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  1. #41
    Senior Member Vilku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
    How did you define your morals, to be able to assume whole groups of people evil or good?

    Are there circumstances in which you would overturn your label of evil for an individual with one of your forbidden stackings?
    sure, evil stacking labeled person can be moral and a moral stacking person can be productive, but it doesnt change the fact that in our true nature, moral stacking people will always have less potential for productivity than the other stacking group.
    healthiness is all about appreciating other peoples inferior function. its like the sore spot no one ever notices, but we desperately wish they did, and if you focus on doing that, youll have many friends. and also learn to appreciate your own inferior function, others wont find it stupid if you show them how cool it is.

    INTJ 4w3 Sp Sx. (i dont believe in tritype. i do believe in learning traits from others.)

    mistakes happen. expect them, and grow from them. look for them, and avoid them.

  2. #42
    Fair and Square Flatlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilku View Post
    sure, evil stacking labeled person can be moral and a moral stacking person can be productive, but it doesnt change the fact that in our true nature, moral stacking people will always have less potential for productivity than the other stacking group.
    Is the delineation between moral and evil defined by the potential for productivity?
    Thinking must serve the thinker.

  3. #43
    Senior Member Vilku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
    Is the delineation between moral and evil defined by the potential for productivity?
    i dont know what your saying, but the point is, sp so, so sx and sx sp belong to the moralistic group and the other three to the productive group.
    healthiness is all about appreciating other peoples inferior function. its like the sore spot no one ever notices, but we desperately wish they did, and if you focus on doing that, youll have many friends. and also learn to appreciate your own inferior function, others wont find it stupid if you show them how cool it is.

    INTJ 4w3 Sp Sx. (i dont believe in tritype. i do believe in learning traits from others.)

    mistakes happen. expect them, and grow from them. look for them, and avoid them.

  4. #44
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
    If you read Character and Neurosis (and if I'm recalling correctly, feel free to correct me if I'm not), Naranjo posits that types 1-4 are on the stereotypically feminine spectrum, and 5-8 on the stereotypically masculine, with 9 left out. Not to say there can't be masculinity in 1-4 and femininity in 5-8, because the whole concept works like a yin-yang, but still.. the idea is out there.

    I think he points to 2 and 4 as the most effeminate types out of 1-4. And I think 8 would be one of the most masculine of 5-8.
    Ahh thanks.

  5. #45
    Fair and Square Flatlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilku View Post
    i dont know what your saying, but the point is, sp so, so sx and sx sp belong to the moralistic group and the other three to the productive group.
    I'm asking you if productivity is the variable that defines the difference between moral and evil.
    Thinking must serve the thinker.

  6. #46
    Fair and Square Flatlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giggly View Post
    Ahh thanks.
    No problem.

    One thing I found interesting in that distinction, about 8 in particular, is that 8 has the soul child at 2, and the supposedly "masculine archetype" can also show up with a rather effeminate magnanimity. Talk about hidden elements of cultural assumptions.
    Thinking must serve the thinker.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Vilku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
    I'm asking you if productivity is the variable that defines the difference between moral and evil.
    i still dont understand what youre saying. those two are just qualities and each view their own quality as more important, and are ready to sacrifice the other in favour of their own.
    healthiness is all about appreciating other peoples inferior function. its like the sore spot no one ever notices, but we desperately wish they did, and if you focus on doing that, youll have many friends. and also learn to appreciate your own inferior function, others wont find it stupid if you show them how cool it is.

    INTJ 4w3 Sp Sx. (i dont believe in tritype. i do believe in learning traits from others.)

    mistakes happen. expect them, and grow from them. look for them, and avoid them.

  8. #48
    Fair and Square Flatlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilku View Post
    i still dont understand what youre saying. those two are just qualities and each view their own quality as more important, and are ready to sacrifice the other in favour of their own.
    If you picture a bar graph for productivity, you have one axis dedicated to it, and the other axis has two categories: moral vs. evil. Do the "moral" types exhibit less productivity than the "evil" types on the graph?

    That's the gist of what I was understanding of your viewpoint, anyway. If I'm correct, why do you think this is? How is productivity important to your understanding of morality and evil, what part does it have to play in the categorization of people?
    Thinking must serve the thinker.

  9. #49
    Senior Member Vilku's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatlander View Post
    If you picture a bar graph for productivity, you have one axis dedicated to it, and the other axis has two categories: moral vs. evil. Do the "moral" types exhibit less productivity than the "evil" types on the graph?

    That's the gist of what I was understanding of your viewpoint, anyway. If I'm correct, why do you think this is? How is productivity important to your understanding of morality and evil, what part does it have to play in the categorization of people?
    well.. each instinct category i mentioned both have a product they wish others abided, for moral instincts its their morality and productive instincts its productivity..

    its simple, they both just have a different preference they believe to be of more importance than the other ones product.
    healthiness is all about appreciating other peoples inferior function. its like the sore spot no one ever notices, but we desperately wish they did, and if you focus on doing that, youll have many friends. and also learn to appreciate your own inferior function, others wont find it stupid if you show them how cool it is.

    INTJ 4w3 Sp Sx. (i dont believe in tritype. i do believe in learning traits from others.)

    mistakes happen. expect them, and grow from them. look for them, and avoid them.

  10. #50
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilku View Post
    i just have noticed that even a very masculine type, entp,(male) was surprisingly feminine as i met one with 7w6 and so sx. although i dont know if it was just cause 7w6 too is the most feminine enneagram and so sx the most feminine instinct.
    but can there be remotely masculine so sx if T type and not enneagram 7w6, nine or four? although 7w8 too has that boyish childish gleam to them, although not feminine. 9w8 isnt really that feminine either, more like gayish. i just happen to have them all in my triad, am an F type, and so sx, but male? lucky me? =]
    i imagine a masculine so sx would be that grumpy soft eyed person with a soft side. maybe im now describing so sp? =|, sigh.
    like terrador of spyro:Attachment 9108 and Attachment 9109 (the green dragon)
    masculine So/Sx
    Osama Bin Laden: 1w9 So/Sx
    Martin Sheen: 1w2 So/Sx
    Bradley Cooper: 3w2 So/Sx
    Jack Nicholson: 7w8 So/Sx
    Snoop Dogg: 7w8 So/Sx
    Michael Douglas: 8w7 So/Sx
    Charlton Heston: 8w9 So/Sx
    Ronald Reagan: 9w8 So/Sx
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
    ENFP
    5w4>1w9>2w1 Sx/Sp
    SEE-Fi
    Papa Bear
    Motivation: Dark Worker
    Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
    Chibi Seme
    MTG Color: black/red
    Male Archtype: King/Lover
    Sunburst!
    "You are a gay version of Gambit" Speed Gavroche
    "I wish that I could be affected by any hate, but I can't, cuz I just get affected by the bank" Chamillionaire

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