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  1. #11
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i think sx types are the most competitive. i think they desire the most, are the most greedy, and the most wanting. in german philosophy the word for the will is "wollen," which means want. sx is strong-willed bc it WANTS. this energy creates a lot of pull, desire, etc. sx/so are more addictive, all-in, completely going after whatever they want. we are caught between the desire to do so and the tendency to withdraw, to need solitude in order to dissolve and come back new, freed from the constraints of the world and what feel like arbitrary and frustrating and disappointing and pointlessly threatening negativities around us. that oscillation i think tends to create a really big light/dark shift, rather than building our own social world into a more healthy system that can support us and our desires, we flirt with the desire to withdraw completely, become less participatory, and less committed to life. escaping life, but using that escape to regenerate life or our idea of life from the ground up, anonymously. the last part might be too specific, or incorporating too much e5 or infjness into the mix. i'm not sure.

    sx types are impatient. i'm not sure if sx/so or sx/sp deal with this better. i'd like some examples of balancing sx/sp energies in a healthy way, using it for good. it's too easy to crave peaks and spikes and just create this gigantic tidal waves that after they crest pull us under. kind of romanticizing that.

    i think there are obvious challenges with becoming more open, developing consistency (derived from increased patience), and dealing with the drudgery of long-termish projects, relationships, goals, careers, etc.
    I think this is very accurate. I relate to all of it. While I can't claim to have "mastered" how to properly balance the sx/sp energies (see the bolded sentence above), I believe that it behooves us to find ways to embrace this push/pull, rather than trying to "fight through it" and be someone who we are not. In other words, instead of trying to create a false temperament within ourselves, it's probably better for us to work with our given temperament. Go with the grain, rather than constantly trying to go against the grain of who we are. So, what does this mean for an sx/sp? I think it means that it's OK to withdraw sometimes. I think it's a crucial step for the sx/sp to come to the understanding that it's OK to do this. It's actually necessary in helping us to come back and be strong and effective in the public realm, and in "doing good" as you make mention of.

    I have learned that I'm not much good to others unless I've got mental energy. I do think that we are capable of pushing ourselves much further than we usually do (meaning we probably tend to retreat too soon, most of the time), but the point still stands. We must retreat (it's who we are) and then come back strong. Instead of being "effective" in society from 6am - 10pm every single day (like most ESTJ's with a work first mentality), I like to say that I'm effective in "fits and starts". For 1-day bursts. Or a 2 hour burst in the morning and then a 2 hour burst again later that night. I'm really in tune with my energy level and I'm learning to play off of that energy. When my mental energy is high and I have a lot of clarity, it's important to put that time to good use. When my vision is cloudy and I'm mentally overwhelmed, then it's time to retreat. I can still use this down time to work towards doing the things I want to do. I can plan things out, brainstorm, create (on paper), etc. Then, when the energy is back, I can go out and put those things into the real world.

    In regards to the tendency to withdraw altogether (and be less committed to life in general), it's important to decide what exactly it is we want in life. Not very long ago, my signature had the following quote by Ben Stein:

    "The indispensable first step to getting the things you want out of life is this: Decide what you want."

    It sounds so simple. But, once this step is hashed out and decided upon, then the vast number of ways that it can be accomplished opens up to us. If we never take this first step in deciding what it is we want, then how can we ever move towards accomplishing it? Or how can we use our high energy times and our low energy times toward that end, if we don't even know what that end is?

    I loved your post. It describes my experience as an sx/sp very well. You described it like a wave. A high time and then a "crash" so to speak. I think it behooves us to accept that fact. It is a wave. And we should learn to use those waves (our up and down energy) to our advantage. Think about if you are in the ocean and waves are coming at you (if you've ever done that). If you try to fight the waves, they get the best of you - every time. If you try to go against them, you lose. It's futile. But, once the light bulb goes on and you realize that you can ride the waves - the power provided by those short bursts can be used to propel you forward - the whole game changes. It becomes fun, it becomes enjoyable, and you learn to make progress. It's still a challenge and you'll still take some hits, but you get better with experience.

    Where this all ties in together, is that you say we "WANT". It's a powerful want that we have. So, once we "decide what we want" (as Ben Stein says), then it's just a matter of using the waves of our changing energies to move forward toward that want.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  2. #12
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i'd like some examples of balancing sx/sp energies in a healthy way, using it for good. it's too easy to crave peaks and spikes and just create this gigantic tidal waves that after they crest pull us under. kind of romanticizing that.
    I think sx/sp does well when it uses the two areas to temper each other. This only happens when a person moves from self-absorption to other-centeredness. SX used for the sake of the other is not just craving information from other people (something to take) but is willing to give. SP used for the sake of the other is not just about preserving one's own boundaries to create a safe space for self but to create boundaries to prevent the self from intruding on others. Put another way, SP's tendency to hoard (space, time, resources) is countered by the SX drive to give and connect; the tendency of SX to absorb and swallow others and penetrate them to the core can be tempered by the SP awarenes of boundaries.

    The two can hold each other in balance. And even if you momentarily see a need to give rein to ONE of them (for good cause), you can still keep a decent grip on it so it doesn't go to an extreme. A healthy Ego can mediate the ID impulses.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #13
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I think sx/sp does well when it uses the two areas to temper each other. This only happens when a person moves from self-absorption to other-centeredness. SX used for the sake of the other is not just craving information from other people (something to take) but is willing to give. SP used for the sake of the other is not just about preserving one's own boundaries to create a safe space for self but to create boundaries to prevent the self from intruding on others. Put another way, SP's tendency to hoard (space, time, resources) is countered by the SX drive to give and connect; the tendency of SX to absorb and swallow others and penetrate them to the core can be tempered by the SP awarenes of boundaries.
    you see sp as the need for boundaries, and the skill of sp as an awareness of boundaries? boundaries give people more privacy, more space for solitude?

    you see sp as naturally hoarding? i associated that more with e5 in general.

  4. #14
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    you see sp as the need for boundaries, and the skill of sp as an awareness of boundaries? boundaries give people more privacy, more space for solitude?

    you see sp as naturally hoarding? i associated that more with e5 in general.
    I think this is where a lot of confusion comes from. I myself have a very hard time distinguishing e5 from sp instinct.



  5. #15
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=the state i am in;1195545]you see sp as the need for boundaries, and the skill of sp as an awareness of boundaries? boundaries give people more privacy, more space for solitude?

    you see sp as naturally hoarding? i associated that more with e5 in general.
    Hmm, maybe I did muddy things a bit... but we need to look at the variants as what they are: A marker for the degree of human contact an individual needs and desires.

    SX desires intimacy one-on-one and as deep as one can go; SO likes many and broad (so the relationships are much more about networking and breadth than necessarily very personal and deep); SP tends to focus on autonomy and keeping relationships with others under tighter control and only focusing on a few people or maybe even just one's relationship with oneself. The nature of SX relationships is that they are unbounded... typically the SX wants to drill as deep as possible. SO does have some boundaries but sees a need for interrelatedness and strength/comfort in having those social connections. SP very often can seem to detach from relationships, it's where you find the completely withdrawn/non-connected extreme as well as just the self-protective and wary.

    So yes, I consider SP to be the most "boundary" oriented of the three. And hoarding? Well, it's called "self-preservation" for a reason, correct? I mean, it's part of the name!
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #16
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    My experiences with my own sx/sp balancing act have been really difficult. As state said, sx wants and desires. For me, sp and being a 9 says "you don't really need that, everything will be fine if you don't have that." Then my sx will continue wanting it. If I get it, then my sp will be mad at me. If I don't, my sx will be mad at me (metaphorically). So either way I feel bad about making some decisions until I just forget about it. In this case it's about wanting things. I go through all of the loops, do I want this? Will this just be a waste of money? Will my well being be hurt because I may not have the money to get something I need later? Blah blah blah blah. And then like I said, depending on which side I give in to, I feel bad anyway.

    I associate sp with boundaries as well. It's like having an inner knowing of how far I should go, what to do and what not to do, etc. This is apart of why I ended the last relaionship I was in. The two of us were just using each other, and sx was loving it. But it got to a point where sp (and 9) stepped in and said "okay that's enough, you don't need to get too close and cause unnecessary conflict." I create boundaries for myself in all areas of life.

    But I thought that boundary making was an instinctive triad thing? Maybe that's a different kind of boundary.

    I'm not particularly affected by the opinions of anybody except for those I've "let in" exactly as the description in the OP says. I'm not really interested in these people at all in general either.

    The social instinct is a constant struggle for me.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  7. #17
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTPness View Post
    I loved your post. It describes my experience as an sx/sp very well. You described it like a wave. A high time and then a "crash" so to speak. I think it behooves us to accept that fact. It is a wave. And we should learn to use those waves (our up and down energy) to our advantage. Think about if you are in the ocean and waves are coming at you (if you've ever done that). If you try to fight the waves, they get the best of you - every time. If you try to go against them, you lose. It's futile. But, once the light bulb goes on and you realize that you can ride the waves - the power provided by those short bursts can be used to propel you forward - the whole game changes. It becomes fun, it becomes enjoyable, and you learn to make progress. It's still a challenge and you'll still take some hits, but you get better with experience.
    part of me wants to not have the crash at all, but i hear what you are saying. i've seen people who schism from this and become schizotypal, manic depressive cycle. recognizing the come down and rather than fighting it and getting in a kind of addiction cycle, nourishing yourself and replenishing yourself and feeling ok about what you get done/do for yourself when not at peak--i think this is really well thought-out and really helpful for me personally. the game analogy is great! a very healthy way to envision yourself and your own operations within the space of your life. acceptance of yourself, your limitations, your life opportunities, etc makes life flow much more smoothly.

  8. #18
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    sx/sp - you are your own personal cock block...
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

    INFP, 6w7, IEI

    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

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  9. #19
    Senior Member INTPness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by runvardh View Post
    sx/sp - you are your own personal cock block...

    LOL. Yeah, something like that.
    NTJ's are the only types that have ever made me feel emo.
    ENP's are the only types that have ever made me feel like a sensor.


    There are two great days in a person's life - the day we are born and the day we discover why. --William Barclay

  10. #20
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    its hard bein sx

    especially when you're surrounded by non-sx people

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