felt lonely, and relished the attention of being the only. I am also an only, and an ENxP.

 

[LunaIndigo]

Interesting. I never felt lonely, and relished the attention of being the only. I am also an only, and an ENxP.

I guess it just depends on how your childhood was. My parents faught a lot so I felt more 'alone'.

 

[Bougal]

I'm the second born and I'm and ENTJ

My brother is the first born and he is an INTJ

My dad is the first and he is an INTP

My mom is the fourth and she is an ESFJ, and all four of her sisters are XSFJs.

Mine does fit me for the most part. I am afraid of being inadequate.

 

[Moiety]

I'm fourth and last born (ENFP).


I didn't get what exactly he meant by "trying hard" in the 4th born's description ...

 

[kiddykat]

I read up on birth order a few years back. . Leeman? (forgot his name), and listened to his podcast..

It was also mentioned in a Counseling Theories and Techniques class of mine (topic I signed up for that interested me at that time)..

When the class had a show of hands, we did a count on those who were attracted to the profession as a whole, according to their birth order. Surprisingly, we found no correlation, but I still find this topic fun to read up on, especially when it comes to mate selection- those who we tend to find intriguing according to birth order (supposedly, the youngest are the ham, which I find is true).

It's funny. I know some first-borns who were less *serious* than the last borns, vice versa. Some last borns are even more serious/shy than the first born.

it's fascinating how people develop.. especially in multiple birth circumstances.. twins, triplets, and families with 10 kids+. My aunt/uncle really dug each other, and kids who grew up in foster-care environments.. I have a soft spot for them.. Their birth order changes according to their situation. Interesting..

 

[Thursday]

only child

 

[Neo Genesis]

INFP, and I could be either the second, third, or fifth born, depending on how its looked at. Also the youngest. Its a little different with my family; I can identfify more with the second child, but my older sister is more of a third, older brother an only, etc.

The Only learns to play alone without feeling lonely, dislikes intrusion, and can be overly expressive via the positive feedback created by the tantrum.

I'm pretty sure this just means that there's increased feedback instead of actually getting rewarded for their behavior. IOW, positive as in more, not positive as in good. It seems he's saying that they can be attention whores.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

Partial Thread Tally: (not being updated any more - I couldn't keep up)
Only
INTJ,INTP,ENFP,INFJ,ENTP,ISTP,ENFP...(seem to be a majority)
First
ENFP,INFJ
Second
ENTJ,ISTJ,ESTJ
Third
3-ENFP
Fourth

Third and last - INFJ
Brother, first - ENFP
Sister, second - ENFJ

 

[Dwigie]

Holy shit. Story of my life, period.
The second child must cope with the oldest child taking away attention by outperforming him or her. The child feels inadequate, tries to overcome the feeling by choosing perfectionism in some area of life. Also, the second born feels that no one cares about how he or she feels because the oldest child clearly does not. [no I believe everyone cares first and foremost about themselves, that's not restricted to the first born.]
Consequently, to avoid pain the second born tries to suppress his or her own feelings.
Came out in unhealthy ways.


The only child has to solve the problems of how to play alone without feeling lonely and how to deal with intrusion. The child develops imaginary playmates to overcome loneliness, and two speeds for dealing with intrusion. Of the two speeds, fast is for avoiding intrusion and slow is for inviting it for the help it gives.
My only child friends keep talking to me about people intruding on them. That's pretty interesting.(for some odd reason 80% of them always are only children)

 

[INTJMom]

I really like Cliff Isaacson's stuff. I read both his books. He's convinced me that the Adlerian First-Middle-Baby perspective is flawed. But I'll see if that changes with my own observation regarding the baby.

I do know that I wish Isaacson had used MBTI to inform his birth order discussion. Because he'll use descriptions that are very "S" to characterize certain birth order characteristics. And of course, we 20%-of-the-population Ns won't identify with those characteristics.

I'm hoping this thread will get some traction. Viewers, please leave a post with your MBTI and your natural birth order.

If you take time to check out the birth order link, also mention if you think that you are a different personality from your natural sibling order.

I am a first born - INTJ
My second-born INFP sister was born 4 years after I was.

 

[BlackCat]

Only child, INFP.

 

[Urchin]

Only child INTP. Fits.

 

[Mitzy]

im the baby!

its bs

 

[Oaky]

Im second of 3 brothers

1st brother - ENFP
Me - INTJ
3rd brother - ESFJ

When I was younger I used to look up to my older bro (2 years older) but gave up as I had realised that he wasnt worth looking up to anymore. I had exceeded him (or so I thought). Not trying to be a heartless b but if I can't look up to him anymore than I can't. I didn't like how he was making decisions according to feelings. It pissed me off as they werent very logical. Venting all his anger on me was also quite annoying.

My younger brother however is quickly catching up to me which kinda pisses off as it feels good to be on top. He looks up to me like a hero but doesnt listen to everything I say. I try to teach him independence but disregards what I say. Spoiled kids kinda piss me off. I guess it's his feeling decisions that drive him to not listen to my logical decisions. Piss-off

 

[Jaq]

Third born...........

However I was never persecuted by the second born. Fought with the first a lot through. Regardless I say that bit about persecution is moot. As people could easily block themselfs off

 

[INTP]

Me: only.

Friends/people i know:
INFP only.
ENTP second out of 4.
INTJ second out of 2.
ENFP third out of 3.
ENFP sixth out of 7.
ENFP second out of two.
ESTJ first out of 3.
INFP 7th out of 7.
ISFJ second out of 7.
ESTJ first out of 7.

Cant think of more atm.

Anyways we went through this adlers concept of birth order(from which this idea is originated from) on personality psychology class, i think there is some truth to it, but i dont think it holds everytime.

Adlers concept goes something like this(what was said on slides):
First-born: favored, "me only", pseudoparent - high achieves.
Second-born: rivalry & competition.
Last-born: more pampered, "baby"-creative, rebellious, revolutionary, avant-grande

 

[mujigay]

INTJ first born, with an ISFJ second born sister. Theory doesn't seem to apply much to us, we mostly leave each other alone. "Live and let live," basically. It helps that we're already inclined to like opposite things, so we never really compete with one another.