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  1. #11
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spirilis View Post
    I've personally found it to be a question of adaptation and time. I became occasionally faint/felt like crap for the first 3 months of Atkins dieting but now I can do exercise with no problem with a ratio like 5-65-30. I certainly thrive well in a sedentary lifestyle with that kind of ratio (5-65-30 or close). Much more clear-headed, none of the rollercoaster moods I'd get with a high-carb diet. I don't eat nearly as much either, and this shows up on my grocery costs at the end of the month.
    Well, I don't know, maybe you were eating like crap? Because I don't get any roller coaster mood with 40% carbs, either...

    anyway, it depends on the kind of exercise, I believe. I mostly cycle, lots of uphill, so the caloric expenditure is really high. During the winter, when I only go to the gym 3-4 times a week and/or run 30 miles, I do tend to cut my carbs and feel okay, yea.
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  2. #12
    Senior Membrane spirilis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Well, I don't know, maybe you were eating like crap? Because I don't get any roller coaster mood with 40% carbs, either...

    anyway, it depends on the kind of exercise, I believe. I mostly cycle, lots of uphill, so the caloric expenditure is really high. During the winter, when I only go to the gym 3-4 times a week and/or run 30 miles, I do tend to cut my carbs and feel okay, yea.
    I used to eat like crap (gratuitous bread and corn-based products, fruit juice and milk frequently, meat only occasionally, very few vegetables), up until the past few years, then it was I guess a "balanced" kind of mix; carbs in the form of bread or oats (whole-wheat bagels for breakfast or a bowl of oatmeal), protein in lean forms (fish or chicken), only fat was oils, had some fruits & vegetables with most meals (not breakfast though). Even after cleaning up the food choices though, I'd experience routine tiredness after my meals. I just kinda dealt with it.

    The "white flour" based products definitely hurt more than the whole wheat ones. A lot of these problems disappeared when I exercised daily or at least 4 times a week, definitely came back when I stopped. I've tried the gym routine and it's not for me, I am simply not someone who cares to exercise with regularity. I just don't see the benefit of it. Always thought weight loss was the benefit, but never got too far with that when I was trying. Now I see diet is the main lever for weight loss, not exercise.
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  3. #13
    morose bourgeoisie
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    I agree with FDG. Eliminating carbs will reduce your enjoyment of exercise considerably. You just can't go very long or very hard with nothing in your muscles.

  4. #14
    Senior Membrane spirilis's Avatar
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    Well it does seem that carbs' negative effects do go away with exercise (in my own experience as I mentioned above), and exercise should eliminate the need for the liver to produce fat out of the excess carbs (see the link I posted way above from Dr. Davis's heart scan blog) that supposedly trigger heart disease, so I can agree with the premise of using carbs with exercise. But for those of us who don't exercise, or don't do it all the time, I think it's worth considering low-carb.
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  5. #15
    Symbolic Herald Vasilisa's Avatar
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    more nutritionism.

    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    Starch (Carbs) Is the Devil! ... So is sugar!

    I have proof!
    Practitioners of nutritionsm (trend science, journalism and marketing) -as the new priesthood, telling you which component to demonize and sanctify this month/year only to have it change in the near future.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Pollan
    From Food Culture to Food Science. The last important change wrought by the Western diet is not, strictly speaking, ecological. But the industrialization of our food that we call the Western diet is systematically destroying traditional food cultures. Before the modern food era — and before nutritionism — people relied for guidance about what to eat on their national or ethnic or regional cultures. We think of culture as a set of beliefs and practices to help mediate our relationship to other people, but of course culture (at least before the rise of science) has also played a critical role in helping mediate people’s relationship to nature. Eating being a big part of that relationship, cultures have had a great deal to say about what and how and why and when and how much we should eat. Of course when it comes to food, culture is really just a fancy word for Mom, the figure who typically passes on the food ways of the group — food ways that, although they were never “designed” to optimize health (we have many reasons to eat the way we do), would not have endured if they did not keep eaters alive and well.

    The sheer novelty and glamour of the Western diet, with its 17,000 new food products introduced every year, and the marketing muscle used to sell these products, has overwhelmed the force of tradition and left us where we now find ourselves: relying on science and journalism and marketing to help us decide questions about what to eat. Nutritionism, which arose to help us better deal with the problems of the Western diet, has largely been co-opted by it, used by the industry to sell more food and to undermine the authority of traditional ways of eating. You would not have read this far into this article if your food culture were intact and healthy; you would simply eat the way your parents and grandparents and great-grandparents taught you to eat. The question is, Are we better off with these new authorities than we were with the traditional authorities they supplanted? The answer by now should be clear.
    Last edited by Vasilisa; 12-14-2011 at 01:52 PM. Reason: excerpt
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  6. #16
    Klingon Warrior Princess Patches's Avatar
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    I stick to a very low carb (20-40g per day) diet. I try not to have cheater days at all, but when I get into stressful periods of time (like now - stupid school) I tend to go to carbs as comfort food.

    I notice when I start eating high-carb out of stress after strict periods of time without carbs... My whole body feels sluggish and tired. I don't sleep as well. My mood is noticeably worse. Now - I also tend to skimp on my gym schedule when I do that, so it's the combination of no gym+high carb. But I am really convinced that carbs do a number on both my physical health and my mood.
    “Everybody has a secret world inside of them. All of the people of the world, I mean everybody. No matter how dull and boring they are on the outside, inside
    them they've all got unimaginable, magnificent, wonderful, stupid, amazing worlds. Not just one world. Hundreds of them. Thousands maybe.” -Neil Gaiman

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  7. #17
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    I think when it comes to food.. people need a diet that they can stick to, whatever that is.

    For me, thinking about whats carbs or what's proteins is too much for me.. I don't want to THINK about food that much. I'd rather have a substitution diet where I can look at calorie counts and have that be enough for me.
    And in the Army, I don't get to choose what I eat. They have set meals.. so even if I decide carbs are bad--if carbs are given at dinner and I'm starving, I'm eating them. The MRE's are god-awful for you diet-wise, but they're food and energy in a package and people get hungry doing work.

    I think if you find something you can stick to at ALL, it's way better.. But I've never been a fan of swearing off an entire food group.
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  8. #18
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I feel worse when I go low carb, go figure. granted i try to eat whole wheat stuff and multi grain bread
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  9. #19
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patches View Post
    My whole body feels sluggish and tired. I don't sleep as well. My mood is noticeably worse.
    There is also a relatively high number of undiagnosed cases of insulin resistance out there. Had a glucose test recently?

  10. #20
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    This is definitely true for me. However, carbs aren't the devil here. Refined sugars are the devil.

    Veggies and fruit are necessary for nutrients and vitamins and minerals. Having carbs with fiber is what helps keep your blood sugar from spiking, so eating an orange is preferable to drinking orange juice, etc.

    For me, I notice the biggest change (not being bloated, losing weight at a steady clip) when I cut out refined sugars and wheat. (SIGH I LOVE BREAD.) What helps me the most is making sure I have enough protein. I did two cleanses this year that each lasted 2 weeks. The first four days you eat as low fat as possible, then seven days of eating just rice, and then three days of low fat again. The seven days of rice made me crazy until I started adding one piece of chicken a day, and then I was fine. I also discovered that I have food allergies that I never knew about (dairy being one).

    I think everyone's bodies are a little bit different so everyone should try and figure out what balance works best for them.

    A great place to start is this book, Food Rules. It's a short little book with loads of common sense snippets on how to choose foods.

    A few of my favorite "rules" are "Eat what stands on one leg (plants) over what stands on two legs (chicken, fowl, humans) over what stands on four legs (beef, pork, etc)." And another one was "Eat like a king at breakfast, a prince at lunch, and a pauper at dinner." And, "Don't eat cereal that changes the color of your milk."

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