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  1. #11
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    There is the question of why do women want to be beautiful?

    Do all women want to be beautiful?

    Well, some lesbians don't want to be beautiful.

    What does this mean?

    It means they don't want to be beautiful for men.

    And who can blame them, for being beautiful for men means mimicking arousal to arouse the man.

    And who wants that?

    Well, almost all straight women.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    What women are loath to admit is that they mimic arousal to actually arouse the male.

    This gives women the upper hand, as when men are aroused, they are susceptible to suggestion, while the woman remains fully awake and in command of herself and the situation.

    So female 'beauty', natural or not, is the mimicking of arousal for advantage.
    This is what I believe, and indeed out of all the women I've confronted about this, the only one who (reluctantly) admitted it as the truth was my own mother. Others claimed it just made them "more comfortable", "more feminine" and had nothing to do with seducing men. But to me they're just being delusional.

    I wouldn't say they do it to make males susceptible to suggestion, though. Instead, I see the process like this:

    - She wants to be with a male who's as attractive (protective, strong, whatever) as possible.
    - Attractive males know they're attractive, so they will only settle for attractive women.
    - So in order to get an attractive male, she has to be attractive herself.

    It sure makes sense. Whether an attractive person is more likely to make us happy on the long term, however, is an entirely different matter (one I don't agree with).


    The article is correct when claiming we want women to "be artificial, but not let it show". However I disagree with their solution of going all-out. The correct way to me is to ditch all artifices forever.
    It won't happen, though. Not when women can use artifices to look more attractive and still look natural. Much like guys won't stop hiding their emotions when it can make them appear to control the situation at all times (and therefore "stronger" and more attractive).

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nales View Post
    Whether an attractive person is more likely to make us happy on the long term

    Much like guys won't stop hiding their emotions when it can make them appear to control the situation at all times (and therefore "stronger" and more attractive.
    It is likely that the person who can make us happy in the long term is ourselves. Of course we hope to meet our soul mate who will make us happy - but I think it is best to take our happiness into our own hands and then share it.

    I have noticed that creativity comes from the nurturing of vulnerability. And so as creativity reaches higher status, women may find they are attracted more to creativity than strength and control.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nales View Post
    This is what I believe, and indeed out of all the women I've confronted about this, the only one who (reluctantly) admitted it as the truth was my own mother. Others claimed it just made them "more comfortable", "more feminine" and had nothing to do with seducing men. But to me they're just being delusional.

    I wouldn't say they do it to make males susceptible to suggestion, though. Instead, I see the process like this:

    - She wants to be with a male who's as attractive (protective, strong, whatever) as possible.
    - Attractive males know they're attractive, so they will only settle for attractive women.
    - So in order to get an attractive male, she has to be attractive herself.

    It sure makes sense. Whether an attractive person is more likely to make us happy on the long term, however, is an entirely different matter (one I don't agree with).


    The article is correct when claiming we want women to "be artificial, but not let it show". However I disagree with their solution of going all-out. The correct way to me is to ditch all artifices forever.
    It won't happen, though. Not when women can use artifices to look more attractive and still look natural. Much like guys won't stop hiding their emotions when it can make them appear to control the situation at all times (and therefore "stronger" and more attractive).
    I understand the whole "internalization" thing, but how can one tell when someone is doing something because they want it and when they're doing it because they feel ashamed of doing otherwise and are lying to themselves? I find that a relevant question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Conway View Post
    Its nice article on fake beauty but its not only related with only woman number of men also do this like they make your body with supplements.
    Mmm, reminds me of something I read a while ago on AlterNet about the new "brotox" trend...

    EDIT: Here it is:

    http://www.alternet.org/story/153765...auty_standards
    Last edited by Viridian; 02-18-2012 at 03:21 PM.
    Tentative typing: ISFJ 6w5 or 9w1 (Sp/S[?]).

  5. #15
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    I'm too lazy to read the article, but honestly I'm very pro fake beauty. for the most part, beauty to me is unnatural and, for the majority of their lives, I would consider most people extremely ugly
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  6. #16
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    screw all of it...i mean i enjoyed the article...or the 75% of it i read but really can't care less how people choose to present them self. overdone can be cool...not done at all can be cool...subtlety is cool too. i just reject the notion of there being one way that's acceptable...the do's and don'ts...i mean come on...the don'ts make life interesting.

    i don't do myself up all tacky like but that's my preference...i say let the tacky folk be tacky if they wanna.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  7. #17
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    It sounds like the 'Whole Foods'-ing of mainstream femininity. I loathe Whole Foods. Wearing $115 organic bamboo yoga pants by Lululemon does not make you a more conscious, spiritually advanced person. It's just another clique in the long history of mean self-esteem eroding high school cliques for girls.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

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  8. #18
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    I just realized I totally just skimmed that article. :P
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

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  9. #19
    my floof is luxury Wind Up Rex's Avatar
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    Traditionalist aesthetics always deals in oppressive universals. In fashion, nothing is intransigent, no beauty is transcendental, everything has a material existence and a social position: this month's hideous mistake can be next month's bold statement. Style and beauty are produced, discarded and reinvented with startling rapidity and, in such a climate, the very notion of the natural can be seen for what it really is: just another aesthetic category, its signs every bit as carefully fabricated as the most flamboyant artifice.

    It is this aspect of fashion and cosmetics, perhaps, that can put them in the service of transformative ideals. A radical aesthetic of the body would not coerce us to 'flatter' and flatten ourselves into a tasteful range of shapes and styles; it can provide, instead, a space to adorn them, to perform them and invent them and challenge what they signify.
    Interesting article. Beauty is as much science as it is an art. A person possessing some combination of clarity, symmetry, harmony, and vivid color is going to be considered attractive no matter what culture he or she comes from. What is the harm in using artifice to achieve what nature didn't give you? In defense of cosmetics, I ask the simple question: What's wrong with wanting to be beautiful?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    I understand the whole "internalization" thing, but how can one tell when someone is doing something because they want it and when they're doing it because they feel ashamed of doing otherwise and are lying to themselves? I find that a relevant question...
    I suppose the article’s answer is “Because the way we try to be beautiful has been imposed on us.” Yeah, well, no shit. We show we are beautiful to indicate attractiveness and self-care. There’s a language we speak, and you’re hard pressed to challenge the grammar of it. The desire to be attractive is an intrinsic one, but on a certain level it must kowtow to prevailing standards to be successful. This correspondence is not about shame, but simply being a functional human being. Ultimately, I agree with the posters who have suggested that the best way to “rail against” is to simply not play: do the au naturel thing to the hilt. Otherwise, you’ll inevitably bump into that grammar issue as you attempt to construct an outward statement that is “genuine”, but still readable as “beautiful”.
    And so long as you haven’t experienced this: to die and so to grow,
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  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    It sounds like the 'Whole Foods'-ing of mainstream femininity. I loathe Whole Foods. Wearing $115 organic bamboo yoga pants by Lululemon does not make you a more conscious, spiritually advanced person. It's just another clique in the long history of mean self-esteem eroding high school cliques for girls.
    Yes. My sister (INFJ) is a crunchy progressive, and makes veiled jabs at me for embracing what she terms "artifice." I use my appearance for self-expression and am pretty artsy with it, so I love playing with makeup, perfume, glitter and sparkle, temporary tattoos, nail art, potions and lotions, jewelry, piercings (just tongue and ears), and high contrast clothing colors made from "unnatural" fabrics (vs. natural and woodsy-colored stuff she wears.) I'm careful to use these subtly - I don't look like what others would term a freak show or clown. But the disdain is pretty easy to pick up on, and it comes from not looking "natural" in her opinion which equals attractive, and like I'm also contributing to my own oppression that I'm too stupid to realize is happening or something. (I think she's the one oppressing me.) Whatever.... I have more fun.

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