User Tag List

First 23456 Last

Results 31 to 40 of 129

  1. #31
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    I basically agree with you, but I believe that a person and people in general must act as if they have free will even if they don't. In other words, if I go around with the philosophy "I/they couldn't help it" then I think I will have a more negative effect on them. I would like to spread memes/beliefs that are encouraging.

    Then again, I know people have limits, and I have had to grapple with my own recently. It seems to me like a lose-lose situation. If you tell people they have free will and are responsible for what almost amounts to bad luck, it will give them inferiority complexes, or tell people nothing is their fault ever and have them become lazy and entitled. Maybe I'm at fault for believing that, though, hell.

    All I'm saying is, I want to spread the belief that walking up staircases is an easy thing I think more people should do. I see people at the mall for instance, almost all of them using the escalator when there is a perfectly good staircase right there next to it. Is it my business what these people want to do? Yes, it is. I have to look at them every day, and it depresses me to see such apathy. I don't mind being the guy who has to wake people up. We need to look our best and be healthy. We need to stay fit. It's the right way to live. I think that's pretty much absolute, as in, if you don't think it, you're wrong no matter what you believe about your position.

    Again, however, I believe in a soft approach to this. I don't think it is effective to be mean about it or intimidate people into getting into shape or whatever. They have to believe in it, and I do think it is something to believe in, so I'll say as much. Bottom line, nobody is perfect (so I don't judge), whether it is our weight or whatever else, but that doesn't mean we should excuse everything.

    The x-factor in all of this, though, is the body language of taking an escalator vs. walking up stairs. Walking up stairs is almost undignified in our society, especially if you do it the efficient way. People don't want to look like they're in a hurry or are too obsessed with the nuts and bolts of physicality and efficiency when in public. I don't really understand that at all, so I take the stairs, and I skip them, because why would I take the staircase if I didn't want to look like I was exerting myself. I am not a patient person in these sorts of situations. Same in traffic.
    What you wrote about the stairs is absolutely true.

    During decades, people were encouraged, unfortunately to take the elevator instead of the stairs.

    But medical studies have shown that people who take the stairs, or who walk even only a mile a day (on a regular basis) are at a far lesser risk of becoming obese. Thus, in architecture, we have now what we call "active design": buildings that are purposefully designed to make people prefer to take the stairs rather than the elevator.

    For instance:



    Here is a recent project, the Cooper Union building, in New York (arch: Morphosis), and you can see how the architects have designed their stairs to attract people.

    ---

    And in urbanism it's the same: to fight obesity pandemics, our master plans now focus on how to make cities "walkable", how to encourage people to walk or take public transports rather their own private car.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  2. #32
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    The US subsidizes corn like it's running a feed lot, which doesn't help, IMO.
    Absolutely. Corn syrup (glucose syrup) is one of the main culprit behind the current obesity epidemics. And you can find corn syrup in almost every junk food processed within the United States.

    So one of the biggest issue is also political, because you can say that somehow, your government is subsidizing obesity because of its powerful food industry lobby.
    We have similar issues here with the European commission subsidizing many powerful agro-food companies, even when they endanger the health of their clients. The greed of these companies is almost limitless, unfortunately.

    Bless be Monsanto and Nestlé!
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  3. #33
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    8,028

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    (...)



    Having "good" or "bad" genes is, in the case of obesity, most of the time a legend, unless you're a Pacific Islander or very unlucky.
    It's a legend purposefully designed to make obese people feel better, but it's a legend nonetheless. Some scientists deperately try to find evidences supporting this legend (because it's true some cases of diabete have, indeed, a genetic cause), but for the vast majority of obese people (between 80 to 90%), the most obvious reason why they're obese is bad nutritional habits and a very sedentary lifestyle.
    This is too simplistic a view.

    The number of fat cells are created during childhood for both subcutaneous and visceral fat. This number remains constant during adulthood. When people lose weight, their fat cells deflate but remain constant in number.

    What researchers have found is that 75% of obese children grow up to be obese adults where only 10% of healthy weight children mature into obese adults. Refer to previous paragraph for part of the explanation, as well as poor eating styles. This disregards other health considerations that impact on obesity, including mental health issues that require medication which might also impact on weight gain.

    Also, not every person has identical genetics when it comes to production of testosterone and T3/T4 levels. These hormone levels impact on caloric metabolic burn rates.

    Anyways, just a few considerations that should have impact on your perspective.

  4. #34
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by andante View Post
    This is too simplistic a view.

    The number of fat cells are created during childhood for both subcutaneous and visceral fat. This number remains constant during adulthood. When people lose weight, their fat cells deflate but remain constant in number.

    What researchers have found is that 75% of obese children grow up to be obese adults where only 10% of healthy weight children mature into obese adults. Refer to previous paragraph for part of the explanation, as well as poor eating styles. This disregards other health considerations that impact on obesity, including mental health issues that require medication which might also impact on weight gain.

    Also, not every person has identical genetics when it comes to production of testosterone and T3/T4 levels. These hormone levels impact on caloric metabolic burn rates.

    Anyways, just a few considerations that should have impact on your perspective.
    You can argue the way you want: I work with professional doctors on this issue, both in France and Europe. I know it's an authority argument, but I don't bother, I just want to make it short and stop this legend about "genetic predisposition to obesity", because this legend is actually doing more harm than relief to most people, and make them feel irresponsible. Basic metabolism seems to have little influence on our final weight, contrary to what we eat, drink, and how much we exercise. Most of the time, it's as simple as that, but yet the majority of obese people are often desperate to find a medical excuse to their condition. They eat too much, they eat junk food, and they don't exercise enough. Yet it's the last thing they want to hear.

    If the majority of the cases of morbid obesity were inherited, then why is the percentage of obese people rising with every new decade?
    Just be rational.

    What has changed is:

    -Our diet
    -Our lifestyle

    And these are the main culprits of the current obesity pandemics. If you target these two factors, then you can stop the epidemy: it works.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  5. #35
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    9w1
    Socionics
    INFj None
    Posts
    9,827

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    You can argue the way you want: I work with professional doctors on this issue, both in France and Europe. I know it's an authority argument, but I don't bother, I just want to make it short and stop this legend about "genetic predisposition to obesity", because this legend is actually doing more harm than relief to most people, and make them feel irresponsible.

    If the majority of the cases of morbid obesity were inherited, then why is the percentage of obese people rising with every new decade?
    Just be rational.

    What has changed is:

    -Our diet
    -Our lifestyle

    And these are the main culprits of the current obesity pandemics. If you target these two factors, then you can stop the epidemy: it works.
    I think the default is to gain weight in 'ideal' conditions because food has historically been insecure. A few of us have a different setting and do not become obese in the same conditions. Probably kind of a disadvantage under historically normal circumstances, but a bit of a golden ticket now.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  6. #36
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    8,028

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    You can argue the way you want: I work with professional doctors on this issue, both in France and Europe. I know it's an authority argument, but I don't bother, I just want to make it short and stop this legend about "genetic predisposition to obesity", because this legend is actually doing more harm than relief to most people, and make them feel irresponsible.

    If the majority of the cases of morbid obesity were inherited, then why is the percentage of obese people rising with every new decade?
    Just be rational.

    What has changed is:

    -Our diet
    -Our lifestyle

    And these are the main culprit of the current obesity pandemics. If you target these two factors, then you can stop the epidemy: it works.
    Are these the same doctors who believe that animal fats are bad? If so, they need refresher courses in their understanding of the human body and its interaction with food.

    As far as diet and lifestyle are concerned, I do agree that these help. But they're only components of the overall problem when it comes to obesity.

    Understand something. I'm not pro-obesity but I am anti-shaming, particularly when it comes from young males who are producing 10 - 20 times more testosterone than women.

  7. #37
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by andante View Post
    Are these the same doctors who believe that animal fats are bad? If so, they need refresher courses in their understanding of the human body and its interaction with food.

    As far as diet and lifestyle are concerned, I do agree that these help. But they're only components of the overall problem when it comes to obesity.

    Understand something. I'm not pro-obesity but I am anti-shaming, particularly when it comes from young males who are producing 10 - 20 times more testosterone than women.
    Once again, basic metabolism has little influence on our weight. Once again, it's a legend, so unless you're talking of very specific cases, it's not a question of hormones. Unless, of course, we are talking of leptin, the hormone that regulates our appetite. Leptin levels are, indeed, very important, even if their effects are indirect.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  8. #38
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I think the default is to gain weight in 'ideal' conditions because food has historically been insecure. A few of us have a different setting and do not become obese in the same conditions. Probably kind of a disadvantage under historically normal circumstances, but a bit of a golden ticket now.
    No. Unless you're talking of Pacific Islanders who can inherit diabete very easily because their ancestors have often faced starvation, and have been "naturally selected" accordingly.

    But for the vast majority of people, the way you can get weight (or not) is absolutely the same.

    If your diet is based solely on pizzas and sugary drinks, and if you sit all day long in your chair (at work or in your car), chances are you will gain weight. In the majority of cases, there's no need to find a subtler explaination.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  9. #39
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    8,028

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    Once again, basic metabolism has little influence on our weight. Once again, it's a legend, so unless you're talking of very specific cases, it's not a question of hormones. Unless, of course, we are talking of leptin, the hormone that regulates our appetite. Leptin levels are, indeed, very important, even if their effects are indirect.
    Yes, clearly, thyroxine has no impact on metabolic rate and hypo and hyperthyrodism are both myths.

    Are you suggesting that testosterone doesn't help to increase energy burn, whether directly or indirectly?

  10. #40
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Posts
    2,934

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by andante View Post
    Yes, clearly, thyroxine has no impact on metabolic rate and hypo and hyperthyrodism are both myths.
    Hypo or Hyperthyroidism prevalence is something like 0.2 to 2% according to countries.

    Once again, you're refering only to very specific or isolated cases, while I'm refering to the vast majority of the people who are obese.

    Are you suggesting that testosterone doesn't help to increase energy burn, whether directly or indirectly?
    I'm just saying that according to most medical studies, only leptin seems to have a HUGE effect on the prevalence of obesity. Basic metabolism, on the other hand, doesn't seem to have such a noticeable effect, contrary to most legends.

    As a side note, most junk food seems to deregulate normal leptin levels, hence the curious sensations of people who often go to fast food restaurants. A regular dose of daily exercise, on the other hand, not only helps to burn calories but also helps you to regulate leptin production once again.
    This is why it's important to walk every day (at least one mile per day) and take the stairs everytime you can, while exercising only during the week end is in fact not that beneficial...
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

Similar Threads

  1. Why is it wrong to oppress people?
    By Journey in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 04-14-2008, 01:29 PM
  2. Why is it so hard to not feed the trolls?
    By Zergling in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 11-15-2007, 05:23 AM
  3. Why is this so funny?
    By proteanmix in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 10-25-2007, 11:16 AM
  4. WHY can't I become someone else? Why is it not possible to really change?
    By mysavior in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 10-22-2007, 02:40 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO