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  1. #81
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    3: The clothes need to make him look good -- figure-flattering, compensating for his perceived physical flaws. They need to be not just appropriate for the occasion, but they have to make him look fantastic, at all times. (He's vain.)
    sx: He needs to look attractive. He needs to look sexy, and magnetic, and stunning.
    sp: All his clothes have to be very practical, even if that sacrifices aesthetic appeal. He's willing to have tacky shoes or tacky jackets so long as they're inexpensive and/or comfortable.

    Standard Dress-To-Impress outfits:



    (but with looser pants than the left hand side guy)

    ...So, the reason why I brought up this example is because he doesn't want to look unusual/odd/bizarre -- he doesn't want to be oddly unique, but he wants to look as good as possible, by our societal standards. Note, though, that it's about showing himself off, not the clothes.
    Yeah, I've also noticed that 3's like to dress-to-impress. For instance, whenever I see a woman dressed like these ladies, I instantly think 3w4 or at least 3w4 fixed....







    sp: All his clothes have to be very practical, even if that sacrifices aesthetic appeal. He's willing to have tacky shoes or tacky jackets so long as they're inexpensive and/or comfortable.
    Yeah I'm definitely not like that. I don't want to hold back with my style of dress. I just don't want my outfits to be too far out there, because I don't want to look like a clown.
    @skylights

    This is true. The way we present ourselves can have a significant effect on others. I think I often try to harmonize into the environment because when I'm blended (though still very "me"), people accept me as an insider more quickly, and that facilitates my own goals. I actually tend to overdress a little most days, for one because I like fancier clothing, but also because it means I can transition so easily from situation to situation. No one really cares when you're overdressed, it seems, they just might tease you for being fancy, but you won't come off badly. It just looks like maybe you care a little too much. And it's damn convenient when you discover you need to go talk to the dean, present to an executive, go to a nice lunch, or even when you run into your significant other's family. It makes things flow, and it doesn't take anything away from me, because I still wear whatever I want, just a little tailored to the situation, just like I would tailor to meet the weather. It's a completely worthwhile use of resources in my eyes. And sometimes I do choose to go totally against the grain, which can be really fun.

    Probably surprisingly for an sp-last, I'm also a sucker for comfort. In general, unless it's comfy, I don't wear it.
    I personally could give less of a damn if I harmonize with the group. In fact, I've been told by many that I tend to stick out from a group like a sore thumb and I like it that way. However, I also agree with EJCC and I also dress many times to achieve goals. For instance, when I used to be a door-to-door salesman and was selling sports memorabilia I would dress in very business casual clothes everyday and occasionally I would dress with a sports jersey of the team who's product I was trying to sell. I would never do this because I was trying to "fit the social standard" and harmonize, but I just did it to make more money.

  2. #82
    So she did. small.wonder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Who cares if it's a generalization. If you wanna be THAT detail oriented, then MBTI and enneagram would basically not exist. The systems are based on generalizations.
    I was merely making an observation. Everything after my first sentence was expanding on why I DO fit the stereotype, sheesh.
    Find my Enneagram writing here. Also, I'd love for you to take my six question Enneagram surveyEnneagram survey!✨

  3. #83
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Yeah, I've also noticed that 3's like to dress-to-impress. For instance, whenever I see a woman dressed like these ladies, I instantly think 3w4 or at least 3w4 fixed....
    Yeah, I've got a 3 fix and I'm similar. I'm all about the pseudo-Western boho thing until a special occasion comes around, and then I go from my previous examples to something more like this:

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Yeah I'm definitely not like that. I don't want to hold back with my style of dress. I just don't want my outfits to be too far out there, because I don't want to look like a clown.
    Well, I don't think my friend would describe it as "holding back" -- he usually picks the best looking practical shoes he can find. It's more like: "I have to look great, without being in physical pain at the end of the day". I'm sp-last and much more tolerant of painful shoes than he is. (Though I object to high heels on principle.)
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    I personally could give less of a damn if I harmonize with the group. In fact, I've been told by many that I tend to stick out from a group like a sore thumb and I like it that way. However, I also agree with EJCC and I also dress many times to achieve goals. For instance, when I used to be a door-to-door salesman and was selling sports memorabilia I would dress in very business casual clothes everyday and occasionally I would dress with a sports jersey of the team who's product I was trying to sell. I would never do this because I was trying to "fit the social standard" and harmonize, but I just did it to make more money.
    I'm nitpicking a bit here, but it's not always about fitting the social standard -- it's more like fitting a social standard. Whichever social standard you like better. I think @Stansmith is the one who posted that so-doms like to emulate particular looks, instead of coming up with "out there"/oddball clothing combinations.

    In my case, I was probably one of very few people at my university who dressed in my particular style, but 1) my style was not outlandish; 2) I liked my style better than theirs, and 3) I wished there were more people on campus who sent the same message with their clothes as I did.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
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  4. #84
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    Yeah, I've got a 3 fix and I'm similar. I'm all about the pseudo-Western boho thing until a special occasion comes around, and then I go from my previous examples to something more like this:
    When I dress up I go all out. I wear stuff like this...







    Then, when I don't wanna dress up, I will wear something like this...







    Well, I don't think my friend would describe it as "holding back" -- he usually picks the best looking practical shoes he can find. It's more like: "I have to look great, without being in physical pain at the end of the day". I'm sp-last and much more tolerant of painful shoes than he is. (Though I object to high heels on principle.)
    Yeah, there's a lot of uncomfortable things that won't wear as well. For instance, I am very reluctant to wear wood-bottom dress shoes. I hate these, because they hurt my feet.

    However, when I say that I don't hold back, I mean that I want my clothes to be as loud as possible and attract as much attention as humanly possible.

    I'm nitpicking a bit here, but it's not always about fitting the social standard -- it's more like fitting a social standard. Whichever social standard you like better. I think Stansmith is the one who posted that so-doms like to emulate particular looks, instead of coming up with "out there"/oddball clothing combinations.

    In my case, I was probably one of very few people at my university who dressed in my particular style, but 1) my style was not outlandish; 2) I liked my style better than theirs, and 3) I wished there were
    But why try to fit a social standard? Why not have your own sense of personal swag?

  5. #85
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    But why try to fit a social standard? Why not have your own sense of personal swag?
    I feel like it IS my own sense of personal swag. I just borrowed a lot of ideas in the process!

    It's kind of like: "This look appeals to me, I like the message it's sending to the world, that message resonates with me". Like there's a language of fashion that I'm trying to speak to society. Can't figure out how to say it any less pretentiously.

    (There's also an element of people-pleasing in there. I don't want looks of disapproval from passersby!)
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  6. #86
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I feel like it IS my own sense of personal swag. I just borrowed a lot of ideas in the process!

    It's kind of like: "This look appeals to me, I like the message it's sending to the world, that message resonates with me". Like there's a language of fashion that I'm trying to speak to society. Can't figure out how to say it any less pretentiously.

    (There's also an element of people-pleasing in there. I don't want looks of disapproval from passersby!)
    Then who would you borrow your ideas from? Also what type of message do you want to send to the world?

  7. #87
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Then who would you borrow your ideas from?
    Whoever I want to emulate. Whoever's found a better way to emulate that message than I have. I'm constantly looking for ways to improve my personal style.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Also what type of message do you want to send to the world?
    (Warning: my answer is probably going to speak more to other typology elements than just the social instinct -- and may in fact only speak for me)

    I'd say, a combination of "who I am" and "who I need to be". Hence the abrupt switch between work style, casual style, and eveningwear. Some people can make that transition very smoothly -- for example, people who buy ALL their clothing from a store like Express, that sells clothing for all occasions that can be mixed and matched -- but I am not one of those people.

    My "look" today: Purple cotton tank top with ruffle at the top; straight-leg jeans; leather moccasins; hair side parted and in a side braid; necklace with wood pendant; two vine-shaped rings and assorted bracelets in wood, fake leather, and beads; blue and gray nail polish (gray on ring fingers, blue on the rest)

    Stories behind the look: Tank and jeans were on sale and I liked them as basic items to build on; found pictures on Pinterest of the side braid and thought it would look great with my highlights and curly hair texture; got the leather mocs back at home in the Rockies and really wanted to showcase some Western flair back on the east coast; got most of the rings and bracelets for cheap and for the sole purpose of combining; pendant came from a friend who studied abroad in Ecuador; loved that nail polish trend and have also been trying to keep myself from chewing my nails

    Overall intent: Vaguely rock/Western/bohemian/artsy (not hipster, but artsy). Not sloppy, but put together. Creative, interesting, "cool". Approachable, someone to look up to, but also someone to go to concerts with. Someone to talk to about music and art and all the creative and interesting things you like. Independent but without a "fuck you" attitude. Someone capable and responsible -- if they can put themselves together so (seemingly) effortlessly but also in an interesting way, maybe that's how they approach most other things in life.

    It's also worth noting that my general "disciplines" (in school and presumably in work) are not very artistic. So it's more important to me to express that in other ways. If I dressed boring-professional every day, I'd feel like my artistic expression was being suffocated.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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  8. #88
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    Whoever I want to emulate. Whoever's found a better way to emulate that message than I have. I'm constantly looking for ways to improve my personal style.
    But who gives you these ideas as to what "so and so person" is supposed to look like? Television, movies, magazines, etc? Essentially what I'm seeing that you are doing is engaging in a sense of "style synthesis" per say. You are taking your own personal sense of style and combining it with an interesting social trend to create a brand new style. lol, and this is basically what I said that so/sx types do in the beginning of the thread. In addition, you tend to cater your style to fit the social schema. So in other words, you will wear one thing at rock concerts and this at dinner parties, and that at your university.

  9. #89
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    But who gives you these ideas as to what "so and so person" is supposed to look like? Television, movies, magazines, etc?
    Or people I'm friends with, or acquaintances, or random people I see on the street, or photos on Pinterest... inspiration usually strikes unexpectedly, though always from people I would describe as "cool", from my first impression of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Essentially what I'm seeing that you are doing is engaging in a sense of "style synthesis" per say. You are taking your own personal sense of style and combining it with an interesting social trend to create a brand new style. lol, and this is basically what I said that so/sx types do in the beginning of the thread. In addition, you tend to cater your style to fit the social schema. So in other words, you will wear one thing at rock concerts and this at dinner parties, and that at your university.
    Yep! And, like I said initially, it's a pretty huge contrast with sx-dom style ideas. From what we've talked about*, typical sx style would aim to impress in a very sx way: i.e. impressing individual people, or looking to attract the sorts of individuals that they could have a great one-on-one connection with. (including, but not limited to, potential SOs/sex partners.) Whereas so style would aim to impress large swaths of people, attract large groups, and generally look great to the groups that matter.

    Right?

    *though obviously this entire thread is excluding people who don't give a shit about their appearance. And those people could be of any instinct.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  10. #90
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    Or people I'm friends with, or acquaintances, or random people I see on the street, or photos on Pinterest... inspiration usually strikes unexpectedly, though always from people I would describe as "cool", from my first impression of them.
    So it almost seems as though the method that you use to create your style is a combination of Te and the social instinct.
    Yep! And, like I said initially, it's a pretty huge contrast with sx-dom style ideas. From what we've talked about*, typical sx style would aim to impress in a very sx way: i.e. impressing individual people, or looking to attract the sorts of individuals that they could have a great one-on-one connection with. (including, but not limited to, potential SOs/sex partners.) Whereas so style would aim to impress large swaths of people, attract large groups, and generally look great to the groups that matter.

    Right?
    I'm not really sure if a person with strong SO would aim to impress lots of people. Good question. I know that when I dress, I do it for reasons or personal expression and also to basically catch the eyes of several people at once. However it seems like people that are SO last tend to consider themselves and their personal sense of uniqueness in mind and disregard what others will think entirely.

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