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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    What do you think about relationships between ENTPs and INFJs? The focus of this is really on romantic relationships but it also makes sense to discuss your experience in situations where these two types interact in a significant way – such as friendship, at work, etc.
    Now that we [ENTP's] look like assholes, this ENTP still has enough tact to shed a positive light on INFJ's.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    When it’s working – What are the joys and positive aspects of these relationships?
    Both types have a great imagination and see possibilities of what could be.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - How compatible do you think these two types are in general?
    Well, from what I'm seeing here, compatibility mostly depends on the attitude of the INFJ and how willing they are to let go of preconceived notions about ENTP's.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - Why are they attracted to each other?
    ENTP's would be drawn to the imagination and integrity of INFJ's as long as that imagination stays positive and constructive.
    INFJ's might be dawn to the positive and enthusiastic outlook ENTP's have for the future. Also, INFJ's might be attracted to the easy-going, playful and adventurous side of ENTP's.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - How to they compliment each other?
    The ENTP can help the INFJ be more objective, so they don't get their feelings hurt.
    The INFJ can help the ENTP be more sensitive to others feelings.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - How well do they understand each other and why?
    I'm trying to understand INFJ's better because I'm related to two.

    To be honest, I don't feel like INFJ's understand me very well. I recently had one jump out of nowhere and call me crazy in the random thought thread. I reached out to her in PM to assure her she's got me all wrong and confused with someone else. I was very kind to her. I was not surprised when she didn't reply as I'm sure she felt foolish. What could she say other than she was sorry? I don't need to hear that. The reality is, I didn't know her, she didn't know me and she was looking all kinds of crazy the way she approached, rep'd me, and had a knee jerk response over absolutely nothing real or time critical.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - What are they like together raising children?
    I don't know.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    When it’s not working – What are the challenges when two people of this type are in a relationship?
    ENTP's are more disorganized than INFJ's
    ENTP's are not as punctual as INFJ's

    Also...

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - What are some of the communication challenges they can have?
    ENTP's might have a tendency to dismiss or minimize the INFJ's feelings.
    INFJ's may take an absolute right/wrong position that can be stifling to ENTP's when ENTP's love to explore options.
    INFJ's seem quick to judge rather than simply listen and encourage a free-flow of ideas.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - How can they take each other for granted?
    They don't appreciate the others strengths where they are weak.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - What happens with things “go wrong” between these two types?
    The INFJ can be quick to judge. Just read the first few posts in this thread written by INFJ's.

    I've been defriended and received nasty emails that had little to NO basis in truth/reality/facts. I have to say, it frustrates me and I don't understand the knee jerk reactions to someone that you're supposed to love. They can do a lot of damage to a relationship in a very short time when they lose their cool. Why not treat people like they're a teammate/friend and try to work through it, first?

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    Advice for couples – What recommendations do you have?
    Never, ever put hurtful rants in writing that you might regret where people can go back and reflect.

    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - What advice do you have for each of the two types?
    ENTP's listen to INFJ's with your full attention.
    ENTP's no clowning around when it's time to be serious; be genuine, sincere and respectful to INFJ's.
    ENTP's be on-time when meeting with INFJ's.

    INFJ's bring up issues right away in a calm manner; knee jerk reactions are not appreciated.
    INFJ's make time to brainstorm and debate logically with your ENTP.
    INFJ's don't withdraw when you feel hurt; communicate your feelings and trust the ENTP to work through them with you.


    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    - If you are an ENTP, what advice do you have for the INFJs?
    Try not to take things personally. Think before you speak. Take time to cool down. Be honest about your big-picture feelings. Practice patience, kindness, and forgiveness. Realize, love conquers all. Do things your ENTP likes to do like engaging in light-hearted debates. Try to relax.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skinny-Love View Post
    Ouch. Does anyone have anything positive or constructive to add to this discussion?

    [This is why I don't post my type. Forgive me, if I don't want to be pigeonholed as the ENTP asshole.]
    Actually, I'd love to converse with more ENTPs because I wouldn't want the one person I know in real life to be the only actually tested representative of the type in my mind. I would love to meet and greet more. I'm not saying I wouldn't trust any ENTP, just the one person that I KNOW is one. So, I want someone to say something positive or constructive. How can I possibly make a fair assessment when I don't really know any ENTPs well? @JAVO is an ENTP and he seems very sane and a lot more low-key than the one I know in real life, and so, maybe the superintendent I know isn't a good representative of the type or maybe he is. Maybe it's me. He actually does a lot of good in the community, and a lot of people like him, and in all honesty, he is super nice to me, but for some reason I don't feel I can I trust him. I feel like that if I did, the sand would shift under my feet and I'd fall through a big hole or something. I think it's the constant need for change that bothers me. Same with ENFPs. I love them. They are kind and make me laugh, but I am afraid to put hope in their projects or promises, because they change so frequently and building systems that "last" is very important to me.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14
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  3. #13
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ene View Post
    Actually, I'd love to converse with more ENTPs because I wouldn't want the one person I know in real life to be the only actually tested representative of the type in my mind. I would love to meet and greet more. I'm not saying I wouldn't trust any ENTP, just the one person that I KNOW is one. So, I want someone to say something positive or constructive. How can I possibly make a fair assessment when I don't really know any ENTPs well? @JAVO is an ENTP and he seems very sane and a lot more low-key than the one I know in real life, and so, maybe the superintendent I know isn't a good representative of the type or maybe he is. Maybe it's me. He actually does a lot of good in the community, and a lot of people like him, and in all honesty, he is super nice to me, but for some reason I don't feel I can I trust him. I feel like that if I did, the sand would shift under my feet and I'd fall through a big hole or something. I think it's the constant need for change that bothers me. Same with ENFPs. I love them. They are kind and make me laugh, but I am afraid to put in hope in their projects or promises, because they change so frequently and building systems that "last" is very important to me.


    Originally Posted by highlander
    - If you are an ENTP, what advice do you have for the INFJs?
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

  4. #14
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skinny-Love View Post


    The INFJ can be quick to judge. Just read the first few posts in this thread written by INFJ's.
    This sorta assumes the opinions expressed in the few few posts is based on only a few experiences, doesn't it? (I'm actually asking- it seems to me like you're assuming there isn't a whole lot of experience behind the opinions expressed, so I'm asking if/why it appears that way to you.)

    eta: @Skinny-Love Okay, yeah, you're right- they do say that. I have been here a few years, I know they've both been in (or followed) heated forum discussions with a few of the ENTPs here- I suspected their comments were likely products of years worth of forum interaction (which is experience, of sorts). But yeah, they do say that. (Sorry.)

    I was in an 8 year long relationship with an ENTP. It was exhausting- I couldn't begin to match the energy for debating every single tiny little thing, as if every single aspect of reality were up for debate. The value in stopping to notice what's actually going on in any given situation- instead of compulsively trying to posit/argue what one wants to be case- was a real blind spot for this person. This isn't to say it's a blind spot in every ENTP- that every ENTP has a problem with relentlessly and compulsively dictating reality to those around him/her, with little or no regard for how much distress it causes (they handle the complaint with yet more arguing about how it 'shouldn't' cause distress)- but I've encountered it enough to say it's a thing that happens with ENTPs. (Just like there are issues that come up in dealing with INFJs and only INFJs.)

    INFJ's bring up issues right away in a calm manner; knee jerk reactions are not appreciated.
    I do think it's important for INFJs to cultivate the ability to know what they're attaching to incoming information- to parse out what we're actually seeing from the assumptions we make about what it means. At the same though, my experience of ENPs is that they almost never believe the fastest we can express issues is the fastest we can express issues. It seems like an unfortunate default in ENPs (and even some INPs) to start dispatching insults and accusations (to nudge INFJs into expressing things faster when dialogue isn't happening fast enough- instead of believing that it truly is a challenge for INFJs to know how to express what they sense is 'off'), just like it's an unfortunate default in INFJs to withdraw and try to sort it out privately when something seems 'off'. I mean, I get the impression that Ne doms (and some aux) really just don't believe how difficult it is- and react with anger, which only ultimately makes it infinitely more difficult.


    INFJ's don't withdraw when you feel hurt; communicate your feelings and trust the ENTP to work through them with you.
    Something I have gleaned (from my own experience, but also from conversations in this forum)- is that once that downward spiral of 'pressuring the INFJ to go at a faster pace, and shaming them for the best they can do' has started, it just keeps going downhill. It's a vicious cycle that just feeds on itself. The ENP cranks up the volume on the nudging (as if the INFJ isn't going faster because they didn't hear it), and that volume increase further erodes trust in the INFJ that the ENTP is capable of helping them work through their feelings.

    ***

    [There are questions in the op that I wanted to get to at some point- but I'm not sure I will, so I'll just post this for now.]
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari
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  5. #15
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    This sorta assumes the opinions expressed in the few few posts is based on only a few experiences, doesn't it? (I'm actually asking- it seems to me like you're assuming there isn't a whole lot of experience behind the opinions expressed, so I'm asking if/why it appears that way to you.)

    I was in an 8 year long relationship with an ENTP. It was exhausting- I couldn't begin to match the energy for debating every single tiny little thing, as if every single aspect of reality were up for debate. The value in stopping to notice what's actually going on in any given situation- instead of compulsively trying to posit/argue what one wants to be case- was a real blind spot for this person. This isn't to say it's a blind spot in every ENTP- that every ENTP has a problem with relentlessly and compulsively dictating reality to those around him/her, with little or no regard for how much distress it causes (they handle the complaint with yet more arguing about how it 'shouldn't' cause distress)- but I've encountered it enough to say it's a thing that happens with ENTPs. (Just like there are issues that come up in dealing with INFJs and only INFJs.)



    I do think it's important for INFJs to cultivate the ability to know what they're attaching to incoming information- to parse out what we're actually seeing from the assumptions we make about what it means. At the same though, my experience of ENPs is that they almost never believe the fastest we can express issues is the fastest we can express issues. It seems like an unfortunate default in ENPs (and even some INPs) to start dispatching insults and accusations (to nudge INFJs into expressing things faster when dialogue isn't happening fast enough- instead of believing that it truly is a challenge for INFJs to know how to express what they sense is 'off'), just like it's an unfortunate default in INFJs to withdraw and try to sort it out privately when something seems 'off'. I mean, I get the impression that Ne doms (and some aux) really just don't believe how difficult it is- and react with anger, which only ultimately makes it infinitely more difficult.




    Something I have gleaned (from my own experience, but also from conversations in this forum)- is that once that downward spiral of 'pressuring the INFJ to go at a faster pace, and shaming them for the best they can do' has started, it just keeps going downhill. It's a vicious cycle that just feeds on itself. The ENP cranks up the volume on the nudging (as if the INFJ isn't going faster because they didn't hear it), and that volume increase further erodes trust in the INFJ that the ENTP is capable of helping them work through their feelings.

    ***

    [There are questions in the op that I wanted to get to at some point- but I'm not sure I will, so I'll just post this for now.]
    Trust and kindness collide with fear and control.
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

  6. #16
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Hey @Skinny-Love - I'm glad you said something. The thing here is, the question was whether INFJs and ENTPs would work well together romantically. I guess the comments do look like we're being disparaging, but I actually don't feel that way about ENTPs. I just know that as an INFJ, I want to know the very worst case scenario, so that I could plan for what to do. INFJs tend to almost want to walk through how things would be in their heads first before they'd consider embarking on anything.

    I have been friends with many of the ENTPs on the forum and appreciate their unique perspective. I also do find myself fascinated and interested by the ENTP approach to life. However, I also know that romantically, when I let people in, they have access to my very innermost self. While I might connect well as friends with ENTPs, the very thing that makes them interesting to me (their willingness to explore, their risk-taking, their outspokenness) because I am not that way, is the same thing that could make it very difficult to successfully put our two lives together, even though I could appreciate those qualities in a big way and even benefit from knowing someone who could temper me.

    Don't know if that makes any sense, but I guess what I'm trying to say is that for me, at least, this is more about looking at how successful the combination would be, rather than whether or not ENTPs are decent folks. I would also be the first to say that INFJs aren't a great match for a lot of types. It's not that the match couldn't work, but I think it would take a lot of bending in a way that doesn't come naturally and most people don't like to feel either like they are on shaky ground or that they have to walk on eggshells when they are at home with the person they have chosen to spend their lives with. I like knowing what to expect. I find ENTP spontaneity and living by their wits charming, because I am not spontaneous and I'm bad at improvising on the spot, but I would find the Ne dom shifts discombobulating and upsetting if I were in a partnership together, just as they may find my cautiousness and need for stability stifling.
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  7. #17
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    The recurring theme underpinning romantic success seems to be how much each individual is up for having their comfort zone disturbed, unafraid of being challenged/challenge themselves versus preferring a bigger sense of control and mental conformity with someone low key in regard to their belief system and values.

    Typology is but a very loose indicator of potential individual demeanor with poor correlation for growth and emotional intelligence.

    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.
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  8. #18
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phobik View Post
    The recurring theme underpinning romantic success seems to be how much each individual is up for having their comfort zone disturbed, unafraid of being challenged/challenge themselves versus preferring a bigger sense of control and mental conformity with someone low key in regard to their belief system and values.

    Typology is but a very loose indicator of potential individual demeanor with poor correlation for growth and emotional intelligence.
    That is a good point. I do believe that it is possible for any "type" to potentially pair with any other type. I strongly believe that if any two people are both willing to work on a relationship, it can work, regardless of type. Still, I suppose that part of the purpose of this thread is to show both possible points of connections and possible pit-falls. I don't want you to think that I think ENTPs are a-holes. I don't think that. I don't know enough of them to think that.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14
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  9. #19
    Don't pet me. JAVO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ene View Post
    @JAVO is an ENTP and he seems very sane and a lot more low-key than the one I know in real life, and so, maybe the superintendent I know isn't a good representative of the type or maybe he is.
    Thanks. I think unbalanced people of any type are difficult. It sounds like the person you're referring to might be unbalanced, but it could also be a symptom of being in an authoritative position--something which not only affects him directly, but also his perceptions of those he supervises as well as the perceptions of the ones who are underneath him on the organization chart.
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  10. #20
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    For me, it's not ENTPs, it's any extrovert... unless they are perfectly fine with staying in cuddling and having tea and conversation and then more cuddles. I have the energy to go out about twice a week (and a grocery run counts as part of that).
    4w5 sp/sx EII

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