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  1. #1
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Default Understanding the social variant in it's entirety

    I am trying to fully understand the social variant because I am confused as to what my variants are. From my understanding, the social variant involves the needing to belong to something larger than yourself, the ability to understand social webs very easily (i.e., this person knows this person, that knows this person, that knows this person), the need for social prestige, they like to know what's going in their community, they like to keep up with the news, the need to create social connections, and often times they enjoy socializing. Does this about sum it up?

    Also, I am very confused as to how the social variant compares to the 3w2 fix. It seems like a lot of aspects of the social variant could be confused with a 3w2 fix, could it not? Especially, when it comes to the need for social prestige.

  2. #2
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    I am trying to fully understand the social variant because I am confused as to what my variants are. From my understanding, the social variant involves the needing to belong to something larger than yourself, the ability to understand social webs very easily (i.e., this person knows this person, that knows this person, that knows this person), the need for social prestige, they like to know what's going in their community, they like to keep up with the news, the need to create social connections, and often times they enjoy socializing. Does this about sum it up?
    I think they might also be more likely to be diplomatic for the sake of maintaining group harmony, preserving the dynamics of the group as they currently stand, and keeping their established place within the group. And if something does end up disrupting the group, they might end up being pretty good at either defusing the conflict, or working around it for the benefit of themselves and others they care about. Social strategy, I guess.

    I'm guessing plenty of So-doms don't really care about being part of "the group", but even if they don't, they probably have a pretty good instinctual understanding of who's friends with whom, the group's relationship/power dynamics, etc -- even when looking from the outside in.

    I dunno. Other people could probably explain it better.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Also, I am very confused as to how the social variant compares to the 3w2 fix. It seems like a lot of aspects of the social variant could be confused with a 3w2 fix, could it not? Especially, when it comes to the need for social prestige.
    It's not really about prestige unless you have a 3 fix, as far as I can tell. It's about having a place in the community, regardless of what kind of place it is. It's about knowing where you stand within the group.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
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  3. #3
    jump sleuthiness's Avatar
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    Moreso projections than needs or even demands.

    As an e5 rover cactus, I'll actively scan through situations and engage engage engage because it distracts me from thinking, which lends some credence to your e3 observation, but I genuinely enjoy learning subtle nuances that creep in long after. I've always romanticized smiling- says so much with NO effort whatsoever, knowing how easily an interaction can snowball into ~sa~3$()-) )#R*_J u- YEAH, the freedom it imbues and inspires you to explore.

    thinking of you

  4. #4
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I think they might also be more likely to be diplomatic for the sake of maintaining group harmony, preserving the dynamics of the group as they currently stand, and keeping their established place within the group. And if something does end up disrupting the group, they might end up being pretty good at either defusing the conflict, or working around it for the benefit of themselves and others they care about. Social strategy, I guess.

    I'm guessing plenty of So-doms don't really care about being part of "the group", but even if they don't, they probably have a pretty good instinctual understanding of who's friends with whom, the group's relationship/power dynamics, etc -- even when looking from the outside in.

    I dunno. Other people could probably explain it better.

    It's not really about prestige unless you have a 3 fix, as far as I can tell. It's about having a place in the community, regardless of what kind of place it is. It's about knowing where you stand within the group.
    This is a pretty good summary of it all.

    As for "prestige", I think 3s tend to emphasise the standard view of it (financial or career based success), whereas other types would have a different spin on the idea (which at first glance, may not even seem to be about "prestige" at all).

    Being a 4 So, I'm interested in creative prestige: discerning which people have it, those who should have (IMO), and which people are able to perceive who has it. So for example, I'm a film buff and like following which films are doing well at the box office, getting good reviews, winning awards etc. Note: this doesn't mean I kowtow to success and blindly agree with the general opinion on films. I'm just interested in what people are talking about and how they are responding as a whole; noting and assessing broad trends, undercurrents and the general consensus. I might be persuaded to go see a film if it wins lots of awards and/or gets really good reviews, but it doesn't determine my actual preferences at all. I have not the slightest problem with disagreeing with the general consensus; I just like to know about it regardless

    A Social-first of another enneatype might have a completely different focus.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  5. #5
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I think they might also be more likely to be diplomatic for the sake of maintaining group harmony, preserving the dynamics of the group as they currently stand, and keeping their established place within the group. And if something does end up disrupting the group, they might end up being pretty good at either defusing the conflict, or working around it for the benefit of themselves and others they care about. Social strategy, I guess.

    I'm guessing plenty of So-doms don't really care about being part of "the group", but even if they don't, they probably have a pretty good instinctual understanding of who's friends with whom, the group's relationship/power dynamics, etc -- even when looking from the outside in.

    I dunno. Other people could probably explain it better.

    It's not really about prestige unless you have a 3 fix, as far as I can tell. It's about having a place in the community, regardless of what kind of place it is. It's about knowing where you stand within the group.
    I really don't really give a damn about being a part of a group. Also, I noticed that you said that the SO first might be interested in preserving the traditions of the group, and I'm not really sure I agree with that. That really seems to be more of the SJ social doms to me. I will admit that I am not bad at understanding social webs though. In fact, that comes really easily to me. I will admit that I do want the prestige though. That is very important to me.

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    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    This is a pretty good summary of it all.

    As for "prestige", I think 3s tend to emphasise the standard view of it (financial or career based success), whereas other types would have a different spin on the idea (which at first glance, may not even seem to be about "prestige" at all).

    Being a 4 So, I'm interested in creative prestige: discerning which people have it, those who should have (IMO), and which people are able to perceive who has it. So for example, I'm a film buff and like following which films are doing well at the box office, getting good reviews, winning awards etc. Note: this doesn't mean I kowtow to success and blindly agree with the general opinion on films. I'm just interested in what people are talking about and how they are responding as a whole; noting and assessing broad trends, undercurrents and the general consensus. I might be persuaded to go see a film if it wins lots of awards and/or gets really good reviews, but it doesn't determine my actual preferences at all. I have not the slightest problem with disagreeing with the general consensus; I just like to know about it regardless

    A Social-first of another enneatype might have a completely different focus.
    Well, I seem to enjoy keeping up with what my friends and family are doing and what's going on in the community, but it's not really a necessity for me. I also enjoy keeping up with celebrity gossip. For instance, I constantly watch TMZ because I like to get the scoop.

  7. #7
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    This is a pretty good summary of it all.

    As for "prestige", I think 3s tend to emphasise the standard view of it (financial or career based success), whereas other types would have a different spin on the idea (which at first glance, may not even seem to be about "prestige" at all).

    Being a 4 So, I'm interested in creative prestige: discerning which people have it, those who should have (IMO), and which people are able to perceive who has it. So for example, I'm a film buff and like following which films are doing well at the box office, getting good reviews, winning awards etc. Note: this doesn't mean I kowtow to success and blindly agree with the general opinion on films. I'm just interested in what people are talking about and how they are responding as a whole; noting and assessing broad trends, undercurrents and the general consensus. I might be persuaded to go see a film if it wins lots of awards and/or gets really good reviews, but it doesn't determine my actual preferences at all. I have not the slightest problem with disagreeing with the general consensus; I just like to know about it regardless

    A Social-first of another enneatype might have a completely different focus.
    ^ Great post. I completely relate to your third (film) paragraph, actually, and I think the bolded can apply to an so-dom of any type (though maybe less frequently with SJs).
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    I really don't really give a damn about being a part of a group. Also, I noticed that you said that the SO first might be interested in preserving the traditions of the group, and I'm not really sure I agree with that. That really seems to be more of the SJ social doms to me. I will admit that I am not bad at understanding social webs though. In fact, that comes really easily to me. I will admit that I do want the prestige though. That is very important to me.
    I definitely did not say "traditions", nor did I mean "traditions" -- what I was referring to by "dynamics of the group" relates more to the nuances of everyone's relationships with one another. As for potential SJ bias that doesn't apply to non-SJs, note that Southern Kross, an INFP 4 so, agreed with my post.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    Well, I seem to enjoy keeping up with what my friends and family are doing and what's going on in the community, but it's not really a necessity for me. I also enjoy keeping up with celebrity gossip. For instance, I constantly watch TMZ because I like to get the scoop.
    Yeah, you don't sound so-first.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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  8. #8
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    Do I seem social second?

  9. #9
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    @EJCC

    Do I seem social second?
    I think so. The fact that you said that so-dom stuff is something you like, but don't feel like you 100% need, seems like a common approach for people to have towards their second instinct. (It's probably how I'd describe sx.) If you were so-last, I think you would completely disregard it -- either not noticing it at all, or demonizing it, or something along those lines. You might think of yourself as completely alienated from any group, because you wouldn't have any sort of instinctual knowledge of your place in the social world. (I've heard things like this from sp/sx and sx/sp folks I know on the forum.)

    Edit: You seem sx/so to me.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  10. #10
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I think so. The fact that you said that so-dom stuff is something you like, but don't feel like you 100% need, seems like a common approach for people to have towards their second instinct. (It's probably how I'd describe sx.) If you were so-last, I think you would completely disregard it -- either not noticing it at all, or demonizing it, or something along those lines. You might think of yourself as completely alienated from any group, because you wouldn't have any sort of instinctual knowledge of your place in the social world. (I've heard things like this from sp/sx and sx/sp folks I know on the forum.)
    Yeah, that's what I keep hearing. However, the real problem with me, is that I have no variant blind spot. Personally, I feel like none of my variants are neglected. I never really relate to the people that are sx last either. I have had several of them tell me that it's very difficult for them to get close to people and often times keep them at an arm's length. I can't do that at all. In fact, my problem is the fact that I get close to people extremely quickly. I literally can fall in love with a girl in a matter of 3 dates, and she is literally all that I ever think about. Plus, me and @Elfboy chat on the phone about relationships and whatnot constantly: we're like fucking teenage girls with that shit, lmao. I literally can not get one of my friends who is sexual last to do that with me.

    In addition, Riso-Hudson says that for sx second people, connecting with people is almost like you have a key and others have a socket, and you are just looking for the right key that you fit with. That's pretty much how it is for me.

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