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  1. #141
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    I can guarantee you that there is nothing you can say about the health risks of my size that I don't already know. It's not an awareness problem. On the contrary it's impossible to forget and informs literally every other part of my life. I have a lot of shame connected to it and it complicates several of my relationships in different ways.

    I had sort of a breakthrough a while back when I realized that the things that my size telegraphs to the world (and to me) are just not true. I'm not lazy- I work my ass off in every other area of life. I'm a devoted mother and my coworkers seem to think I'm good at my job, productive and talented. Why would I believe that about myself because of one thing, my physical size? Why should anyone else believe it about me? To me, that's fat acceptance- don't assume things about people's character or personality because of their size. Engage them as you do anyone else. Don't shame them if they have the audacity to ask you out on a date. (You don't have to say yes but it's not an insult to have been asked out by a fatty.)

  2. #142
    / nonsequitur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I can guarantee you that there is nothing you can say about the health risks of my size that I don't already know. It's not an awareness problem. On the contrary it's impossible to forget and informs literally every other part of my life. I have a lot of shame connected to it and it complicates several of my relationships in different ways.

    I had sort of a breakthrough a while back when I realized that the things that my size telegraphs to the world (and to me) are just not true. I'm not lazy- I work my ass off in every other area of life. I'm a devoted mother and my coworkers seem to think I'm good at my job, productive and talented. Why would I believe that about myself because of one thing, my physical size? Why should anyone else believe it about me? To me, that's fat acceptance- don't assume things about people's character or personality because of their size. Engage them as you do anyone else. Don't shame them if they have the audacity to ask you out on a date. (You don't have to say yes but it's not an insult to have been asked out by a fatty.)
    Ivy, weight doesn't define you, and you definitely shouldn't let it make you feel embarrassed either. I know that there are loads of people who feel embarrassed about going to the gym, working out and eating because of their weight. I think that the shame is part of the inertia that makes up why people don't take action about it.. so it may be a good idea to look out for groups of people who - more than losing weight - are aiming to become fitter, healthier and happier. Losing weight will happen naturally, in baby steps along the way, and stick on a permanent basis. More than making it about the weight and looks, please look at it as "a lifestyle change to make myself happier and have more energy in the long run". The main thing is that being active actually makes people happier and able to do more with their lives, participate more with the people they care about and be a stronger support to the people around them.

  3. #143
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    I would never shame anyone about their weight and cringe when other people do this.

  4. #144
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I've concluded that serious issues with being overweight are almost never really about weight. If they were, I think it is socially difficult enough, and inconvenient enough that people would happily change their lifestyle (in the cases that it is indeed lifestyle related). Everyone knows the health benefits. They understand how other people look at them. They also experience the physical downsides of being heavy every day. They already have incredible amounts of shame.

    What makes it more complicated to deal with are much deeper issues, some of which may be painful to look at and stem back to childhood, some of which are patterns of adult relationships which are difficult to change, or personal ways of relating to other people which allow for a kind of protection.

    Rather than going after the symptoms, you have to get to the root of the problem before anything really is going to change for good and that is much more difficult, especially if there have been years of needing psychological protection from looking directly at something very painful or if the situation causing the pain is ongoing.

    I fear the fat acceptance movement is a way of circumventing the need to address these issues so that the person can make progress in other areas of their life. On the other end of the spectrum are the people that look at someone fat and just reduce it down to them needing to bite the bullet and quit being lazy.

    With any lifestyle decisions that are problematic, there are enough benefits to outweigh the negatives for the person to continue in the way that they have been. Until that part get unravelled and the person finds better ways to address their needs with something else instead, change their situation or change the way they view the situation, nothing changes permanently.

    Usually these changes take a lot of support from other people, and involve totally restructuring the current way of living. In many cases, it's not only the person themselves, but those around them that feel panicky when the old familiar way of living, eating or even relating starts to change, even if they profess to be supportive or that they want change for the person's sake. It takes a lot of assertiveness and perseverance for the person themselves to not only do something that is difficult for them, but to stand up for themselves (usually after years of accommodating and then just dealing with the emotional fallout with food) and believe that they really deserve the time, the change or the consideration it will require for them to get into better shape.

    When the adjustments to people's way of relating to those close to them, time pressures or ways of dealing with stress are made, weight loss is just a pleasant side effect, but those other changes are the real reward I believe, as they make life far more productive and joyful, and allow the person to meet their potential in many other areas as well.

  5. #145
    Don't pet me. JAVO's Avatar
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    @nonsequitur: Thanks for your insightful posts here. It's interesting how something which most of society oversimplifies actually has multiple potential causes and contributing factors.

  6. #146
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Fat acceptance is like many movements which start with some decent ideals but in practice it gets twisted & turned into something kind of ugly.

    I've seen too many fat acceptance promoters become "thin haters". It's like man-haters who call themselves feminists & don't really act in-line with the ideals of feminism. These fat acceptance people use the nature argument a lot & even seek to shame non-fat people (you must not eat enough, you're less of a man/woman, etc).

    I think backlash against fat acceptance is related to those attitudes as well as FEAR that unhealthy lifestyles, one thin people engage in also, will continue to get worse & damage future generations because the lifestyle & its consequences are accepted as "normal". The health & quality of life of children as they grow up seems a major concern for those against fat acceptance. I think this FEAR justifies shaming in their minds. Of course, shaming people rarely motivates them to change for the better in the long-run.

    I understand the idea behind the acceptance is you still have VALUE as a human being if you're fat, and this is important to someone dealing with the underlying causes. People who have a healthy self-esteem (not too high or low) tend to take better care of themselves. The other issue is blaming people for not changing habits which are promoted on a daily basis & ingrained into their culture. There can be a level of self-discipline needed that is almost unreasonably high, that requires a kind of alienation socially. It's crazy to me how much other people will try to sabotage others' diets/lifestyle changes... Losing weight can be a battle against OTHER people.

    FYI, I say all this as a thin person who has never been overweight or struggled with weight.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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  7. #147
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    I've seen some stupid people have the nerve to give unsolicited grocery advice to fat people in the store. "Oh, honey, you should get this! It's got half as much fat content as what you're planning on buying!"

    I can't believe how incredibly rude and busybody-like they have the nerve to be. If fat acceptance means making people like that STFU, then I'm all for it.

    That said, I don't buy into the "I only eat 1600 calories a day, do an hour of HIIT every day, and I'm still 300lbs" stuff. Some of those HAES people (it comes up on that crap xo Jane and some of the health forums) honestly get angry whenever anyone even suggests that either (1) weight loss is a good, attainable goal to strive for, or (2) that watching calories in/out is a method that works. That's taking things too far.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  8. #148
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  9. #149
    Intriguing.... Quinlan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by strawberries View Post
    why should society accept behaviours that result in a crippling burden on the health system?
    Because obesity isn't a behaviour?
    Act your age not your enneagram number.

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  10. #150
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    nevermind
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

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